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Chiefs are just better than the Bills


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52 minutes ago, SaulGoodman said:

I couldn’t care less what Bengals fans are doing.  


Yet you care a heck of a lot what Bills fans think, kickin’ it here with us less than 2 weeks after your team won the Super Bowl. So yeah I assume you do care a lot about what Bengals fans think. 
 

By the way, when my favorite baseball team, the Yankees were winning World Series, I gotta admit my first thought wasn’t, “I wonder what the fans on the Red Sox and Orioles forums think.” And that is probably because, once again, I enjoyed the victory and didn’t have any need to rub it in the faces of the conquered teams, nor did I have a Rodney Dangerfield type obsession with the “respect” my team got. But hey, you do you Odenkirk.

Edited by Jim
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30 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

The sentence that you quoted me on (Not beating them in the playoffs doesn't mean we're not better) was NOT mine. 

 

Not sure how or why you did this.


Apologies.

 

meant for ‘Buffalo03’.

 

This happens when you clip a smaller quote from someone’s response- it becomes theirs, rather than the original.

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9 hours ago, Jim said:


Yet you care a heck of a lot what Bills fans think, kickin’ it here with us less than 2 weeks after your team won the Super Bowl. So yeah I assume you do care a lot about what Bengals fans think. 
 

By the way, when my favorite baseball team, the Yankees were winning World Series, I gotta admit my first thought wasn’t, “I wonder what the fans on the Red Sox and Orioles forums think.” And that is probably because, once again, I enjoyed the victory and didn’t have any need to rub it in the faces of the conquered teams, nor did I have a Rodney Dangerfield type obsession with the “respect” my team got. But hey, you do you Odenkirk.

 

I'm not rubbing anything in anybody's face and I've had plenty of encouraging things to say about the Bills and Allen (I.E. that he and Mahomes are in a tier of their own, he'll get at least one ring, the Bills roster and coaching staff are better than many think, etc). 

 

But I get it. You hate the big, bad Chiefs and all their fans, so it doesn't really matter what we say. 

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46 minutes ago, SaulGoodman said:

 

I'm not rubbing anything in anybody's face and I've had plenty of encouraging things to say about the Bills and Allen (I.E. that he and Mahomes are in a tier of their own, he'll get at least one ring, the Bills roster and coaching staff are better than many think, etc). 

 

But I get it. You hate the big, bad Chiefs and all their fans, so it doesn't really matter what we say. 


No I just think you’re making things up and doing a lot of bullshitting. There are a handful of Chiefs fans on here who don’t make things up, who don’t want to relitigate refs decisions in old Super Bowls, and who don’t want to pull the old Dangerfield “no respect” routine. And I think most of the board enjoys the conversation that they bring.

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3 hours ago, Jim said:


No I just think you’re making things up and doing a lot of bullshitting. There are a handful of Chiefs fans on here who don’t make things up, who don’t want to relitigate refs decisions in old Super Bowls, and who don’t want to pull the old Dangerfield “no respect” routine. And I think most of the board enjoys the conversation that they bring.

 

There are a lot of people here that pull the "no respect" card, but I'm not one of them. Sure, some people are too salty to give credit to Mahomes, but he gets plenty of credit from experts and talking heads. 

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1 hour ago, SaulGoodman said:

 

There are a lot of people here that pull the "no respect" card, but I'm not one of them. Sure, some people are too salty to give credit to Mahomes, but he gets plenty of credit from experts and talking heads. 

 

I haven't seen a single poster who fits that characterization.

 

That might be your perception if someone cites injuries or Mahomes also having a great defense this year - but that in no way = Bills fans not "giving credit to Mahomes."  Everyone here knows he's a great QB.

 

But, once again - you ARE on a Bills board.  "Credit for Mahomes" isn't always going to be a daily focus, though I'd say again that I think there is too much of it here, and not too little, and there certainly isn't anyone who doesn't credit him at all.

 

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2 hours ago, SaulGoodman said:

 

There are a lot of people here that pull the "no respect" card, but I'm not one of them. Sure, some people are too salty to give credit to Mahomes, but he gets plenty of credit from experts and talking heads. 


Name names. Who are these posters on this board who think Travis Kelce and Andy Reid and their defense are dragging Mahomes lifeless corpse past the finish line? I’d love to know. At this point I know I’m wasting my time arguing with somebody who is trolling me, but o well.

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27 minutes ago, Success said:

 

I haven't seen a single poster who fits that characterization.

 

That might be your perception if someone cites injuries or Mahomes also having a great defense this year - but that in no way = Bills fans not "giving credit to Mahomes."  Everyone here knows he's a great QB.

 

But, once again - you ARE on a Bills board.  "Credit for Mahomes" isn't always going to be a daily focus, though I'd say again that I think there is too much of it here, and not too little, and there certainly isn't anyone who doesn't credit him at all.

 

 

You haven't seen anyone claim that Reid is the main reason Mahomes has won at this rate, and that Allen would have like 6 SBs if he played for Reid?

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12 minutes ago, SaulGoodman said:

 

You haven't seen anyone claim that Reid is the main reason Mahomes has won at this rate, and that Allen would have like 6 SBs if he played for Reid?

 

I've seen posters here talk about the disparity in coaching between the 2 teams, and how that's a big factor in the accomplishments so far between Allen & Mahomes.

 

That's just factual. It's not "not crediting" Mahomes and/or not thinking he's still a great QB.

 

Unless you think Mahomes deserves 100% credit for everything?

 

 

Edited by Success
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1 hour ago, Success said:

 

I've seen posters here talk about the disparity in coaching between the 2 teams, and how that's a big factor in the accomplishments so far between Allen & Mahomes.

 

That's just factual. It's not "not crediting" Mahomes and/or not thinking he's still a great QB.

 

Unless you think Mahomes deserves 100% credit for everything?

 

 


Saul thinks Reid is overrated! He doesn’t think he deserves any credit. How disrespectful to the greatest coach of all time. Disgusting. 

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9 hours ago, SaulGoodman said:

 

I'm not rubbing anything in anybody's face and I've had plenty of encouraging things to say about the Bills and Allen (I.E. that he and Mahomes are in a tier of their own, he'll get at least one ring, the Bills roster and coaching staff are better than many think, etc). 

 

But I get it. You hate the big, bad Chiefs and all their fans, so it doesn't really matter what we say. 

For what it is worth I don't hate the Chiefs or their fans. I am jealous of them having a great coach. If we had Reid, Allen would have at least two rings, maybe more.

You have a great coach. We have a great person who is a terrible coach who has robbed the Bills fanbase of at least two trips to the SuperBowl.  

Even with the Chiefs better roster, I beleive a more competent HC(I wanted Harbaugh and said so two years ago) doesn't allow 13 seconds to happen and doesn't get his defense abused repeatedly by Mahommes. 

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Buffalo was without: 

 

-Matt Milano (starter)

-Terrel Bernard (starter)

-Gabe Davis (starter) 

-Taylor Rapp (useful) 

-Christian Benford (useful) 

-Baylon Spector (useful?) 

 

*The Bills had 11 players appear on their injury report (excluding three vet rest guys.) The Bills were also without Tre White who was injured early season but his injury prompted the trade for Douglas, so for all intents and purposes, wouldn't define this as a loss. 

 

**Appeared on injured report but ultimately played: P Sam Martin, CB Taron Johnson, S Micah Hyde, LB Tyrel Dodson, QB Josh Allen

 

***Injured during game but returned: WR Shakir

 

KC was without/lost on opening series:

 

-Bryan Cook (starter)

-Mike Edwards (starter)

-Willie Gay (starter)

-Derrick Nnadi (starter)

-Jerick McKinnon (impact player)

-Skyy Moore (barely useful)

-Kadarius Toney (psycho) 

-Justyn Ross (package player only)

 

*The Chiefs had 14 players on their injury report. The Chiefs were without LT Wanya Morris, who started several games late in the year, but Donovan Smith returned for this game so didn't include Morris in the "without" category above. I also didn't include LG Joe Thuney above as he played the entire first half before exiting with injury in the third quarter.

 

**Appeared on injury report but ultimately played: CB L'Jarius Sneed, LB Nick Bolton, DB Deon Bush, TE Noah Gray, DE Charles Omenihu, WR Rashee Rice, LT Donovan Smith, WR Marques Valdes-Scantling.

 

No matter how many times it is stated, the Bills simply weren't as injured as people want to believe. The entire offense outside of Gabe Davis—the ENTIRE offense— entered the game healthy and finished the game healthy. Both teams were without 3-4 starters and a couple backups. The Bills largely entered the game with a weakened LB corps and had to play AJ Klein more snaps than they desired, while the Chiefs had a weakened group of safeties and ultimately had to play a 4th-round rookie every snap. 

 

KC was without two of their three best safeties and their best coverage LB and yet the Bills didn't complete a single pass longer than 15 yards on 39 pass attempts and didn't have a play longer than 18 yards out of 78 plays. Again, I keep hearing how the Chiefs kept exploiting Klein all game (a falsehood, Klein gave up two catches in coverage vs Kelce the entire game, both in the first half) yet no mention of the Bills largely playing a dink-and-dunk offense with Willie Gay out of the game and they were unable to put pressure on KC's safeties downfield. 

 

Josh Allen's 39 pass attempts consisted of:

 

-17 passes at or behind the line of scrimmage (16-for-17)

-11 passes within 5 yards of line of scrimmage (8-for-11)

-2 passes within 6-10 yards of line of scrimmage (0-for-2)

-3 passes within 11-15 yards of line of scrimmage (2-for-3)

-4 passes 16+ yards of line of scrimmage (0-for-4)

-2 passes didn't appear on the NextGen chart (0-for-2)

 

Buffalo's offense turned in a decent performance, producing scores or scoring opportunities on five of eight possessions (counting the Bass miss.) But they really had to labor their way down the field, facing 17 third or fourth-down plays (half of them 3rd-and-7 or worse) and probably overachieving in that regard overall. This wasn't a dominant KC win, but it was far from a lucky one, and wasn't the result of KC having some sort of monster injury advantage. Buffalo's offense was just 4.7 yards per play compared to 7.7 for KC; both teams essentially had a turnover (Bills fake punt followed by Hardman's fumble out of end zone). If anything, the Bills were very fortunate to recover Allen's fumble on the final drive that set up the game-tying FG opportunity. 

Edited by beebe
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2 hours ago, beebe said:

Buffalo was without: 

 

-Matt Milano (starter)

-Terrel Bernard (starter)

-Gabe Davis (starter) 

-Taylor Rapp (useful) 

-Christian Benford (useful) 

-Baylon Spector (useful?) 

 

*The Bills had 11 players appear on their injury report (excluding three vet rest guys.) The Bills were also without Tre White who was injured early season but his injury prompted the trade for Douglas, so for all intents and purposes, wouldn't define this as a loss. 

 

**Appeared on injured report but ultimately played: P Sam Martin, CB Taron Johnson, S Micah Hyde, LB Tyrel Dodson, QB Josh Allen

 

***Injured during game but returned: WR Shakir

 

KC was without/lost on opening series:

 

-Bryan Cook (starter)

-Mike Edwards (starter)

-Willie Gay (starter)

-Derrick Nnadi (starter)

-Jerick McKinnon (impact player)

-Skyy Moore (barely useful)

-Kadarius Toney (psycho) 

-Justyn Ross (package player only)

 

*The Chiefs had 14 players on their injury report. The Chiefs were without LT Wanya Morris, who started several games late in the year, but Donovan Smith returned for this game so didn't include Morris in the "without" category above. I also didn't include LG Joe Thuney above as he played the entire first half before exiting with injury in the third quarter.

 

**Appeared on injury report but ultimately played: CB L'Jarius Sneed, LB Nick Bolton, DB Deon Bush, TE Noah Gray, DE Charles Omenihu, WR Rashee Rice, LT Donovan Smith, WR Marques Valdes-Scantling.

 

No matter how many times it is stated, the Bills simply weren't as injured as people want to believe. The entire offense outside of Gabe Davis—the ENTIRE offense— entered the game healthy and finished the game healthy. Both teams were without 3-4 starters and a couple backups. The Bills largely entered the game with a weakened LB corps and had to play AJ Klein more snaps than they desired, while the Chiefs had a weakened group of safeties and ultimately had to play a 4th-round rookie every snap. 

 

KC was without two of their three best safeties and their best coverage LB and yet the Bills didn't complete a single pass longer than 15 yards on 39 pass attempts and didn't have a play longer than 18 yards out of 78 plays. Again, I keep hearing how the Chiefs kept exploiting Klein all game (a falsehood, Klein gave up two catches in coverage vs Kelce the entire game, both in the first half) yet no mention of the Bills largely playing a dink-and-dunk offense with Willie Gay out of the game and they were unable to put pressure on KC's safeties downfield. 

 

Josh Allen's 39 pass attempts consisted of:

 

-17 passes at or behind the line of scrimmage (16-for-17)

-11 passes within 5 yards of line of scrimmage (8-for-11)

-2 passes within 6-10 yards of line of scrimmage (0-for-2)

-3 passes within 11-15 yards of line of scrimmage (2-for-3)

-4 passes 16+ yards of line of scrimmage (0-for-4)

-2 passes didn't appear on the NextGen chart (0-for-2)

 

Buffalo's offense turned in a decent performance, producing scores or scoring opportunities on five of eight possessions (counting the Bass miss.) But they really had to labor their way down the field, facing 17 third or fourth-down plays (half of them 3rd-and-7 or worse) and probably overachieving in that regard overall. This wasn't a dominant KC win, but it was far from a lucky one, and wasn't the result of KC having some sort of monster injury advantage. Buffalo's offense was just 4.7 yards per play compared to 7.7 for KC; both teams essentially had a turnover (Bills fake punt followed by Hardman's fumble out of end zone). If anything, the Bills were very fortunate to recover Allen's fumble on the final drive that set up the game-tying FG opportunity. 


Most people know this. But not too many in that group want to accept it. It’s much more palatable to provide ‘reasons’ than to say Bills weren’t good enough 3 out of 4 years against KC when it mattered. The only time it didn’t happened was when the two didn’t meet.

 

Bills gotta find a way to get it done next year because this has become a major roadblock to the superbowl. 

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4 hours ago, Success said:

 

I've seen posters here talk about the disparity in coaching between the 2 teams, and how that's a big factor in the accomplishments so far between Allen & Mahomes.

 

That's just factual. It's not "not crediting" Mahomes and/or not thinking he's still a great QB.

 

Unless you think Mahomes deserves 100% credit for everything?

 

 


Well, respect for Reid nationally (and locally) increased 1000% after Mahomes became the starter. That’s no coincidence. And McNabb and Vick were pretty talented. Alex Smith had by far the best season of his career in 2017, and Mahomes doubled his TD total in his first year. 
 

Many of you give little credit to McDermott and his staff, but he’s a pretty damn solid coach. Went to the playoffs with Tyrod Taylor and a weak roster. Hell, one of the “genius” plays that Reid’s praised for was stolen from the Bills. The occasional questionable decision doesn’t make McD a vastly inferior coach. As good as he is, Andy’s made a hell of a lot of questionable decisions in his career too, and it’s no secret that he’s struggled with clock management over the years. 
 

Andy’s done a nice job of developing Mahomes, but does McD get any credit for what Allen’s become? Especially considering how raw and inaccurate he was early on. 
 

The difference in perspective among different fanbases is funny to me. On a Broncos board, they’ll say Andy Reid is an awful playoff coach being carried by Mahomes. And they hate Mahomes for obvious reasons. 

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32 minutes ago, SaulGoodman said:


Well, respect for Reid nationally (and locally) increased 1000% after Mahomes became the starter. That’s no coincidence. And McNabb and Vick were pretty talented. Alex Smith had by far the best season of his career in 2017, and Mahomes doubled his TD total in his first year. 
 

Many of you give little credit to McDermott and his staff, but he’s a pretty damn solid coach. Went to the playoffs with Tyrod Taylor and a weak roster. Hell, one of the “genius” plays that Reid’s praised for was stolen from the Bills. The occasional questionable decision doesn’t make McD a vastly inferior coach. As good as he is, Andy’s made a hell of a lot of questionable decisions in his career too, and it’s no secret that he’s struggled with clock management over the years. 
 

Andy’s done a nice job of developing Mahomes, but does McD get any credit for what Allen’s become? Especially considering how raw and inaccurate he was early on. 
 

The difference in perspective among different fanbases is funny to me. On a Broncos board, they’ll say Andy Reid is an awful playoff coach being carried by Mahomes. And they hate Mahomes for obvious reasons. 

 

That's quite a narrative.

 

Reid is considered the best coach in the NFL right now.  That is pretty much consensus.  People are starting to talk about him as potential GOAT.

 

McDermott?  Not so much right now.  I've heard countless opposing fans & pundits say that he's holding Allen back.  I'm not ready to give up on him personally, but there is no question the JA era Bills have underachieved, and much of that falls to coaching.  

 

So, yeah - the difference in perspective is kind of funny.

 

EDIT:  I'd also add that literally no one credits McDermott w/ Allen's development. He's a defensive coach.  Daboll is credited w/ making Allen as good as he is.  That's a fairly consensus opinion also.

 

 

Edited by Success
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3 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

For what it is worth I don't hate the Chiefs or their fans. I am jealous of them having a great coach. If we had Reid, Allen would have at least two rings, maybe more.

You have a great coach. We have a great person who is a terrible coach who has robbed the Bills fanbase of at least two trips to the SuperBowl.  

Even with the Chiefs better roster, I beleive a more competent HC(I wanted Harbaugh and said so two years ago) doesn't allow 13 seconds to happen and doesn't get his defense abused repeatedly by Mahommes. 

While I agree with some of what you say. McD has the Buffalo Bills with the second-most wins over the last five years. It's not McD's fault that Andy Reid is an offensive genius who groomed his QB to an ultra-elite level. Travis Kelce is a big reason for what makes Mahomes so good too. Or that the Chiefs had a much better defense this season and stayed healthy these last two seasons. 

 

The only thing that has kept Buffalo out of the SB has been KC with that 13-second crap and Leslie Frazier is gone. McD proved this season that he is a much more aggressive DC and did an amazing job considering all the injuries. 

 

Nearly every team was abused by the Chiefs this season and it was more of their defense this year over their superstar QB. The KC GM did an amazing job in restocking that team with players and their secondary... CB Sneed and McDuffie were also excellent ...not to mention Chris Jones.

 

 

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