K-9 Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/11/2020 at 11:58 PM, eanyills said: Buffalo and Buffalo business owners absolutely care about Canada. You’re underestimating the importance of Southern Ontario on Buffalo. Expand Absolutely. IIRC, Canadians represent 20% of the Bills’ customer base. That’s nothing to sneeze at. I wonder what kind of percentage they represent for Buffalo businesses overall.
buffalobillsfootball Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 1:36 AM, K-9 said: Absolutely. IIRC, Canadians represent 20% of the Bills’ customer base. That’s nothing to sneeze at. I wonder what kind of percentage they represent for Buffalo businesses overall. Expand Check out the Walden Galleria or the Outlets on any weekend in the 716...
Mr. WEO Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 1:36 AM, K-9 said: Absolutely. IIRC, Canadians represent 20% of the Bills’ customer base. That’s nothing to sneeze at. I wonder what kind of percentage they represent for Buffalo businesses overall. Expand IO would imagine that, like most who attend the games, once it's over, they get in their cars and drive home....
K-9 Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 2:29 AM, Mr. WEO said: IO would imagine that, like most who attend the games, once it's over, they get in their cars and drive home.... Expand I’m not taking about game days. I’m talking about Canadians who routinely come to Buffalo for other reasons on other days, like for shopping as mentioned above.
Mr. WEO Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 2:34 AM, K-9 said: I’m not taking about game days. I’m talking about Canadians who routinely come to Buffalo for other reasons on other days, like for shopping as mentioned above. Expand That won't change no matter where a stadium is built though.
K-9 Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 2:40 AM, Mr. WEO said: That won't change no matter where a stadium is built though. Expand Not my point. I’m just curious as to what the Canadian market contributes to the Buffalo/WNY economy.
Mr. WEO Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 2:42 AM, K-9 said: Not my point. I’m just curious as to what the Canadian market contributes to the Buffalo/WNY economy. Expand Got it. I was responding to the poster who was hinging the location on the importance of "Southern Ontario". The Canadian impact on Buffalo economy is probably significant re: retail, but not affected by the Bills being in OP or anywhere different. 1
buffalobillsfootball Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 2:52 AM, Mr. WEO said: Got it. I was responding to the poster who was hinging the location on the importance of "Southern Ontario". The Canadian impact on Buffalo economy is probably significant re: retail, but not affected by the Bills being in OP or anywhere different. Expand The idea is to try to recruit more Corporate money from Southern Ontario... make it easier for them to come - start winning - and they will. (Up and until TO gets a team; if ever)
Augie Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 (edited) On 2/12/2020 at 2:42 AM, K-9 said: Not my point. I’m just curious as to what the Canadian market contributes to the Buffalo/WNY economy. Expand I live about 3 miles from the Atlanta Braves new stadium. It’s surrounded by restaurants, bars and hotels, including a new Omni with rooms that look down into the stadium. I go to that area fairly frequently, but NEVER on game day unless I’m hitting a game. When I do go into a hotel bar on a game day it’s FULL of people who live nearby (granted, not across a border) who would rather just spend the night and make a time of it. It’s fun and easy to stay the night, not have to worry about traffic or DUI’s, just make it an event. That’s not happening from what I can tell in remote OP. Having said that, I don’t care where they play! Just stay in WNY. Tailgates in OP are great. Walking around an urban environment with lots of bars and restaurants can also be great. Change is change, but it’s NOT always bad. . Edited February 12, 2020 by Augie 2
PromoTheRobot Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/11/2020 at 11:16 PM, Augie said: One thing is almost certain in life (approaching the certainty level of death and taxes). People hate and fear change. It’s almost always true. That usually includes me, in most respects. But change is a certainty in life, so the better you get at dealing with it, the better off you will be. The stadium situation affects me far less than most people here. I’m fine as long as they are in WNY. I try extremely hard to not get too upset about things over which I have no control. I’ll just see how it goes, see how I like it and go from there. If need be, in a deal like this, you can vote with your feet.....BUT I’d give any decision a chance before making that choice. . Expand I told this story before but I'll repeat it here. I lived in Baltimore when Camden Yards was proposed. Everyone hated the notion of replacing good ol Memorial Stadium...until they saw a finished Camden Yards. 2
Mr. WEO Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 2:55 AM, buffalobillsfootball said: The idea is to try to recruit more Corporate money from Southern Ontario... make it easier for them to come - start winning - and they will. (Up and until TO gets a team; if ever) Expand If they start winning playoff games, they won't need Canadians to fill the seats.... On 2/12/2020 at 2:58 AM, Augie said: I live about 3 miles from the Atlanta Braves new stadium. It’s surrounded by restaurants, bars and hotels, including a new Omni with rooms that look down into the stadium. I go to that area fairly frequently, but NEVER on game day unless I’m hitting a game. When I do go into a hotel bar on a game day it’s FULL of people who live nearby (granted, not a cross a border) who would rather just spend the night and make a time of it. It’s fun and easy to stay the night, not have to worry about traffic or DUI’s, just make it an event. That’s not happening from what I can tell in remote OP. Having said that, I don’t care where they play! Just stay in WNY. Tailgates in OP are great. Walking around an urban environment with lots of bars and restaurants can also be great. Change is change, but it’s NOT always bad. Expand What would happen the other 357 nights? 1
Augie Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 (edited) On 2/12/2020 at 3:00 AM, Mr. WEO said: If they start winning playoff games, they won't need Canadians to fill the seats.... What would happen the other 357 nights? Expand Well, it’s baseball so it’d more like 280 nights.....and it’s extremely active due to the restaurants and bars, the office and hotels attached, etc. My only problem is I have to try to avoid it on game days. If I plan to shop or eat there and realize it’s a game day I put it off. We were there the weekend before last to do some gift shopping and get a bite to eat. I carry a Braves schedule in my car I can check before I can head that way in season. Oh, and before anyone can ask, I have NEVER been inconvenienced by the traffic, but it’s not worth going into the heart of it except for a game. It is an AWESOME amenity to have nearby, it has spurred additional development and increased property values. It was a huge win for our area. . Edited February 12, 2020 by Augie
Mr. WEO Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 3:11 AM, Augie said: Well, it’s baseball so it’d more like 280 nights.....and it’s extremely active due to the restaurants and bars, the office and hotels attached, etc. My only problem is I have to try to avoid it on game days. If I plan to shop or eat there and realize it’s a game day I put it off. We were there the weekend before last to do some gift shopping and get a bite to eat. I carry a Braves schedule in my car I can check before I can head that way in season. Oh, and before anyone can ask, I have NEVER been inconvenienced by the traffic, but it’s not worth going into the heart of it except for as game. It is an AWESOME amenity to have nearby, it has spurred additional development and increased property values. It was a huge win for our area. Expand Exactly. So really not a fair comparison.
Augie Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 (edited) On 2/12/2020 at 3:17 AM, Mr. WEO said: Exactly. So really not a fair comparison. Expand Well, it’s more like 77% vs 97% of the days in the year, and that does not make it an unfair comparison. In fact, that doesn’t even make sense to me. Have you been to a game in Nashville? Build the right stuff on the right scale around the stadium and it will get used. You are not counting on game days to make it work. The Battery in Atlanta can’t sit empty 83% of the time because they have baseball days. It’s actually better to me on NON-game days. I get it, Buffalo is NOT Atlanta, but if you have nice stuff, people come to enjoy it. You just do it on the proper scale. The Braves stadium holds about half the people that New Era holds. And....If you add other events downtown in the stadium that helps to balance things a bit. I have no horse in this race, I’m happy as long as they are in WNY. But I won’t be all “woe is me” if it moves downtown. If it costs a little more, I’m betting I get at least a little more. . Edited February 12, 2020 by Augie 1
Mr. WEO Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 3:34 AM, Augie said: Well, it’s more like 77% vs 97% of the days in the year, and that does not make it an unfair comparison. In fact, that doesn’t even make sense to me. Have you been to a game in Nashville? Build the right stuff on the right scale around the stadium and it will get used. You are not counting on game days to make it work. The Battery in Atlanta can’t sit empty 83% of the time because they have baseball days. It’s actually better to me on NON-game days. I get it, Buffalo is NOT Atlanta, but if you have nice stuff, people come to enjoy it. You just do it on the proper scale. The Braves stadium holds about half the people that New Era holds. And....If you add other events downtown in the stadium that helps to balance things a bit. I have no horse in this race, I’m happy as long as they are in WNY. But I won’t be all “woe is me” if it moves downtown. If it costs a little more, I’m betting I get at least a little more. . Expand I think 8 days and 81 are dissimilar enough not to be compared. As for Nashville, if the Titans didn't exist, that town would hardly skip a beat (musical reference haha). It's already a tourist attraction without the 8 NFL games per year. The stadium benefits from Nashville--similar to Vegas. Buffalo has no such attraction. 1
BobbyC81 Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/8/2020 at 7:32 PM, Lurker said: I suppose. But in a league generating $14 billion in revenue annually, do the Jones' and Kraft's of the world really care about getting another $500,000 or so (and $4-$5 million over 8 games) from being the road team in Buffalo? It seems like all the NFL jawboning about new stadiums is just so much FUD on autopilot... Expand The owners definitely do care. Their greediness is unmatched. For those that don’t know, Jennifer Lopez and Shakira did not get paid for their Super Bowl halftime performance and that is the common NFL practice. The fans you see on the field are unpaid volunteers. Sure they get to see top recording artists up close but the speakers are set up for the fans in the stands, not on the field. The people that setup/ take down the stage, etc. are paid minimum wage but they have to go thru extensive training and rehearsals and don’t get to watch the game.
Augie Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 3:47 AM, Mr. WEO said: I think 8 days and 81 are dissimilar enough not to be compared. As for Nashville, if the Titans didn't exist, that town would hardly skip a beat (musical reference haha). It's already a tourist attraction without the 8 NFL games per year. The stadium benefits from Nashville--similar to Vegas. Buffalo has no such attraction. Expand Ok, Cincinnati (where I went to school and just got back from.....apparently I’m not 20 anymore!) or any other city. You say Buffalo has “no such attraction”, but on my most recent trips back to Buffalo I’ve been quite pleased with all the cool areas right downtown to enjoy. No, it’s not Nashville or Vegas (who is?), but I think you are short selling what it is and what it could become. Have some vision, I think the Pegulas can see it. Time will tell. The stadium does not have to fully support the surrounding environment. The surrounding area enhances the stadium. But THAT is the point you apparently refuse to even consider, so this is hopeless. Again....Bills in WNY and I’m a happy camper. 1
Mr. WEO Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 3:58 AM, Augie said: Ok, Cincinnati (where I went to school and just got back from.....apparently I’m not 20 anymore!) or any other city. You say Buffalo has “no such attraction”, but on my most recent trips back to Buffalo I’ve been quite pleased with all the cool areas right downtown to enjoy. No, it’s not Nashville or Vegas (who is?), but I think you are short selling what it is and what it could become. Have some vision, I think the Pegulas can see it. Time will tell. The stadium does not have to fully support the surrounding environment. The surrounding area enhances the stadium. But THAT is the point you apparently refuse to even consider, so this is hopeless. Again....Bills in WNY and I’m a happy camper. Expand Well....I said exactly that in my above post, actually: "The stadium benefits from Nashville--similar to Vegas". Sure whatever is happening in spots in downtown Buffalo is nice, but a large stadium nearby that is empty but for maybe 20 days a year won't be helped ("enhanced") by what is happening downtown. And downtown Buffalo has happened without a stadium nearby and will continue to do so or not whether there is a stadium or not. No reason to believe otherwise. Leave it where it is, unless the owner wants to pay the cost of moving it himself.
Augie Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 4:27 AM, Mr. WEO said: Well....I said exactly that in my above post, actually: "The stadium benefits from Nashville--similar to Vegas". Sure whatever is happening in spots in downtown Buffalo is nice, but a large stadium nearby that is empty but for maybe 20 days a year won't be helped ("enhanced") by what is happening downtown. And downtown Buffalo has happened without a stadium nearby and will continue to do so or not whether there is a stadium or not. No reason to believe otherwise. Leave it where it is, unless the owner wants to pay the cost of moving it himself. Expand I don’t care where the stadium stays or goes (as long as it’s WNY). The area around the Braves stadium was surrounded by crappy strip malls. Vacant land due to a major gas line running through 65 acres making it tough to do a small project because you needed something huge to absorb the cost of relocating the line. THIS made it worth it. I will tell you a LOT of development has happened outside of the immediate stadium area (a few miles away) as a result of the appeal of the stadium area. A stadium may hasten the redevelopment of downtown. Or, leave it in OP and they can repave the parking lot at the Big Tree. I know this SOUNDS like I prefer downtown. That’s not really the case, I just see both sides, and only then recognize the reality of things to reinforce my expectations. 1
purple haze Posted February 12, 2020 Posted February 12, 2020 (edited) On 2/12/2020 at 3:58 AM, Augie said: You say Buffalo has “no such attraction”, but on my most recent trips back to Buffalo I’ve been quite pleased with all the cool areas right downtown to enjoy. No, it’s not Nashville or Vegas (who is?), but I think you are short selling what it is and what it could become. Have some vision, I think the Pegulas can see it. Time will tell. Expand Lack of vision has plagued Buffalo for decades now. Campaign slogan: "No We Can't." Or "Let Me Tell You Why Not." Luckily the Pegula's don't seem to suffer from that condition; except when it comes to the Sabres. Edited February 12, 2020 by purple haze 4 1
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