Defensive line after Camp, then after suspended players return?

[BullBuchanan]

3 hours ago, Cash said:

 

Interesting take.  In this scenario, what do you see as the usual d-line rotation?  Especially at 1-tech DT.

I would see it like this:

Pre-Suspensions
Epenesa - Jones - Oliver - Rousseau - Early downs, high run probability, everyone fresh.
Bosa - Sanders - Oliver - Rousseau - Obvious passing downs/gotta have it stops.

Jackson is the 4th DE in, if Walker is ready to go and beats out Carter, he'll rotate in as the 4th DT, but I wouldn't expect to see a lot of him if everyone is healthy.

Once the suspensions end, a lot will come down to the performance of Jones. If he has struggled at all, expect Ogunjobi to get a real shot at his playing time crack at his playing time. If that were to happen, jones could be bumped back to a reserve role where he plays primarily on short yardage run downs where they could load up on big men. I expect Jackson to become a reserve at this point with Hoecht's return, unless his play demands that he leap Epenesa. Something like:

Hoecht - Jones - Ogunjobi - Rousseau and a 5th big man like Sanders/Walker could find their way in there.

I will expect Hoecht to play a significant role in the defense lining up at basically every position and doing so often. I wouldn't be shocked to see him as the first guy in at most spots except for Bosa on passing downs. Even though Bosa has been a capable run defender, If their smart, they won't waste him on that when they have younger healthier players that can do it.

So basically when everyone is healthy and back from suspension your group looks like
Epenesa - Ogunjobi- Oliver - Rousseau - Early downs, high run probability
Bosa - Hoecht/Sanders- Oliver/Hoecht - Rousseau - Obvious passing downs/gotta have it stops.

I imagine it'll be hard for Jackson or Walker to get a ton of playing time unless we move on from Epenesa/Jones or someone gets hurt. 

I wouldn't be surprised to see two of Walker, Jones, Ogunjobi inactive on gameday depending on performance because of the flexibility Hoecht gives. In case you haven't figured it out by now, i think the key to the whole defense is Hoecht. He gives us something we've only had very poor versions of over the years, and if he's just getting to his best ball now, it could be the piece that transforms the way our defense works.

[BigAl2526]

On 4/29/2025 at 7:42 AM, BuffaloBill said:

Logue will be cut

He won't make the 53 man squad, but I wouldn't rule out the PS again.  I don't know that we've heard anything about what the Bills might think of him. 

[BigAl2526]

At DT, Oliver, Sanders, Walker are locks and probably figure into the Bills' future beyond 2025.  Daquan Jones is a lock in my opinion to start the season.  More than likely he finishes the season with the Bills, but I don't know that it is a lock that he do so. Carter probably makes the team, but it's less certain he finishes the season with the team.  Logue is PS material.  He's got to show something to warrant more than that.  Ogunjobe's future with the team after his suspension probably depends on what DeWayne Carter can show at 1 tech.  Obviously, the intention of the Bills to try Carter out at 1 tech despite the fact he's underweight for the position indicates they probably aren't very happy with what he showed at 3 tech.  Since he is a bit undersized, I think, makes him a long shot to be in the long term plans of the Bills.  Using him at 1 tech sounds like a last chance to me.   So, here's my depth chart at DT for the Bills to start the season-

 

1 tech:

Daquan Jones - Deone Walker - Dewayne Carter

 

3 tech:

Ed Oliver - T J Sanders

 

Carter will also be available to take some snaps at 3 tech.  When Ogunjobe's suspension is over, he could essentially step in and fill Carter's role if Carter fails his 1 tech tryout.  If Carter is great in his new role, then maybe the Bills send Ogunjobe packing. 

 

At DE, Rousseau and Jackson are locks who figure into the Bills' long term plans.  Bosa is a lock this season, as long as he's healthy.  I think The Bills like Javon Solomon as a pass rusher, and he may get a few more opportunities to show what he can do.  I think Epenesa is safe to start the season.  He's dependable but not flashy.  The Bills would like more, but they aren't going to throw him away until they know they've got a potential upgrade.  When Hoecht comes off his suspension, things will get a bit muddy.  If Bosa is still healthy, he obvious owns a roster spot.  That leaves one or two roster spots for Epenesa, Solomon and Hoecht.  Hoecht has the body of a DT, but ran a 4.65 40 in the pre-draft process five years ago.  If Hoecht can give the Bills more than Steady Epe, I could easily se Buffalo parting ways with Epenesa, hopefully with a trade the nets Buffalo something in the process.  If the Bills feel like they can't part with Epenesa, they might end up cutting Solomon at that point, or of Both Solomon and Epenesa are showing enough, maybe Hoecht never gets a real shot at the team.   My depth chart for DE looks like this-

 

LDE:

Rousseau - Jackson - (Hoecht)

 

RDE:

Bosa - Epenesa - Solomon

 

If the Bills part ways with Epenesa after Hoecht is activated, I think the Bills might flip Jackson to RDE.  

[Redblood]

This could be a really good group after week 6

[BuffaloRebound]

Don’t these suspensions usually get appealed down from 6 games?  

[Redblood]

12 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Don’t these suspensions usually get appealed down from 6 games?  

Sometimes they get dropped to 4. 

6 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:

I would see it like this:

Pre-Suspensions
Epenesa - Jones - Oliver - Rousseau - Early downs, high run probability, everyone fresh.
Bosa - Sanders - Oliver - Rousseau - Obvious passing downs/gotta have it stops.

Jackson is the 4th DE in, if Walker is ready to go and beats out Carter, he'll rotate in as the 4th DT, but I wouldn't expect to see a lot of him if everyone is healthy.

Once the suspensions end, a lot will come down to the performance of Jones. If he has struggled at all, expect Ogunjobi to get a real shot at his playing time crack at his playing time. If that were to happen, jones could be bumped back to a reserve role where he plays primarily on short yardage run downs where they could load up on big men. I expect Jackson to become a reserve at this point with Hoecht's return, unless his play demands that he leap Epenesa. Something like:

Hoecht - Jones - Ogunjobi - Rousseau and a 5th big man like Sanders/Walker could find their way in there.

I will expect Hoecht to play a significant role in the defense lining up at basically every position and doing so often. I wouldn't be shocked to see him as the first guy in at most spots except for Bosa on passing downs. Even though Bosa has been a capable run defender, If their smart, they won't waste him on that when they have younger healthier players that can do it.

So basically when everyone is healthy and back from suspension your group looks like
Epenesa - Ogunjobi- Oliver - Rousseau - Early downs, high run probability
Bosa - Hoecht/Sanders- Oliver/Hoecht - Rousseau - Obvious passing downs/gotta have it stops.

I imagine it'll be hard for Jackson or Walker to get a ton of playing time unless we move on from Epenesa/Jones or someone gets hurt. 

I wouldn't be surprised to see two of Walker, Jones, Ogunjobi inactive on gameday depending on performance because of the flexibility Hoecht gives. In case you haven't figured it out by now, i think the key to the whole defense is Hoecht. He gives us something we've only had very poor versions of over the years, and if he's just getting to his best ball now, it could be the piece that transforms the way our defense works.

I pray we can avoid the injury bug

[Big Turk]

Really deep and really good...maybe the deepest line we have ever had 

[JP51]

On 4/29/2025 at 10:22 AM, Dunkirk Donski said:

My inside source expects big things from Mike Lodish this year

When I saw the Mike and the ish... I swear it was gonna read Mike Kadish... LOL 

15 hours ago, Big Turk said:

Really deep and really good...maybe the deepest line we have ever had 

I really wanted to drop a "thats what she..... " comment on there but I will refrain LOL 

[YattaOkasan]

16 hours ago, Redblood said:

Sometimes they get dropped to 4. 

I pray we can avoid the injury bug

I aint worried about injuries much.  Whole thread is trying to figure out what to do with all the players we have at this position.  Honestly besides QB we dont have much drop off from starter to backup.  CB or TE would probably be the biggest drop?

[Don Otreply]

Is there any way in hell that we can get our two FA Defensive guys suspensions reduced? 

[Warriorspikes51]

Find a legit 1T via cuts/trade

[BillsFanForever19]

2 hours ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Find a legit 1T via cuts/trade

 

We've got 5 already at DT that aren't going anywhere. 6 when Ogunjobi comes back. As it is, we may have to make room for him. We spent a Top 10 pick in both Rounds 2 and 4 at DT. Gave a Free Agent a 5.4m guaranteed. 

 

We have 1T set between Jones, the passing plays that Sanders will be lined up rushing next to Oliver on, Walker, Carter they'll be playing at both - even Ogunjobi has positional flexibility, starting at Nose in College and for the Bengals. AND Hoecht also plays all over the field and has been slid inside before.

 

What you seem to want is in direct conflict with what Beane wants and preaches. A giant, stays in the gap focusing on stopping the run, classic space eating, Ted Washington like Nose Tackle. That's antiquated in today's passing league. It's not how the team or Beane operates. The question was asked of Beane before and after he Drafted Walker and he emphasized that's not what he's looking for. He's looking for guys who can get upfield. Guys who are versatile and can play all over the line.

 

In Walker, you've got the best of both worlds. A 330+ mammoth that can also get upfield on running plays. In Sanders, you've got someone you can put next to Oliver on obvious passing downs and wreak havoc up the middle. This will keep Jones off the field more than last year and hopefully keep him fresh and playing at his best. 

 

Defensive Tackle is set. And the focus is pass rush. There won't be any more "legit" additions there.

Edited 13 hours ago by BillsFanForever19

[Richard Noggin]

The 53-man roster allotment will ultimately be at least 10, won't it? Has that been emphasized already?

 

It's been 10 recently even without such a targeted effort to add to the groups. Gotta imagine it's at least 9 to start the season, with the knowledge that 2 more will be joining week 7. Maybe the first 6 weeks the Bills carry an extra WR or DB or OL instead of a 10th DL. Either way, they get to keep a couple dudes who might not otherwise survive cutdown day and would have been candidates for poaching. By week 7, injuries and other developments could provide longer term standing for the DL and other guy on the roster who the suspended guys would otherwise replace. Sneaky advantage to suspensions LOL: baked in 7 week roster buffer waivers for 2 guys on the bubble. 

[BillsFanForever19]

11 minutes ago, Richard Noggin said:

The 53-man roster allotment will ultimately be at least 10, won't it? Has that been emphasized already?

 

It's been 10 recently even without such a targeted effort to add to the groups. Gotta imagine it's at least 9 to start the season, with the knowledge that 2 more will be joining week 7. Maybe the first 6 weeks the Bills carry an extra WR or DB or OL instead of a 10th DL. Either way, they get to keep a couple dudes who might not otherwise survive cutdown day and would have been candidates for poaching. By week 7, injuries and other developments could provide longer term standing for the DL and other guy on the roster who the suspended guys would otherwise replace. Sneaky advantage to suspensions LOL: baked in 7 week roster buffer waivers for 2 guys on the bubble. 

 

It will be at least 10. We carry at least 5 at each position. At times we've carried 6 at both.

 

Ending the season last year, we had 5 DE's (Groot, Miller, Epenesa, Smoot, and Solomon) and 6 DT's (Oliver, Jones, Johnson, Carter, Jefferson, and Phillips). 

 

It's pretty clear that everyone can easily stick for now - as we're at 5 DE's (Groot, Bosa, Epenesa, Jackson, and Solomon) and 5 DT's (Oliver, Jones, Sanders, Walker, and Carter).

 

Worry about finding room for Hoecht and Epenesa when Week 7 comes around. You could easily have injuries in the first 6 weeks that could make that decision simple. Even though I'd much rather prefer difficult decisions to be made. Either way, it's nothing that they should be worrying about at the moment.