Do You BitCoin?

[ExiledInIllinois]

"The Congress shall have Power To...coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin.... Congress's power to coin money is exclusive: under Article I, Section 10, the states are not permitted to "coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; [or] make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts...."

 

How does new currency get around that?

[PolishDave]

4 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

"The Congress shall have Power To...coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin.... Congress's power to coin money is exclusive: under Article I, Section 10, the states are not permitted to "coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; [or] make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts...."

 

How does new currency get around that?

The states aren't coining money.   

 

It is an international currency - unregulated - that exists simply because enough people agree that they want it to exist and agree to value it enough to accept it as a medium of exchange.

 

And those people are anonymous.  Only time they aren't is when two people make a transaction.   Then they may or may not know who the other person is depending on the nature of the transaction.

[Foxx]

while not a direct correlation, ever hear of Ithaca Dollars? what about Burlington Bread? Berkshares?

 

what is illegal is issuing a currency that is in direct competition with the US Dollar.

 

GUS classifies Bitcoin and 'other' coins (Ethereum, DASH, Litecoin and so on) as property that must be reported to the IRS.

[BuffaloBill]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-11-26/what-the-world-s-central-banks-are-saying-about-cryptocurrencies?utm_source=yahoo&utm_medium=bd&utm_campaign=headline&cmpId=yhoo.headline&yptr=yahoo

 

Bitcoin article - seems like central banks around the world are generally coming around to the idea of crypto currency but with trepidation.

[row_33]

my former colleague full-bore into bitcoin has shifted gears to blockchain work, he's got a nice gig traveling around the world lecturing and setting things up

 

blockchain is the best thing to come out of this.

 

[Foxx]

7 hours ago, row_33 said:

my former colleague full-bore into bitcoin has shifted gears to blockchain work, he's got a nice gig traveling around the world lecturing and setting things up

 

blockchain is the best thing to come out of this.

 

to come out of this? it was the predecessor to it all. without the blockchain, there are no crypto currencies. the blockchain is the brilliance behind it all.

 

if anyone is looking for a field to get into that is going to pay you well, writing code for smart contracts is it.

Edited November 27, 2017 by Foxx

[ExiledInIllinois]

Do I need "real" money to get into Bitcoin.  Can I just use my labor to get into it. 

 

Can I borrow a computer and make?  I will pay you back in bitcoin.

[Foxx]

17 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

Do I need "real" money to get into Bitcoin.  Can I just use my labor to get into it. 

 

Can I borrow a computer and make?  I will pay you back in bitcoin.

 

 

i know alot of people that are getting paid in bitcoin for their labor. talk to your boss.

Edited November 27, 2017 by Foxx

[ExiledInIllinois]

5 minutes ago, Foxx said:

 

 

i know alot of people that are getting paid in bitcoin for their labor. talk to your boss.

But I wanna "mine" it.  What do I need?

[Foxx]

8 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

But I wanna "mine" it.  What do I need?

mining equipment. ASIC's are not cheap. if you would like to mine something that is ASIC resistant, you can set up your own rig with GPU's and mine something like Monero, ZCash or Bitcoin Gold. GPU rigs are somewhat cheaper than ASICs but they will still cost you. Youtube is full of videos on how to build a GPU mining rig.

 

if you would like a url for the ASIC's let me know and i can provide that. 

Edited November 27, 2017 by Foxx

[Jauronimo]

1 hour ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

Do I need "real" money to get into Bitcoin.  Can I just use my labor to get into it. 

 

Can I borrow a computer and make?  I will pay you back in bitcoin.

If you borrow my computer and mine bitcoin and that bitcoin generates value for you in excess of what you pay me for renting my computer then you've created surplus value, and that's not cool at all, man!  Think of it as borrowing a man's hammer.  Its no different.  A guy borrows a hammer, builds a few houses, charges rent, and one day owns the whole the city!! That's f@#$ed up!

 

 

I do not bitcoin yet but I do Ethereum and transferred some money to my account for the purposes of doing bitcoin in the near future should another buying opportunity present itself. 

 

I think ETH looks like a decent hold in the mid-term and BTC represents an attractive day short term trading option.  Crazy volatility.  I'm also looking at LTC which seems to track BTC but with a healthy lag.  This run up in crypto currency values is ridiculous.  Still figuring out how I want to approach the game.

[PolishDave]

2 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

But I wanna "mine" it.  What do I need?

 

You also need to pay attention to how much your electricity costs.

 

If you try to mine cryptocurrency with computer equipment that is insufficient in terms of processing power per watt of electricity used,  then you can actually spend more in electricity than you get paid by mining.

 

If you are going to mine with a computer or a video card, the computers' CPU must be nearly the latest greatest to be worthwhile at all.   And the video card would typically needs to be very powerful if you are going to use that.

 

If you are using something like an Intel Core I5 or I7 running at 3.5 and 4.0 Ghz, you are likely not going to earn even a dollar a day.    If you are using a super high end video card - like an Nvidia GTX 1080 or something thereabouts - you can earn a few dollars per day.  The electricity to run that card will cost you 50 cents per day.   And if you go look at the costs of a decent GTX 1080 card, you will see that right now they cost upwards of $700 just for that card.

 

If you mine with a weaker card that uses last years' technology - you can get a cheaper one - say around $100 - but that card will earn less than a buck per day and have an electricity cost of say 20 cents per day or so.

 

And you still need the other hardware to go with it - like a computer with a good power supply.

 

This is why guys build mining rigs that have a dozen video cards running in them .    But even one of those rigs can easily run you into several thousand dollars if you are going to use high end video cards and a powerful trustworthy power supply. 

 

And running high end video cards 24/7 tends to shorten their life substantially.   They already run hot as it is.  

[BeginnersMind]

10 hours ago, Foxx said:

 

 

i know alot of people that are getting paid in bitcoin for their labor. talk to your boss.

 

What is a lot, and their yearly income levels (in USD)?

[BuffaloBill]

Square (SQ) took a hard hit yesterday due most likely to an analyst indicating it has had an overexhuberent Run-Up as a result of Bitcoin.  Square created bitcoin tools and as a result has become a popular, if not speculative stock, that is a play on Bitcoin without directly playing Bitcoin.  

 

Many are starting to claim that Bitcoin is the newest version of the Tulip.  Only time will tell if it is speculative hype or at a valuation that is sustainable.   

[row_33]

17 hours ago, Foxx said:

to come out of this? it was the predecessor to it all. without the blockchain, there are no crypto currencies. the blockchain is the brilliance behind it all.

 

if anyone is looking for a field to get into that is going to pay you well, writing code for smart contracts is it.

 

I was on the fringe of it all as it started, and never heard about the blockchain for awhile after I was aware of bitcoin.

 

 

 

 

my friend was known as an excellent code writer, freely stated by everyone who ever worked with him, and they tend to be a bit snippy and jealous

 

[Foxx]

10 hours ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

What is a lot, and their yearly income levels (in USD)?

a lot is a matter of perspective. i am involved with a group of people from all around the world of which one of our main focuses is the blockchain and the cryptoverse. 

 

Let Me Google That for You

 

 

4 hours ago, row_33 said:

 

I was on the fringe of it all as it started, and never heard about the blockchain for awhile after I was aware of bitcoin.

 

 

 

 

my friend was known as an excellent code writer, freely stated by everyone who ever worked with him, and they tend to be a bit snippy and jealous

 

your friend is going to be very happy with what happens this coming year.

Edited November 28, 2017 by Foxx

[Foxx]

6 hours ago, BuffaloBill said:

Square (SQ) took a hard hit yesterday due most likely to an analyst indicating it has had an overexhuberent Run-Up as a result of Bitcoin.  Square created bitcoin tools and as a result has become a popular, if not speculative stock, that is a play on Bitcoin without directly playing Bitcoin.  

 

Many are starting to claim that Bitcoin is the newest version of the Tulip.  Only time will tell if it is speculative hype or at a valuation that is sustainable.   

lets look a little deeper than what the analyst's indicate. Square unveiled a new app to select users around Nov 14th. this new app let users buy and hold Bitcoin. when word got out they had begun doing this, their stock rose approximately 16%. when BTIG rated them a sell, they lost the 16% they had gained. they are still up 212% on the year. so.... are they up or are they down?

 

the Tulip bubble is not a good comparrison here. if you are looking for something that may be close, it would have to be the .com Bubble of the turn of the century. this however, is quite different. the world is going digital and has been for sometime. it is a good thing that it is beginning in the public community at large rather than in a banksters back room. i don't think the powers that be are stupid enough to try and outlaw it, because they know they won't be able to enforce it. you remember Napster and Mega Upload, right? do you think people stopped downloading files? 

Edited November 28, 2017 by Foxx

[BuffaloBill]

3 minutes ago, Foxx said:

lets look a little deeper than what the analyst's indicate. Square unveiled a new app to select users around Nov 14th. this new app let users buy and hold Bitcoin. when word got out they had begun doing this, their stock rose approximately 16%. when BTIG rated them a sell, they lost the 16% they had gained. they are still up 212% on the year. so.... are they up or are they down?

 

the Tulip bubble is not a good comparrison here. if you are looking for something that may be close, it would have to be the .com Bubble of the turn of the century. this however, is quite different. the world is going digital and has been for sometime. it is a good thing that it is beginning in the public community at large rather than in a banksters back room. i don't think the powers that be are stupid enough to try and outlaw it, because they know they won't be able to enforce it. you remember Napster and Mega Upload, right? do you think people stopped downloading files? 

 

 

No argument on SQ.  It’s back up a bit today.

 

Bitcoin is nothing like the .com era.... nothing.  In the .com era nearly everybody was investing or claiming they were investing.  Valuations and multiples were essentially meaningless. To me, BBitcoin may prove the test of time but it is looking very speculative at the moment.

[Foxx]

20 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

No argument on SQ.  It’s back up a bit today.

 

Bitcoin is nothing like the .com era.... nothing.  In the .com era nearly everybody was investing or claiming they were investing.  Valuations and multiples were essentially meaningless. To me, BBitcoin may prove the test of time but it is looking very speculative at the moment.

lol. well if the .com is nothing like it. the tulip mania is even further removed.

 

i can't tell you what to do when it comes to Bitcoin, you have to figure that out for yourself. i guess the only question that really matters is, can you afford not to get involved?

 

today is very likely '$10,000 Bitcoin Day'. remember that. 

 

ETA: today is, '$10,000 Bitcoin Day'. it hit early this morning.

Edited November 28, 2017 by Foxx

[row_33]

Foxx, he was already born into a lot of $$$ and has a personality that shuts out human interaction and geeks out totally, so he was always going to find some fulfillment in his work, not sure if "happy" is part of his existence though.

 

[Foxx]

5 minutes ago, row_33 said:

Foxx, he was already born into a lot of $$$ and has a personality that shuts out human interaction and geeks out totally, so he was always going to find some fulfillment in his work, not sure if "happy" is part of his existence though.

 

my best to your friend, Row.

 

[BeginnersMind]

49 minutes ago, Foxx said:

a lot is a matter of perspective. i am involved with a group of people from all around the world of which one of our main focuses is the blockchain and the cryptoverse. 

 

Let Me Google That for You

 

 

So you based your statement that "i know alot of people that are getting paid in bitcoin for their labor"  on a group of people you know whose "main focuses is the blockchain and the cryptoverse."

 

Very, very, very few people get paid in bitcoin because, you know, almost no one takes it as a form of payment and almost no one uses it to pay their bills, especially their business-related bills. 

 

I know a lot about alternative currencies. Let's not kid ourselves that they have caught on, or that they might have some serious growing pains (or terminations) in the future. It's a seriously speculative investment and shouldn't be presented as anything other than that. 

 

 

Edited November 28, 2017 by BeginnersMind

[row_33]

13 minutes ago, Foxx said:

my best to your friend, Row.

 

 

I'm proud of him and enjoy the distance between us the last few years. 

 

[Foxx]

2 hours ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

So you based your statement that "i know alot of people that are getting paid in bitcoin for their labor"  on a group of people you know whose "main focuses is the blockchain and the cryptoverse."

 

Very, very, very few people get paid in bitcoin because, you know, almost no one takes it as a form of payment and almost no one uses it to pay their bills, especially their business-related bills. 

 

I know a lot about alternative currencies. Let's not kid ourselves that they have caught on, or that they might have some serious growing pains (or terminations) in the future. It's a seriously speculative investment and shouldn't be presented as anything other than that. 

 

 

might i suggest that you do not know as much as you think you do. remember, a lot is a perspective issue.

 

here is a little, 'perspective' for you...

 

BITCOIN Accepted Here

 

Amazon Subsidiary Registers Cryptocurrency and Ethereum Domains

 

this is going to be an absolutely big year for the cryptoverse.

Edited November 28, 2017 by Foxx

[BuffaloBill]

1 hour ago, Foxx said:

lol. well if the .com is nothing like it. the tulip mania is even further removed.

 

i can't tell you what to do when it comes to Bitcoin, you have to figure that out for yourself. i guess the only question that really matters is, can you afford not to get involved?

 

today is very likely '$10,000 Bitcoin Day'. remember that. 

 

ETA: today is, '$10,000 Bitcoin Day'. it hit early this morning.

 

OK.  

 

Anyway, I invest in what I have spent time to learn and understand.  I am by no means an expert but have done well at what I opt to focus on.  The biggest lesson for me is that no matter what you invest in, take the emotion out of it, set your rules and follow them.  Generally when I’ve done this I’ve made money.  Always, when I have not done this I’ve come up on the short side.

 

Sounds like you’ve spent time understanding the Bitcoin world.  Hope it goes well for you.

[Foxx]

1 hour ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

OK.  

 

Anyway, I invest in what I have spent time to learn and understand.  I am by no means an expert but have done well at what I opt to focus on.  The biggest lesson for me is that no matter what you invest in, take the emotion out of it, set your rules and follow them.  Generally when I’ve done this I’ve made money.  Always, when I have not done this I’ve come up on the short side.

 

Sounds like you’ve spent time understanding the Bitcoin world.  Hope it goes well for you.

cheers man, it's all good. and thank you for your kind words.

 

you have the proper perspective. i would only urge you to look a little deeper into the cryptoverse.

[Foxx]

[Jauronimo]

Flashcrash today.  BTC has fluctuated from north of 11,000 to sub 9,000 in a matter of minutes.  Good thing exchanges crashed too so I couldn't do anything with this situation.

[Foxx]

 

26 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

Flashcrash today.  BTC has fluctuated from north of 11,000 to sub 9,000 in a matter of minutes.  Good thing exchanges crashed too so I couldn't do anything with this situation.

buying opportunity

 

Edited November 29, 2017 by Foxx

[Jauronimo]

11 minutes ago, Foxx said:

 

buying opportunity

 

It would've been a nice opportunity for many.  Just not those who use coinbase.

[plenzmd1]

12 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

It would've been a nice opportunity for many.  Just not those who use coinbase.

That is too GD funny!Been trying for an hour!

 

But scary for many, especially if they wanted to sell at $11,000, not to funny then i guess.

 

Read yesterday be able to buy options and futures on this pretty shortly, and that is really the way I want to go on this.

 

Anybody trade futures on BITMEX?

Edited November 29, 2017 by plenzmd1

[Foxx]

18 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

It would've been a nice opportunity for many.  Just not those who use coinbase.

with Coinbase, you can link your credit card and get a near instantaneous deposit. yes it costs you 3.9% but it can pay for itself. on the otherhand, it has paid off to wait for the ACH to clear as well but more often than not, I find that when I want to add fiat to the game, it pays dividends to get it in as soon as i can. 

Edited November 29, 2017 by Foxx

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Here's how I know Bitcoin isn't for me:

 

One of my absolutely computer-illiterate customers called me today and asked me if I was into bitcoin. I told her no and told her why not (mainly the future of quantum computation rendering it valueless). She told me I need to put 10k into it.

 

I just laughed and hung up the phone.

 

If THAT woman is involved, and she can't even manage her email client or CRM software, then it's clearly a hype machine.

 

[Jauronimo]

1 minute ago, plenzmd1 said:

That is too GD funny!Been trying for an hour!

I had a different descriptor.  Infuriating. 

 

I was furiously clicking buy and the thing crashed and locked me out until the price point I wanted had long since passed.

3 minutes ago, Foxx said:

with Coinbase, you can link your credit card and get a near instantaneous deposit. yes it costs you 3.9% but it can pay for itself. on the otherhand, it has paid off to wait for the ACH to clear as well but more often than not, I find that when I want to add fiat to the game, it pays dividends to get it in as soon as i can. 

Doesn't do you any good if you can't login.

[Foxx]

Just now, Jauronimo said:

I had a different descriptor.  Infuriating. 

 

I was furiously clicking buy and the thing crashed and locked me out until the price point I wanted had long since passed.

Doesn't do you any good if you can't login.

yeah, they are ill equiped for the oncoming rush.

 

it was a couple weeks ago maybe(?) they had 100k sign up in one day!

[plenzmd1]

I have no clue what quantam computation is, and I do believe there may an opportunity short term to sell the top, but in the research, I have done in the last few days I cannot see crypto going away. Every major exchange will be listing bitcoin futures in the very near future is a very good sign it aint going away. 

 

Trying to figure out the proper valuation and such is the tricky part

[Foxx]

for those of you who don't understand Bitcoin, you have to listen to Andreas explain it. 

 

25 minutes well spent.

 

[row_33]

12 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

Here's how I know Bitcoin isn't for me:

 

One of my absolutely computer-illiterate customers called me today and asked me if I was into bitcoin. I told her no and told her why not (mainly the future of quantum computation rendering it valueless). She told me I need to put 10k into it.

 

I just laughed and hung up the phone.

 

If THAT woman is involved, and she can't even manage her email client or CRM software, then it's clearly a hype machine.

 

 

It's time to get out of the "insider" investment when the taxi drivers and homeless and other types are telling you about how great it is.

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, plenzmd1 said:

I have no clue what quantam computation is, and I do believe there may an opportunity short term to sell the top, but in the research, I have done in the last few days I cannot see crypto going away. Every major exchange will be listing bitcoin futures in the very near future is a very good sign it aint going away. 

 

Trying to figure out the proper valuation and such is the tricky part

 

Do some looking into QC. When a computer can solve ANY crypto problem pretty much instantly, there's a real problem.

 

And I'm one who thinks it's not more than 10 years off.

 

1 minute ago, row_33 said:

 

It's time to get out of the "insider" investment when the taxi drivers and homeless and other types are telling you about how great it is.

 

 

This guy gets it.

 

[Foxx]

Just now, joesixpack said:

 

Do some looking into QC. When a computer can solve ANY crypto problem pretty much instantly, there's a real problem.

 

And I'm one who thinks it's not more than 10 years off.

 

lol. 10 years in computer science is an eternity. there are going to be so many changes in 10 years you won't recognize any of it.