JohnC Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 42 minutes ago, Juice_32 said: It is definitely a faulty model, just a slower death. How is it a faulty model? What other option do these newspapers have now that the era of paper is sliding into antiquity and oblivion? I recently signed up for the digital NY Times. It took me quite some time to make the decision to pay a price (reasonable in my opinion) for what I used to get free. If a person doesn't want to pay for the service because there are plenty of alternative sources for the material one is interested then that is a personal decision. But it is clear that the trend of paying for digital services is becoming very mainstream. The business model is changing as it is for many other businesses. This is separate observation from the above post but I thought too many of the comments directed toward JoshBarnett were unwarrantedly harsh. It was depicted as if he was hustling people for clicks. I didn't see it that way. It's not surprising to me that a number of the media who have participated on this board have been driven out by uncalled for rudeness. Engaging doesn't require insulting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, JaCrispy said: Ok I’ll buy that...but I wouldn’t say KB didn’t do his job, as the ball sailed over his head. But it would have been pass interference whether the ball sailed over his head or the ball was perfect placement. Edited February 3, 2018 by Scott7975 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, JohnC said: How is it a faulty model? What other option do these newspapers have now that the era of paper is sliding into antiquity and oblivion? I recently signed up for the digital NY Times. It took me quite some time to make the decision to pay a price (reasonable in my opinion) for what I used to get free. If a person doesn't want to pay for the service because there are plenty of alternative sources for the material one is interested then that is a personal decision. But it is clear that the trend of paying for digital services is becoming very mainstream. The business model is changing as it is for many other businesses. This is separate observation from the above post but I thought too many of the comments directed toward JoshBarnett were unwarrantedly harsh. It was depicted as if he was hustling people for clicks. I didn't see it that way. It's not surprising to me that a number of the media who have participated on this board have been driven out by uncalled for rudeness. Engaging doesn't require insulting. I believe both the NY Times and the Washington Post allow a certain number of free articles a month (no registration), which might possibly be a better model. I know TBN has a 2 week free trial, but when one must register and provide a credit card (then remember to cancel) the follow-through might be lower, than just allowing a certain amount of free content. The other thing that bothers me about TBN business model is providing a $10 gift card that represents a significant price break for a year subscription - but only if you're local and use that store. I'm sure they have some sort of sponsorship deal that makes it a good value both ways, but only for locals, so that's an opportunity lost. I agree that news outlets have to figure out a way to make digital readership profitable in order to stay in business. I, too, find some subscriptions worthwhile. I agree some of the critique here was over the top. I provided mine in PM initially. Of course, rudeness is sometimes a thing here. I cherish the time I was told I was "sucking Ryan Fitzpatrick's d*ck" because I argued against the over-the-top proposition that he was absolutely the worst QB anywhere ever. Sriously peeps? Like, Sriously? I think the bottom line is to participate in any message board long-term, one has to cultivate a certain amount of callus. If you take it too seriously or personally you wear down. Edited February 3, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmuggs Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Lame. Op pays to read that garbage. Lol. Some people just waste and waste and waste. No wonder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaCrispy Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 33 minutes ago, Scott7975 said: But it would have been pass interference whether the ball sailed over his head or the ball was perfect placement. I actually wondered this because I don’t remember the play so clearly...I just remember the pass was wildly inaccurate...but was pass interference committed because he was trying to get to the ball or was it more of a push off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 7 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Yep. People forget that it was 1-1 from the 1, and if the PI had not been called, the Bills had 2 or 3 more chances to punch it in from the 1. Don't get the offsides, don't get the PI in that situation - bzzzzzzt Not to mention all the plays and playcalls the rest of the game. Darell Bevell has never wavered from defending his Superbowl pass call that resulted in NE Int, and interestingly, I read a piece where they interviewed 32 coaches and while some critiqued the specific pass call, NONE of them said they would have run against the defensive alignment NE was in (they had Beastmode. Run it). KB should have known PI was the very worst thing that could happen in situational ball. He should have let it sail and run the receiver off. Tyrod was throwing to the spot KB was supposed to have stopped or held ground at. He over ran the play and then made it much worse with the bone headed push off. Criticise anything you wish. and you can of course blame TT and or Dennison. I put it on Benjamin. Not the first time he has missed a route. should have made the play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaw66 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 15 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: I actually wondered this because I don’t remember the play so clearly...I just remember the pass was wildly inaccurate...but was pass interference committed because he was trying to get to the ball or was it more of a push off? It was a push off. Benjamin interfered before he looked for the ball. Just now, 3rdand12 said: KB should have known PI was the very worst thing that could happen in situational ball. He should have let it sail and run the receiver off. Tyrod was throwing to the spot KB was supposed to have stopped or held ground at. He over ran the play and then made it much worse with the bone headed push off. Criticise anything you wish. and you can of course blame TT and or Dennison. I put it on Benjamin. Not the first time he has missed a route. should have made the play. I think it was also the result of the fact that Taylor and Benjamin were née to each other and Benjamin was limited in practice and limited physically. It wasn't the first time this season that they hadn't been on the age page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 7 hours ago, JohnC said: I don't see what was wrong with the call. The qb went to the line with options depending how the Jaguars would line up. Based on the read the qb decided to throw a pass. There was nothing wrong in making basically a jump ball pass to KB whose forte was beating the defender in those types of high/ for grab throws. I'm not criticizing Taylor for the throw. The killer mistake was not the play but the blatant push off by the receiver. That was the glaring mistake that dramatically altered the situation. I'm not a harsh critic of Dennison nor am I a supporter of him. If you want to find things to criticize him over his play calling there are plenty of selections to choose from. On this particular play I don't see why he should warrant any criticism. I cannot fault the play call. i would have preferred a heavy package and run once or twice! Not a Dennison fan. that was a risk play when one was not needed?? 7 hours ago, JohnC said: I don't see what was wrong with the call. The qb went to the line with options depending how the Jaguars would line up. Based on the read the qb decided to throw a pass. There was nothing wrong in making basically a jump ball pass to KB whose forte was beating the defender in those types of high/ for grab throws. I'm not criticizing Taylor for the throw. The killer mistake was not the play but the blatant push off by the receiver. That was the glaring mistake that dramatically altered the situation. I'm not a harsh critic of Dennison nor am I a supporter of him. If you want to find things to criticize him over his play calling there are plenty of selections to choose from. On this particular play I don't see why he should warrant any criticism. I cannot fault the play call. i would have preferred a heavy package and run once or twice! Not a Dennison fan. that was a risk play when one was not needed?? 1 hour ago, JohnC said: How is it a faulty model? What other option do these newspapers have now that the era of paper is sliding into antiquity and oblivion? I recently signed up for the digital NY Times. It took me quite some time to make the decision to pay a price (reasonable in my opinion) for what I used to get free. If a person doesn't want to pay for the service because there are plenty of alternative sources for the material one is interested then that is a personal decision. But it is clear that the trend of paying for digital services is becoming very mainstream. The business model is changing as it is for many other businesses. This is separate observation from the above post but I thought too many of the comments directed toward JoshBarnett were unwarrantedly harsh. It was depicted as if he was hustling people for clicks. I didn't see it that way. It's not surprising to me that a number of the media who have participated on this board have been driven out by uncalled for rudeness. Engaging doesn't require insulting. excellent post in regard to Mr Barnett's position in this matter. and to take a stake in the matter of his intent is a bit crass. I take no issue here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Shaw66 said: It was a push off. Benjamin interfered before he looked for the ball. I think it was also the result of the fact that Taylor and Benjamin were née to each other and Benjamin was limited in practice and limited physically. It wasn't the first time this season that they hadn't been on the age page. I agree Shaw. Injury and reps hurt his( their ) game this year. I hold out hope for next season. But not sold on KB yet. bolded yes, that is why i suspected he was not tight with the play call's options. he seemed to be running his guy off. But it has been awhile since the game and i may be biased lol Edited February 3, 2018 by 3rdand12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 40 minutes ago, Schmuggs said: Lame. Op pays to read that garbage. Lol. Some people just waste and waste and waste. No wonder. Awesome perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I believe both the NY Times and the Washington Post allow a certain number of free articles a month (no registration), which might possibly be a better model. I know TBN has a 2 week free trial, but when one must register and provide a credit card (then remember to cancel) the follow-through might be lower, than just allowing a certain amount of free content. The other thing that bothers me about TBN business model is providing a $10 gift card that represents a significant price break for a year subscription - but only if you're local and use that store. I'm sure they have some sort of sponsorship deal that makes it a good value both ways, but only for locals, so that's an opportunity lost. I agree that news outlets have to figure out a way to make digital readership profitable in order to stay in business. I, too, find some subscriptions worthwhile. The NY Times allows for 10 free articles a month. There is no registration for that free service. If you decide to subscribe the basic service is for $9.99 a month the first year and it will go up to $15.99 a month after that. You pay either by credit card or pay pal. My understanding is that the Buffalo News charges $2.99 a month. I don't understand why so much energy is expended on criticizing a service that is so inexpensive. If a person doesn't want to subscribe to the service then don't. But what is there to complain about. If you don't want it---don't get it. 1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I agree some of the critique here was over the top. I provided mine in PM initially. Of course, rudeness is sometimes a thing here. I cherish the time I was told I was "sucking Ryan Fitzpatrick's d*ck" because I argued against the over-the-top proposition that he was absolutely the worst QB anywhere ever. Sriously peeps? Like, Sriously? I think the bottom line is to participate in any message board long-term, one has to cultivate a certain amount of callus. If you take it too seriously or personally you wear down. I can handle the ruggedness associated with participating in a message board. That's part of the landscape. When the deflategate issue happened I strenuously argued that Brady and the Pats were treated unfairly by the unscrupulous commissioner. That drew plenty of scathing responses. In this SB I'm rooting for the Patriots. So I'm sure that is going to draw some charming responses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 3 hours ago, JaCrispy said: I actually wondered this because I don’t remember the play so clearly...I just remember the pass was wildly inaccurate...but was pass interference committed because he was trying to get to the ball or was it more of a push off? Personally I thought the call was weak but I think they called the push off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaw66 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 35 minutes ago, Scott7975 said: Personally I thought the call was weak but I think they called the push off. It was weak. A push like that often goes uncalled. 2 hours ago, JohnC said: My understanding is that the Buffalo News charges $2.99 a month. I don't understand why so much energy is expended on criticizing a service that is so inexpensive. If a person doesn't want to subscribe to the service then don't. But what is there to complain about. If you don't want it---don't get it. My complaint isn't about the service or the price. They can publish what they want and charge what they want. My problem is some guy from the News coming to this forum and starting a thread that is a teaser and nothing more. He tempts you with an interesting title, then gives you no information other than a link to an article we have to pay for. He didn't come to the forum to talk about the Bills or add anything. He came solely for the purpose of getting people to buy his online service. That's trolling and nothing more. Look at the OP. It doesn't create a discussion topic, it doesn't discuss the Bills in any meaningful way. It doesn't link to an article that's available to all of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 23 minutes ago, Shaw66 said: It was weak. A push like that often goes uncalled. My complaint isn't about the service or the price. They can publish what they want and charge what they want. My problem is some guy from the News coming to this forum and starting a thread that is a teaser and nothing more. He tempts you with an interesting title, then gives you no information other than a link to an article we have to pay for. He didn't come to the forum to talk about the Bills or add anything. He came solely for the purpose of getting people to buy his online service. That's trolling and nothing more. Look at the OP. It doesn't create a discussion topic, it doesn't discuss the Bills in any meaningful way. It doesn't link to an article that's available to all of us. There is a simple solution: Don't respond to him! If he was trying to get people to buy his online service why do you find that so disturbing? There are others who have promoted their twitter or personal sites regarding football. That's not a crime that needs to be policed by self-appointed authorities. Why do you think people like Warrow or another BN sports reporter came here before being driven out? It's certainly not to be around convivial people. They do it to engage and also to enlarge their own followers. That's the world we live in. The notion that in order to post you have to add something of value is a crazy notion, especially on this board. If that was the case many posters would be banned for criminal stupidity. The person in question here could have something to offer. He has responded to questions about stories such as the Watson column. You may not consider that interesting or useful but maybe some others do. This is an open forum. As long as anyone is willing to abide by the TOS then they should be allowed to participate without being rudely harassed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmuggs Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 3 hours ago, Rubes said: Awesome perspective. Thanks Rubinski. Your tactics are useless here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 no it was a blatant push. To help leverage himself and get back to the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Shaw66 said: It was weak. A push like that often goes uncalled. My complaint isn't about the service or the price. They can publish what they want and charge what they want. My problem is some guy from the News coming to this forum and starting a thread that is a teaser and nothing more. He tempts you with an interesting title, then gives you no information other than a link to an article we have to pay for. He didn't come to the forum to talk about the Bills or add anything. He came solely for the purpose of getting people to buy his online service. That's trolling and nothing more. Look at the OP. It doesn't create a discussion topic, it doesn't discuss the Bills in any meaningful way. It doesn't link to an article that's available to all of us. FWIW, I think it may have been well intentioned and just thoughtless. I was thanked for my PM suggesting in future, indicate that the article requires a subscription, and provide a few sentences summary and a quote. Once is a occurance. If it becomes a pattern, then your diagnosis will gain cred. I don't think it will, but I've been wrong before. Edited February 4, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsfanAZ Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 14 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Yep. People forget that it was 1-1 from the 1, and if the PI had not been called, the Bills had 2 or 3 more chances to punch it in from the 1. Don't get the offsides, don't get the PI in that situation - bzzzzzzt Not to mention all the plays and playcalls the rest of the game. Darell Bevell has never wavered from defending his Superbowl pass call that resulted in NE Int, and interestingly, I read a piece where they interviewed 32 coaches and while some critiqued the specific pass call, NONE of them said they would have run against the defensive alignment NE was in (they had Beastmode. Run it). People ignore the fact that even though Taylor decided to throw it instead of run it, he threw a terrible pass that wasnt even close to Benjamin. So if your not going to run it from the 1 yd line to take the lead, at least throw a ball that has a chance of being caught. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rochesterfan Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 11 hours ago, JohnC said: There is a simple solution: Don't respond to him! If he was trying to get people to buy his online service why do you find that so disturbing? There are others who have promoted their twitter or personal sites regarding football. That's not a crime that needs to be policed by self-appointed authorities. Why do you think people like Warrow or another BN sports reporter came here before being driven out? It's certainly not to be around convivial people. They do it to engage and also to enlarge their own followers. That's the world we live in. The notion that in order to post you have to add something of value is a crazy notion, especially on this board. If that was the case many posters would be banned for criminal stupidity. The person in question here could have something to offer. He has responded to questions about stories such as the Watson column. You may not consider that interesting or useful but maybe some others do. This is an open forum. As long as anyone is willing to abide by the TOS then they should be allowed to participate without being rudely harassed. The issue is that this was being discussed in another thread - with the article already linked. The OP did not like the way that was going because once again the BN released a very poorly worded teaser tweet and that caused issues. Josh should not create a thread linking a pay article for his own company. That would be like cover1charging for his service and then linking his coverage - it should be against the terms of service. If someone else wants to link the article or if Josh wants to defend the writers that is fine, but do not link a pay article with no discussion- that is slimy. My biggest issue is this is not the first time a BN article has a teaser sent out that then Josh has to come and defend the coverage because the teaser makes it sound worse and does not meet the point of the article. The issue is they need to do either a better job of tweeting out teaser material or accept the criticisms that come with poorly worded tweets. It happened with the race article and with a McCoy article where the tweet made it sound like a major issue and Josh had to provide better contents to understand it better - to me that is a huge part of the problem - they send out click bait leads and then get upset when people have not read the article get mad. We saw it with Hap just a week or so ago. Maybe the BN needs to do a better job at the click bait or maybe they need some new writers that are not so cynical and already leave a bad taste in people’s mouths. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maine-iac Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, BillsfanAZ said: People ignore the fact that even though Taylor decided to throw it instead of run it, he threw a terrible pass that wasnt even close to Benjamin. So if your not going to run it from the 1 yd line to take the lead, at least throw a ball that has a chance of being caught. https://youtu.be/YdS-UVVRHqA?t=1m4s Just because you are so wrong I figured maybe you hadn't seen the play. Edited February 4, 2018 by Maine-iac 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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