Scott7975 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 People, stop saying we have zero wide recievers. Tyrods numbers were no different when we had Sammy, Harvin, woods, Goodwin and so on. Tyrod is just what he is. That's actually quite wrong. Tyrods numbers were considerably better when Sammy and Woods were both on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steptide Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 he would get smoked.....guy has potential why on earth would anyone want to throw him into this mess of an offence right now is my opinion... Like he'd get sacked 6 times in a game? Oh wait that was our mobile qb Tyrod Taylor. I get it, our offense has its problems. But Tyrod HAS to improve if we're going to have any success this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsmovinup Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 So Tyrods stats have to come with mountains of context about who he is throwing to but Petermans get taken at face value despite him playing with the same kind of receivers that we excuse Tyrod for? I too enjoy double standards I knew this was coming. To be clear I do not see Tyrod as the long term answer and I fully expect the Bills to draft a qb next year. Dont miscontrue my lack of enthusiasm for Peterman as some sort of endorsement of Tyrod. I just dont see any justification to bench Taylor in light of Petermans very substandard numbers in preseason. The guy was a fifth round pick for a reason and did nothing to demonstrate that hes any better than that. Some think we cant do any worse than Tyrod. I think you could do alot worse. We were 3-1 going into yesterday. Not 0-4. You put Peterman in your likely going backwards not forward. Im not ready to pull the plug on the season when we are tied at the top of what looks like a winable division at the moment. Especially for a guy who hit 54 % of his passes in preseason for less than 6 yards per attempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPP Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Like he'd get sacked 6 times in a game? Oh wait that was our mobile qb Tyrod Taylor. I get it, our offense has its problems. But Tyrod HAS to improve if we're going to have any success this year. And how mobile would peterman be compared to taylor on a consistant basis and not on 1 game.....he is known for being quite elusive almost most of the time but wasnt vs the bengals though......fix the offence issues before you throw in a rookie...especially this teams issues....it all starts upfront IMO... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Really? How much different were they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steptide Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 That's actually quite wrong. Tyrods numbers were considerably better when Sammy and Woods were both on the field. Avg yards in 15 and 16 were 208 per game. In today's NFL that's not great. His average this year is 185. That's not an enormous difference seeing as we have way less talent in our wide recievers this year. Trust me, I want nothing more than Tyrod to get this team to the playoffs, but he has to stop being so gun shy. He needs to learn to just sling it, and learn quickly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 And how mobile would peterman be compared to taylor on a consistant basis and not on 1 game.....he is known for being quite elusive almost most of the time but wasnt vs the bengals though......fix the offence issues before you throw in a rookie...especially this teams issues....it all starts upfront IMO... It's not about mobility. It's about pocket awareness and time to throw. Taylor may be an athletic freak, but he makes the OLine look worse than it is because his progression speed is so painfully slow and he holds onto the ball longer than any starting QB in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Really? How much different were they? Good to great WRs make a difference for all QBs, the good QBs make the players around them better. Additionally, virtually no contemporary NFL team has their top WR / TE / RB combo for the whole season, its a casualty of the current NFL culture and schedule. So, the QB needs to be able to elevate the receivers and players AND make do with what you have....successful ones do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 I just dont see any justification to bench Taylor in light of Petermans very substandard numbers in preseason. The guy was a fifth round pick for a reason and did nothing to demonstrate that hes any better than that. Our General Manager would disagree with this statement. "You know what, I wasn't here technically when he was picked," Beane said. "I did follow him. We thought well of him scouting him in Carolina. When I got here, he is better than I expected. The one thing you try to investigate and we only did so much research there, so I didn't know all the intangibles. This guy has the moxie, the pocket presence, the leadership. You see him talk to veteran players, young players, guys of different ranks. Everything. He seems to be natural. They seem to attract. That's what you're looking for in leaders and we know how important the quarterback position is and he's got a lot of that." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Really? How much different were they? Look it up. Don't make lazy false statements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 At least they can see what they have in Peterman. We already know what Taylor is... Yep, but McDermott seems intent on starting certain players, like Tyrod and Ducasse. Now would be the time for a switch with the bye this week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPP Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 (edited) It's not about mobility. It's about pocket awareness and time to throw. Taylor may be an athletic freak, but he makes the OLine look worse than it is because his progression speed is so painfully slow and he holds onto the ball longer than any starting QB in the NFL. Yes i do agree those are some of the faults of taylor....not disputing that...I wished he would throw with quicker anticipation...sometimes wr cant get seperation but to your point they do at times and he does hold onto it which i will admit does get frustrating at times.....all im saying is i dont believe in throwing in a rookie with possible potential in the enviornment we have now....we got a god awful line up front....even worse a WR corp (not the one he seen in pre season at all for the most part),,,,last thing i would want is if he goes in and gets his noggin clocked (which i think is very likely given)....next man up?? Joe Webb? Edited October 10, 2017 by JPP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 I knew this was coming. To be clear I do not see Tyrod as the long term answer and I fully expect the Bills to draft a qb next year. Dont miscontrue my lack of enthusiasm for Peterman as some sort of endorsement of Tyrod. I just dont see any justification to bench Taylor in light of Petermans very substandard numbers in preseason. The guy was a fifth round pick for a reason and did nothing to demonstrate that hes any better than that. Some think we cant do any worse than Tyrod. I think you could do alot worse. We were 3-1 going into yesterday. Not 0-4. You put Peterman in your likely going backwards not forward. Im not ready to pull the plug on the season when we are tied at the top of what looks like a winable division at the moment. Especially for a guy who hit 54 % of his passes in preseason for less than 6 yards per attempt. Because we know Tyrod won't get us anywhere. We don't know what Peterman can do so there is only one way to find out. It's really that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsmovinup Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 (edited) Our General Manager would disagree with this statement. "You know what, I wasn't here technically when he was picked," Beane said. "I did follow him. We thought well of him scouting him in Carolina. When I got here, he is better than I expected. The one thing you try to investigate and we only did so much research there, so I didn't know all the intangibles. This guy has the moxie, the pocket presence, the leadership. You see him talk to veteran players, young players, guys of different ranks. Everything. He seems to be natural. They seem to attract. That's what you're looking for in leaders and we know how important the quarterback position is and he's got a lot of that." So why isnt he the starter? If Beane thinks so highly of him why didnt he start in the opener. GMs and coaches rarely criticize players in public. What exactly do you expect him to say. "Ya. He really sucks but hes the best we got so were just gonna have to hope and pray he never gets in a game. I dont know what we were thinking when we brought TJ Yates in but he sucked so bad we had no choice but to make Peterman #2. The kid should really get his insurance license now cause hell probably be out of the league in two years. Ive heard theyre looking for welders and electricians. Maybe he should look into trade school." Edited October 10, 2017 by Billsmovinup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 (edited) Good to great WRs make a difference for all QBs, the good QBs make the players around them better. Additionally, virtually no contemporary NFL team has their top WR / TE / RB combo for the whole season, its a casualty of the current NFL culture and schedule. So, the QB needs to be able to elevate the receivers and players AND make do with what you have....successful ones do that. Yes, the great QBs make the players around them better. We aren't talking their top WR/TE/RB combo. We are talking about fielding a team full of scrub receivers. Once Clay went out it was over. We have no true #1 receiver when all players are healthy. We have a decent #2 and a bunch of 3's and 4's. The greatest QB of all time threw 1 TD pass this week and his team scored 19 points overall with no Gronk and Edelmen. He still had Cooks who they traded a first round pick for and Hogan and Amendola. Solid 1/2/3. If the greatest of all time only scored 19 points out his top two receivers while still having reasonable receivers on the field... what is an average QB suppose to do with far less? Yes Brady still got yardage, but he was brought back down to earth and looked nowhere near what they normally look like. In 9 games 2015 Brady with Edleman 338.1 ypg 67.8% 24 TDs 3 Ints. 9-0 record In 7 games 2015 Brady without Edelman 246.7 ypg 59.4% 12 TDs 4 Ints 3-4 record That's talking about the greatest of all time. Having receivers makes a difference. Especially for a QB that's just average. Edited October 10, 2017 by Scott7975 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1st Ammendment NoMas Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Playing Peterman is more of an indictment of Rico. Do we trust his system. If Rico's system is so great and Tyrod is not a fit, then we should have success with his QB. If Peterman fails at executing Rico's "system" then its not Tyrod's fault. Rico is just a crappy OC and should get fired. It's Rico or TT to the curb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsmovinup Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 Because we know Tyrod won't get us anywhere. We don't know what Peterman can do so there is only one way to find out. It's really that simple. No. You really dont know that. They beat Atlanta and Denver with Tyrod. They were 7th in scoring last year after 15 weeks with Tyrod. They have a much better chance IMO with Tyrod today than they do with a rookie 5th round qb who has zero starts under his belt. Ill listen to the Peterman argument next year. Id even listen to it if we lose the next four. But not yet. Were tied for first at the moment. Taylor had something to do with that. Our lack of weapons in the passing game are a bigger problem than he is. Again. Tyrods probably not the long term answer but hes our best option at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 So why isnt he the starter? If Beane thinks so highly of him why didnt he start in the opener. GMs and coaches rarely criticize players in public. What exactly do you expect him to say. "Ya. He really sucks but hes the best we got so were just gonna have to hope and pray he never gets in a game. I dont know what we were thinking when we brought TJ Yates in but he sucked so bad we had no choice but to make Peterman #2. The kid should really get his insurance license now cause hell probably be out of the league in two years. Ive heard theyre looking for welders and electricians. Maybe he should look into trade school." You don't think there's a middle ground between effusive praise and "he really sucks"? I mean...come on. Peterman will be starting by December 10th at the very latest and as early as November 12th. Yes, the great QBs make the players around them better. We aren't talking their top WR/TE/RB combo. We are talking about fielding a team full of scrub receivers. Once Clay went out it was over. We have no true #1 receiver when all players are healthy. We have a decent #2 and a bunch of 3's and 4's. The greatest QB of all time threw 1 TD pass this week and his team scored 19 points overall with no Gronk and Edelmen. He still had Cooks who they traded a first round pick for and Hogan and Amendola. Solid 1/2/3. If the greatest of all time only scored 19 points out his top two receivers while still having reasonable receivers on the field... what is an average QB suppose to do with far less? Yes Brady still got yardage, but he was brought back down to earth and looked nowhere near what they normally look like. In 9 games 2015 Brady with Edleman 338.1 ypg 67.8% 24 TDs 3 Ints. 9-0 record In 7 games 2015 Brady without Edelman 246.7 ypg 59.4% 12 TDs 4 Ints 3-4 record That's talking about the greatest of all time. Having receivers makes a difference. Especially for a QB that's just average. We're not talking one game here. Taylor's fatal flaws have been on display for more than two years now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM2009 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 No. You really dont know that. They beat Atlanta and Denver with Tyrod. They were 7th in scoring last year after 15 weeks with Tyrod. They have a much better chance IMO with Tyrod today than they do with a rookie 5th round qb who has zero starts under his belt. Ill listen to the Peterman argument next year. Id even listen to it if we lose the next four. But not yet. Were tied for first at the moment. Taylor had something to do with that. Our lack of weapons in the passing game are a bigger problem than he is. Again. Tyrods probably not the long term answer but hes our best option at the moment. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 You don't think there's a middle ground between effusive praise and "he really sucks"? I mean...come on. Peterman will be starting by December 10th at the very latest and as early as November 12th. We're not talking one game here. Taylor's fatal flaws have been on display for more than two years now. I never said Tyrod didn't have flaws. I fully want them to draft their guy. I'm simply saying, and it should be freaking obvious, that having receiving targets makes a difference. It makes a difference for Tyrod. It makes a difference for Brady. It makes a difference for every damn QB out there. We are fielding the worst wr core in the league and people are holding Tyrod to a standard that he shouldn't be held to. I would be hard pressed to say Brady would do anything with this group and this oline. I think people are too hard on him. That's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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