Andrew Son Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 7:42 PM, RoyBatty is alive said: Good observation Royale. Actually I think this could be a very big issue when real games are played, defenders will be going after that constantly to strip him. Expand Did you notice that last 2 point conversion? The defender came from behind and tried to strip the ball but Allen held on. He's got big paws that will really help with ball security.
Buffalo716 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 7:32 PM, JaCrispy said: I disagree... I feel Allen throws more 3/4 where Kelly was more over the top...I’ve also seen still frame pics that seem to illustrate this. Expand I just rewatched every throw again from the preseason and it’s definitely semi sidearm... it’s not as bad as rivers and it’s so quick it’s hard to see but it’s there. He honestly throws from a lot of arm angles
RoyBatty is alive Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 7:45 PM, SWATeam said: Did you notice that last 2 point conversion? The defender came from behind and tried to strip the ball but Allen held on. He's got big paws that will really help with ball security. Expand Yeah I did, that was impressive but still i would like to see better ball handling. He is going to take some vicious tomahawk chops to his hand if he keeps doing that.
White Linen Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 (edited) On 8/15/2018 at 7:37 PM, Buffalo716 said: But he definitely does have a 3/4 flare when he goes deep. He had a longer motion 3 years ago so I bet it’s a work in progress Expand I don't know where you're getting this from but he does not have a 3/4 flare when he goes deep. It in almost no way resembles Rivers. Edited August 15, 2018 by White Linen
Fadingpain Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 QB throwing motion is kind of like a batter's swing in baseball. You can do everything "wrong" going by the book but it doesn't matter if you can get the job done. I.E, throwing motion is an issue only if it is an issue. If it is not, it's not.
Buffalo716 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 (edited) On 8/15/2018 at 7:48 PM, White Linen said: I don't know where you're getting this from but he does not have a 3/4 flare when he goes deep. Expand It’s not horribly bad. But someone posted the screen shots and frame by frame you can see it isn’t 100% over the top. It is slightly side arm i thought it was completely over the top but it’s not. He throws from a lot of angles and it doesn’t matter because his mechanics are sound. A slight slide arm delivery isn’t a bad thing Edited August 15, 2018 by Buffalo716
White Linen Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 7:52 PM, Buffalo716 said: It’s not horribly bad. But someone posted the screen shots and frame by frame you can see it isn’t 100% over the top. It is slightly side arm i thought it was completely over the top but it’s not and it doesn’t matter because his mechanics are sound. A slight slide arm delivery isn’t a bad thing Expand That's my point, it's not even slightly side arm. I know you're referring to the Panthers game but her's a good break down of Allens throwing motion. From the 4:19 minute mark to 5:00 there's is absolutely nothing about that deep thrown that is 3/4.
Buffalo716 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 7:55 PM, White Linen said: That's my point, it's not even slightly side arm. I know you're referring to the Panthers game but her's a good break down of Allens throwing motion. From the 4:19 minute mark to 5:00 there's is absolutely nothing about that deep thrown that is 3/4. Expand I gotcha, There isn’t much of a vocabulary for QB throwing motions. Someone mentioned it was 3/4 and I said that it wasn’t that bad. That rivers is a classic 3/4 motion and Allen isn’t that sidearm. But Allen does throw from a lot of angles that are Semi 3/4 sometImes. Or just not over the top I watched every throw from Allen’s career at Wyoming. His mechanics improved every year and he’s a great prospect. He does uncork it from different angles alot
RoyBatty is alive Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 FWIW speaking of throwing angles, i saw a science show with Drew Brees throwing and it was amazing how almost every one of his passes was at a 7 degree angle.
Buffalo716 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 8:05 PM, RoyBatty is alive said: FWIW speaking of throwing angles, i saw a science show with Drew Brees throwing and it was amazing how almost every one of his passes was at a 7 degree angle. Expand Thats why I think consistency in mechanics are so vital,.. Brees and Brady are so pinpoint accurate In part because they have the same release ... throw after throw after throw consistency
Shaw66 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 7:47 PM, RoyBatty is alive said: Yeah I did, that was impressive but still i would like to see better ball handling. He is going to take some vicious tomahawk chops to his hand if he keeps doing that. Expand Roy, not picking on you in particular, but I have a general comment about this whole discussion. My point of view is that when it's determined that something is a problem, that's when it's time to fix it. Whether he's over-the-top or 3/4s, whether he's dropping the ball lower than some guys do, I don't care, at least not yet. Is there anything that gets in the way of his becoming a star QB? All of the arm-chair experts around here can theorize about it, but until there's an identifiable problem in his play, variations in his motion from the norm don't bother me. My eyes tell me he's a spectacular thrower with a quick release. I haven't seen anything that suggests he can't be effective. So I'm not worried. When he shows that he's inaccurate to a point where it impairs his effectiveness, when he loses more fumbles than the average QB because of his motion, I'll worry. Not yet. 3
WhoTom Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 5:53 PM, WhoTom said: I noticed at least one play where a DE was rushing from the right - Josh could see him coming. It looked like he adjusted his throwing motion by pulling the ball in a little tight before letting it go, in order to avoid letting the DE have a shot at it. If I remember it correctly, it was a completion. Expand I found it. Watch his throw around the 2:00 mark in the video:
Shaw66 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 8:09 PM, Buffalo716 said: Thats why I think consistency in mechanics are so vital,.. Brees and Brady are so pinpoint accurate In part because they have the same release ... throw after throw after throw consistency Expand And Aaron Rodgers and Brett Favre? Throw it from every angle imagineable. Different guys do different things. Rivers' motion is ridiculous, but he's been effective for a long time.
Buffalo716 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 8:13 PM, Shaw66 said: Roy, not picking on you in particular, but I have a general comment about this whole discussion. My point of view is that when it's determined that something is a problem, that's when it's time to fix it. Whether he's over-the-top or 3/4s, whether he's dropping the ball lower than some guys do, I don't care, at least not yet. Is there anything that gets in the way of his becoming a star QB? All of the arm-chair experts around here can theorize about it, but until there's an identifiable problem in his play, variations in his motion from the norm don't bother me. My eyes tell me he's a spectacular thrower with a quick release. I haven't seen anything that suggests he can't be effective. So I'm not worried. When he shows that he's inaccurate to a point where it impairs his effectiveness, when he loses more fumbles than the average QB because of his motion, I'll worry. Not yet. Expand This is why everybody should be excited... his arm is different On 8/15/2018 at 8:15 PM, Shaw66 said: And Aaron Rodgers and Brett Favre? Throw it from every angle imagineable. Different guys do different things. Rivers' motion is ridiculous, but he's been effective for a long time. Expand I cant rebuke that everybody plays the QB position differently... Rivers is supremely accurate with his release
Shaw66 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 8:15 PM, WhoTom said: I found it. Watch his throw around the 2:00 mark in the video: Expand Thanks for going back and finding it. I noticed this too. His arm strength gives him the ability to make a throw like that without it being a hopeless floater. He's a creative thrower. On 8/15/2018 at 8:16 PM, Buffalo716 said: This is why everybody should be excited... his arm is different I cant rebuke that everybody plays the QB position differently... Rivers is supremely accurate with his release Expand Yeah, it's why I want to see the guy play. It isn't about mechanics in a vacuum. It's about making plays. If he can make plays wearing a blindfold, then let's get him fitted.
Buffalo716 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 8:18 PM, Shaw66 said: Thanks for going back and finding it. I noticed this too. His arm strength gives him the ability to make a throw like that without it being a hopeless floater. He's a creative thrower. Yeah, it's why I want to see the guy play. It isn't about mechanics in a vacuum. It's about making plays. If he can make plays wearing a blindfold, then let's get him fitted. Expand I’m game. I agree 100% his talent at throwing a football is undeniable... And you can’t discount his athleticism
White Linen Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 8:13 PM, Shaw66 said: Roy, not picking on you in particular, but I have a general comment about this whole discussion. My point of view is that when it's determined that something is a problem, that's when it's time to fix it. Whether he's over-the-top or 3/4s, whether he's dropping the ball lower than some guys do, I don't care, at least not yet. Is there anything that gets in the way of his becoming a star QB? All of the arm-chair experts around here can theorize about it, but until there's an identifiable problem in his play, variations in his motion from the norm don't bother me. My eyes tell me he's a spectacular thrower with a quick release. I haven't seen anything that suggests he can't be effective. So I'm not worried. When he shows that he's inaccurate to a point where it impairs his effectiveness, when he loses more fumbles than the average QB because of his motion, I'll worry. Not yet. Expand I like your post Shaw. I'd add that there isn't a "norm" throwing motion. Each of the excellent QB's playing now and that have played in the past throw differently. IMO, it's actually what makes them all unique. Further it's why breaking down throwing mechanics is largely an exercise in futility. I say largely because I know it does have some merit and if you breakdown Allen's mechanics - he's as close to computer generated perfect as I'd be comfortable with him being. In other words, I like you, am not worried one bit about his motion.
Buffalo716 Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 8:49 PM, White Linen said: I like your post Shaw. I'd add that there isn't a "norm" throwing motion. Each of the excellent QB's playing now and that have played in the past throw differently. IMO, it's actually what makes them all unique. Further it's why breaking down throwing mechanics is largely an exercise in futility. I say largely because I know it does have some merit and if you breakdown Allen's mechanics - he's as close to computer generated perfect as I'd be comfortable with him being. In other words, I like you, am not worried one bit about his motion. Expand Same, I think it’s very crisp but i do think there are such things as bad releases.. a Teebow release will never fly in the NFL i think a Brady, Ryan release is the by the book , picturesque release that QB coaches try to teach at a young age
MrEpsYtown Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 6:45 PM, Johnny Hammersticks said: Josh Allen would be the product if Phil Rivers and Big Ben could somehow conceive a child. Expand As long as Big Ben gets consent first, I'm good with it. 1
Dr. Who Posted August 15, 2018 Posted August 15, 2018 On 8/15/2018 at 8:18 PM, Shaw66 said: He's a creative thrower. Yeah, it's why I want to see the guy play. It isn't about mechanics in a vacuum. It's about making plays. If he can make plays wearing a blindfold, then let's get him fitted. Expand Folks talk about Darnold's creativity when the pocket breaks down. Allen appears to have creativity that is only available to someone gifted with exceptional arm talent. He can simply imagine scenarios ordinary qbs can't even think about. Intelligence, creativity, character, and coachability -- there's a good chance he is going to be very good.
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