FireChans Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:00 PM, Andy1 said: Are only men concerned about the life of the unborn? What I suggested was hypothetical of course, but I still believe that women understand this complex issue on a far deeper level than men. Expand Based on what? What hidden knowledge do "women" inherently possess? On 6/25/2022 at 4:03 PM, BillStime said: The cult never cared about the details. Expand Let's reform CPS instead of tweeting about it then. Oh, wait. Crickets. 1
BillStime Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:01 PM, gobills404 said: Expand Exactly - transforming America just the way the cult likes. And oh - freakshow - we all know the cult will, too, still get abortions even if they are outlawed - because no one will stop a woman from making that ultimate decision.
Pokebball Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:00 PM, Andy1 said: Are only men concerned about the life of the unborn? What I suggested was hypothetical of course, but I still believe that women understand this complex issue on a far deeper level than men. Expand I clearly stated all of us need to solve this.
HappyDays Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 2:46 PM, FireChans said: This would be a good point if there was any way to get pregnant without having sex. But there isn’t. They know the game and the score. If you don’t accept it, don’t play. Expand People don't give up their bodily autonomy because they made poor choices. I won't ever compromise on that.
Boatdrinks Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 “ Jack” is confused. SCOTUS did not impose or end anything. One of these things ( guns) is in a Constitutional amendment. The other ( abortion) is not. They correctly ruled on what the States can and cannot do.
HappyDays Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 3:42 PM, Pokebball said: The next day, or the next week, I want to claim personal autonomy and unplug you. Moral? My opinion is no, it isn't. Expand I'm talking about legality, not morality. In the hypothetical you presented no I would not want it to be illegal to unplug the tube. I don't want the government forcing people through criminal law to violate their bodily autonomy. Morality is subjective. I don't want the government involved in that decision, period.
Boatdrinks Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:07 PM, HappyDays said: People don't give up their bodily autonomy because they made poor choices. I won't ever compromise on that. Expand And they won’t ; unless the will of the people in all 50 states doesn’t allow another person to perform a procedure on said individual. My best guess is that this will not happen.
BillStime Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:03 PM, FireChans said: Based on what? What hidden knowledge do "women" inherently possess? Let's reform CPS instead of tweeting about it then. Oh, wait. Crickets. Expand That would require the cult to have to actually fund it - freak
Boatdrinks Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:11 PM, HappyDays said: I'm talking about legality, not morality. In the hypothetical you presented no I would not want it to be illegal to unplug the tube. I don't want the government forcing people through criminal law to violate their bodily autonomy. Morality is subjective. I don't want the government involved in that decision, period. Expand My libertarian side agrees with you. The design of our government as laid out by the founders says they will be involved. It’s up to the people to decide the level of that involvement.
FireChans Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:07 PM, HappyDays said: People don't give up their bodily autonomy because they made poor choices. I won't ever compromise on that. Expand What? Yes they do, all the time. Unless you think people consent to those pesky lethal injections when they get the death penalty. On 6/25/2022 at 4:15 PM, BillStime said: That would require the cult to have to actually fund it - freak Expand Put a bill on the floor. Who controls Congress?
Boatdrinks Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:03 PM, FireChans said: Based on what? What hidden knowledge do "women" inherently possess? Let's reform CPS instead of tweeting about it then. Oh, wait. Crickets. Expand So the government should require a test be given for parenthood? Great , I’m all for it.
Pokebball Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) On 6/25/2022 at 4:11 PM, HappyDays said: I'm talking about legality, not morality. In the hypothetical you presented no I would not want it to be illegal to unplug the tube. I don't want the government forcing people through criminal law to violate their bodily autonomy. Morality is subjective. I don't want the government involved in that decision, period. Expand Sure, but I propose our laws are generally a result of what we think is moral and how decisions impact the two parties (or more) involved. Let's add a twist to personal autonomy. Thinking the logic is that your body is your property and thus the personal autonomy, does this autonomy extend to personal property? Let's say I get this morning head down to the dock and take my dingy out into the water. After I get out aways, I realize there is a drunk passed out in my boat. He's dirty and he stinks. Can I claim personal autonomy and throw him overboard? It's my boat? Edited June 25, 2022 by Pokebball
Boatdrinks Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:25 PM, Pokebball said: Sure, but I propose our laws are generally a result of what we think is moral and how decisions impact the two parties (or more) involved. Expand Yes , or in the case of abortion when and how much the government should be involved at all.
Pokebball Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) On 6/25/2022 at 4:29 PM, Boatdrinks said: Yes , or in the case of abortion when and how much the government should be involved at all. Expand LIFE, liberty and the pursuit.... It's complicated Edited June 25, 2022 by Pokebball
Boatdrinks Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:32 PM, Pokebball said: LIFE, liberty and the pursuit.... Expand And whose? Again , abortion not mentioned so .. the States. Pregnant woman has a say.
The Frankish Reich Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:32 PM, Pokebball said: LIFE, liberty and the pursuit.... It's complicated Expand You're right - that's straight from ... the DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE, which, if you care to use it as an interpretative source for the CONSTITUTION, may suggest (rather more strongly, I'd say) that the "liberty" interest prevails over the "potential" life interest. 1
Boatdrinks Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:36 PM, The Frankish Reich said: You're right - that's straight from ... the DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE, which, if you care to use it as an interpretative source for the CONSTITUTION, may suggest (rather more strongly, I'd say) that the "liberty" interest prevails over the "potential" life interest. Expand Or at least that nothing can be pursued without autonomy. Can anything be pursued in the womb ?
The Frankish Reich Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:25 PM, Pokebball said: Sure, but I propose our laws are generally a result of what we think is moral and how decisions impact the two parties (or more) involved. Let's add a twist to personal autonomy. Thinking the logic is that your body is your property and thus the personal autonomy, does this autonomy extend to personal property? Let's say I get this morning head down to the dock and take my dingy out into the water. After I get out aways, I realize there is a drunk passed out in my boat. He's dirty and he stinks. Can I claim personal autonomy and throw him overboard? It's my boat? Expand Let's say you mistakenly ***** into a fertile woman, and you immediately throw her in a very hot chlorinated spa to try to nip the potential life in the bud. Have you committed murder? Stupid analogies will always be with us, on both sides. 1
muppy Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) Here's the thing. I am a professing evangelical Christian and I do consider life sacred. I wish men and women would do the ultimately best and most responsible thing and USE PROTECTION to prevent a pregnancy. You dont hear people up in arms about contraception for the most part. Which is obviously preventing a pregnancy from occurring/advancing.. HOW DARE WOMEN WANT TO PREVENT A PREGNANCY.. The Horror!................. @-@ wait just a minute. So we can elect to have control of our reproductive choices and our bodies ....except when a zygote is present that has zero chance of viability at this point and for weeks forward then we re stripped of the choice? This is a very serious controversial topic. For me it is logical to hate abortion but be pro choice. Edited June 25, 2022 by muppy 2
BillStime Posted June 25, 2022 Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 4:18 PM, FireChans said: What? Yes they do, all the time. Unless you think people consent to those pesky lethal injections when they get the death penalty. Put a bill on the floor. Who controls Congress? Expand Wait - you want federal funds (from blue states) to bail out what red states won’t fund on their own? Cute. The stats already show that a majority of blue states have fewer poor kids per capita, fewer dead babies and fewer children raised by children. Childhood Poverty: https://data.ers.usda.gov/reports.aspx?ID=17826 Infant Mortality: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/infant_mortality_rates/infant_mortality.htm Teen Birth Rate: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/teen-births/teenbirths.htm Pay up red states
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