jerry grays extension

[JAMIEBUF12]

Just a little curious. How do you tbd'ers feel about Jerry Grays contract extension today?I wonder why we did that so early in the year.Are we afraid of losing him?I would have liked to see him with a season with no Dick Lebeau or Greg Williams watching over him.I personally don't think he is that good,but I am only a fan and I don't really know the x's and o's like I think I do!It just seems to me that this team never really stops people on 3rd down and I don't count the Dolphin game because their defense is pathetic.Well since he is signed I hope he is alot better than I think he is. go Bills

[Bill from NYC]

I will preface my response by stating that I pay WAY more attention to the offensive blocking than I do to the defense, however boring this may seem.

 

That said, I do not like what I have seen of Gray. WAY too many 3rd and long conversions, and enough talent to work with where I see no excuse.

[Buckner's Glove]

It's a good signing if only for the fact that a successful defensive system remains intact with him running that side of the ball. I thinks some of the 3rd down problems will fix themselves with the return of Milloy and eventually Vincent. Locking Gray up now will also send a message to guys like Sam Adams that Gray will be in Buffalo just as long as any of the players, so the players had better listen to him. The timing is probably motivated in part by fat Sam's outburst during the Miami game.

[IDBillzFan]

The timing is probably motivated in part by fat Sam's outburst during the Miami game.

80016[/snapback]

Very interesting. I'm not sure if I totally subscribe to that theory, but what I can subscribe to is that a contract for a defensive coordinator, relative to some of the contracts being fed to players, is one that I believe the Bills can easily pay off if they decide they made a mistake. The issue becomes individual judgement of exactly whether a mistake was made and how long you are willing to wait before you admit it and fix it.

 

That said, we may have some problems on 3rd and long...and we absolutely do...but I think you should ALWAYS be able to win a game when your opponent is held to 13 points. If you can't put 14 points on the board in four full quarters, then I'd be willing to wait until our offense CAN do that before I start standing in full judgement of Gray.

[nodnarb]

i'm ambivalent. it's good for continuity's sake, but i'm not sure JG is a great strategist, and I believe you have to have a great strategist to go the distance. JG still has a lot to prove, imo. You can always tell how good a strategist your D coordinator (or head coach, depending on the dynamic) by looking at the opposing QB's rating at the end of the game. Look at what Belichick does to QBs. Over the last 3 years, he has collected the most devastating QB average. Even great QBs like Manning do poorly against him. If you play the Pats and your QB has a rating of 85 or better, you're in the upper eschelon.

 

Gray needs to show that he understands how to attack teams individually. We don't see a lot of different looks from team to team, but we have a lot of good players. I'd like to see a situation where we don't even recognize our own D because the formations are so unusual. (As long as it works). Teams that are doing this more include the Jets, Seahawks, Eagles, Texans, and Titans, from what I've seen.

[JCBoston]

That said, we may have some problems on 3rd and long...and we absolutely do...but I think you should ALWAYS be able to win a game when your opponent is held to 13 points. If you can't put 14 points on the board in four full quarters, then I'd be willing to wait until our offense CAN do that before I start standing in full judgement of Gray.

80028[/snapback]

 

Absolutely. This is why I refused to blame the D for any of our losses this year, with the possible exception of the NE game. Flat out -- if you can't score 14 - or 21 - points yourself, you don't deserve to win in this league.

 

If we were losing games by scores like 38-31 or 42-35, then we could talk about the defense. Don't get me wrong - they've had their moments - but overall, if your defense gives up 13 points, you ought to win. We'd be 3-1 right now if that were the case.

[AJ1]

Like we're afraid of losing him? We should be so lucky.

[San-O]

Why ANY 1 - 4 team would go out of their way to sign this contract

mid-season is beyond me.

 

???

 

Bills have among the worst 3rd down defensive efficiency in the league.

[Fla Bills Fan]

The biggest problem I have with the D is late game collapse. They let other teams pull out a W at the last min. Other teams converting 3rd & long is also a problem.

[San-O]

This is a B.S. move by TD to make people think we have something

going on.

[Rico]

Meh.

[Fake-Fat Sunny]

I say this for Jerry Gray:

 

1. He proved to me last year that he was no Gregg Williams clone by the way he took to running a totally different D with the responsibility he took for learning and implementing the zone blits. Rather than being a GW clone (actually not a bad clone to be if defense is your only responsibility as offense, game feel and control, and selection and management of his co-ordinators were his issue and few credibly argue that he is not a good DC) Gray has shown the ability with the right players to run the GW style and the radicallt different LeBeau style.

2. Make no mistake he proved he could understand and effectively implement the LeBeau D last year when he retained the DC job and called D schems and plays during the game. One cannot do this effectively unless you understand the zone blitz. LeBeau actually is on record saying that he wanted the gameday job and that both of them sticking around would be difficult for the Bills. For a variety of reasons (age, ability to reach/teach the players, and the NFL's policies to reverse the league's past racial discrimination are among those I see) Gray beat out LeBeau and it looks like a good choice to me.

3. For those worried about strategy, I think execution is the greater Bill worry. The TEAM has run correct D schemes to blunt the opponent in almost all the games in the last two years as the statistical numbers have been great and the points allowed has been outstanding. The problem is that the D is able to execute these plans for about 55 minutes and because our O generally has failed to score or control the ball like they finally did against Miami, the Ds failure to execute in the final 5 minutes or less has been fatal. Gray MAYBE can be faulted for this if you want to blame him for not motivating his players to make the extra effort needed because our O is so bad, game strategy is not his problem.

4. Adjustments have been one of the stronger parts of the Gray game. He and some of the players spoke glowingly of the changes (they can reasonably be called strategic) he made in the D during the bye week last year and it showed on the field as up until everything went south against NE in the final game, the D responded with even more productive play after the bye last year. One need look no further than last week's game to see the excellent impact of his tactical adjustments within games as our D let Sammy Morris and RAC do them in during the first half, but after halftime adjustments they held Miami to 34 yards net.

 

For all of these reasons I can see expanding the Gray contract to meet the time MM is in place. Unsder league policy, if he is offered a promotion (Assistant Head Coach or HC) see he can take it even if he is under contract. This signing takes him off the market for lateral moves in the NFL (big market teams can pay as much for DCs as we pay HCs) and HC jobs at the college level (which he has already gotten feelers for).

 

I think this is a good move.

[Bear]

For all of these reasons I can see expanding the Gray contract to meet the time MM is in place.

80134[/snapback]

 

I was thinking along similar lines. I really don't think this is a PR stunt or anything of the sort. MM is a new head coach that was given a DC from the prior regime. After an off-season, training camp, pre-season, and 6 weeks of a season MM probably told TD that he liked Grey and wanted him around. A deal was done. Simple as that.

 

Grey isn't my favorite coach in the world. I think he can do much better with the talent we have on the field. But, I also don't think he is that bad. Anyone we brought in after the season was over would be someone we would take a chance on. I would love to have a "great" DC, but at this point I am perfectly happy to accept one has proven to be above average, than to take a chance on a new with lots of potential.

 

The last thing this team needs is ANOTHER coaching/strategy change. And the last thing I need is to have to listen to another guy come in and say how much more aggressive we are going to be.

[BillnutinHouston]

The timing is probably motivated in part by fat Sam's outburst during the Miami game.

80016[/snapback]

 

Some of you apparently think that deals like Gray's are just sitting on the shelf ready for TD to pull the trigger on at just the right moment. I happen to think getting these logistics done is in most cases a bit more complicated than that.

 

Ya'all are reading too much into the timing.

[Buftex]

The jury is still out, for me, on Gray. I think it makes sense, in light of the Sam Adams outburst (in which he reportedly said he would never play for Gray again, or something silly like that), that Gray be given an extension, to keep him here as long as the contract that Mularkey and the rest of the coaches have.

 

If I am not mistaken, Gray was, in effect, a lame duck this season. Complain as much as we like about him, the defense has been decent to very good the last two years. Take that in to account, and the fact that Gray has been mentioned a few times as a college head coaching candidate the last two years. Down here in Austin, TX there are always rumblings that Mack Brown will be let go by Texas, and that Gray (a UT all-timer) could be in line for the job. UT losing to Oklahoma 12-0 does nothing to cement Brown's future here. Maybe TD wanted to make sure that he worked well with Mularkey before connecting the two together for another 3 or 4 seasons. Don't forget, a lot of TD's reputation rests on Mularkey's success.

 

One thing I noticed over training camp this past summer was that Takeo Spikes, Sam Adams, London Fletcher, Nate Clements and a few other defensive players in interviews, went out of their way to say how great it was to play for Dick LeBaue, not even mentioning Jerry Gray.

 

A couple issues back, in "Bills Digest" there was an interview with Sam Adams. The way I read it, it was very clear that he was less than happy with the what he was being asked to do by Gray. He complained that the coah doesn't ask the defensive line to produce a pash rush, only to stop the run. Adams went on to explain that should the coach (Gray) ask the D-line to produce a pass rush, he has no doubt that they could produce 60 or so sacks a year. But, he explained, they only do what the coach asks. If you listen to his interview from 10/20 on BuffaloBills.com, it also sounds to me, very clearly, that he is less than sincere in saying that what happened during the Dolphins game is behind him, and will be kept in the locker room. I am not sure if Adams is always as prickly in interviews, but he sounds to me like a guy with one foot out the door.

 

Players talk, you can bet that if Adams thinks that the D is being used improperly, there are other guys who agree with him. Pure speculation on my part, but the Gray extension sounds like an attempt by TD to let any unhappy Defensive players know that Gray is their boss, and will be in the future, if they plan on staying in Buffalo. Good move on TD's part, if you ask me. Plus, Gray seems fairly highly thought of by football people, I have to believe that some of them know a little more than us.

 

Still though, I wish they would have just given the D-coordinater job to Lebaue!

[JKinATX]

Before reading buftex's reply I was going to mention the UT/Mack Brown situation but seeing that he did I just want to add something. Last year he was courted for the DC position at UT and turned it down because he wanted to stay in the NFL.He has said that his ultimate goal is a head coaching job and I have heard is name mentioned in regards to the UT job in the event of Mack Brown's demise. This is all of course rumor and speculation but it's still out there.

With that being said I don't think TD's decision had so much to do with timing as it had to do with the fact that he had to do something and this is when it happened. Certainly better after a win than a loss but it would have happened around this time regardless. He's a busy guy with a list of things to do and this is when he got to that one on the list.

I don't dislike Gray but I would have liked to have kept Lebeau instead-experience being the main factor. I do think Gray is a guy that learns from his mistakes and makes changes accordingly(unlike GW), and what we've seen from him is only the beginning of a great carreer.

 

Now an aside to buftex- This is my 3rd football season in the Austin area and away from the Buffalo, I get very homesick listening to the postgame on NFL field pass and am wondering if there is a good place to watch a Bills game. I went to Rhino's and Jock's off 183 the first year out of desperation but haven't gone back.Do you know of any decent places to watch a Bills game?

[Dan III]

Now an aside to buftex- This is my 3rd football season in the Austin area and away from the Buffalo, I get very homesick listening to the postgame on NFL field pass and am wondering if there is a good place to watch a Bills game. I went to Rhino's and Jock's off 183 the first year out of desperation but haven't gone back.Do you know of any decent places to watch a Bills game?

80195[/snapback]

Try this: http://www.buffalobills.com/fans/BillsBackersBars.jsp

 

According to that it looks like there are two Bills Backers bars in Austin.

 

You could also try our Bills Backers forum: http://205.134.161.85/forums/index.php?showforum=5

 

If you post a note asking about Bills bars in the Backers forum I'm sure someone will get back to you soon.

 

Hope that helps.

[Happy Days Lois & Clark]

I think that Jerry Gray has done okay but could do better. The lack of turnovers and the problems with 3rd downs along with problems when the game is on the line are concerns.

 

 

Haslet couls be gone from New Orleans after the season & I wonder what he could do with the Bills defensive personnell

[Thailog80]

Im not very happy at all. The D has let big play after big play fry them. We hold a crappy Miami team down for 1/2 a game and give this guy an extension? No pass rush still but let's lock up JG? Maddening.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I think everyone takes Gray and the defense for granted.

 

1) People say, "They're only good because of Lebeau and Gregg Williams." But this is unfounded--how do you know this? I think TD is in a better position to know how much Gray contributes to the defense.

 

2) Others saying, "Why sign him? He won't get snatched up." I think that's wrong. He almost left to coach at U of Texas last season. He might leave for another lateral position if we're not committed to him. This shows we are committed to him.

 

3) Others saying, "This is a bad defense. We are bad on 3rd downs. We can't stop a game-winning drive, etc." Give me a break. You judge Gray's performance on basically two games. Two games we weren't good on third down and we didn't stop the opponent's GW drive. And one of those games, we didn't stop them because of mental mistakes (e.g., Clements not knocking down Leftwich's pass to Jimmy Smith)., not bad coaching.