Big Gun Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 You did say, ever. And he's only started two years. And has comeback in those two years. Bigger point is did we ever run either of these plays when trying to comeback ? Notice the glaring lack of a reverse to a back-up RB, no QB draw into a D that - along with everyone else in the building - knew was coming ? and the seed he threw long on a D that wasn't expecting it ? We never do this. Guess I can't assume we are talking about the NFL here as it doesn't fit your narrative. Resume kinda lacking! 7 year vet and 29 starts in the NFL and you need to go back to his junior year of college against a bunch of nobodies, save N Suh, to find an answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 #1 - the fact that a new coach had a brief meet & greet with the current starting QB who presumably is still using the facilities to rehab is no indication one way or the other of future intentions. #2- having said that, I came away with the impression McDermott already knows the bills are moving on from TT. You might be right......but after this fanbase just watched an arrogant HC destroy a very good defense to put his own stamp on it...........if this high scoring offense goes in the tank the honeymoon will be over in September and fans will be filing for divorce before thanksgiving. Choose wisely Dermott McSean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Syracuse Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 My Jerry Sullivan question for McDermott would be: "Will you be using the same methodical approach of evaluation that brought you to the conclusion that Josh Norman was only good because he was in YOUR scheme." Greggo exuded the same confidence in his process. Then he hired a bad staff and the next thing you know he's got the hated fat guys on his DL and he'd lost control of his D to Dick LeBeau. Gailey needed to take an entire SEASON to evaluate his personnel. We've seen some doozies Dermott McSean......your "I know what a winner looks and tastes like" is just BS rhetoric if you don't show US what a winner looks like. This really isn't fair, it wasn't McDermott's decision to let Norman walk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 Moving on to who and moving on why? Considering the options it's !@#$ing stupid to move on from Tyrod. Having said that, count on the Bills being !@#$ing stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 (edited) You might be right......but after this fanbase just watched an arrogant HC destroy a very good defense to put his own stamp on it...........if this high scoring offense goes in the tank the honeymoon will be over in September and fans will be filing for divorce before thanksgiving. Choose wisely Dermott McSean. And that's why fans aren't coaching or managing teams. There is no parallel between Rex and McDermott - McDermott is not a coach with an offensive background , so he will not exactly be putting " his offense" in a la Rex with the defense. The offense did well with what they were working with. Perhaps McDermott does not believe Tyrod can lead a team to a division title or a championship. He may not be back. Since the offense was had one of the better seasons in franchise history , it's likely that the following year would trend downward, even if every piece was kept in place. The Pegulas wanted the Rex hire to be a long term one, and realized the error of their ways. Fortunately they ended the marriage early rather than let it fester too long. This hire, like it or not, is a " reset" by the Pegulas. Can't let sqeaking into a wild card spot for an early exit ( Dolphins, anyone? ) become an obsession that gets in the way of their initial goals. Stability at the Head Coaching spot, and a culture change long term. Sexy Rexys uber laid back and casual style was not what they were looking for , and it showed in the constant game day clutter and confusion. I'm willing to give this some time , it doesn't look like a square - peg round hole Ryan situation redux. Build a program and get it right. The only thing last season or the last 15 have shown is that the team's personnel is good enough to go .500 or thereabouts . Edited January 14, 2017 by Boatdrinks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 Moving on to who and moving on why? Considering the options it's !@#$ing stupid to move on from Tyrod. Having said that, count on the Bills being !@#$ing stupid. I give whaley about a 10% chance of finding another QB as good or better than TT. I say whaley has about a 90% chance of getting fired this time next year without TT. McDermott is here to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 This really isn't fair, it wasn't McDermott's decision to let Norman walk. Nope. The GM and organization obviously had a number they were willing to pay for a DB. Thinking that losing one player ( Norman , a DB nonetheless ) was responsible for thePanthers collapsing from a Super Bowl to a non playoff season is as simplistic as thinking Norman's arrival to the Redskins would punch their ticket to the postseason. He's a corner, not a Quarterback. And a defensive coordinator is not going to overrule a GM on signing a player or not. You work with the players they give you. I wouldn't want a coach that thought his defense depended on a particular CB to be a success. Arrogance and confidence / belief in a defensive system are not the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 Moving on to who and moving on why? Considering the options it's !@#$ing stupid to move on from Tyrod. Having said that, count on the Bills being !@#$ing stupid. Or is it. If you don't believe Taylor is a playoff/ Super Bowl caliber QB or that he can be, why stay with him? If he's " just good enough to get you beat" that cannot be the goal. So the " options" might be better - short term or long. Would a high draft pick QB be better than Taylor ( initially or eventually) ? It is possible , though I don't know what the % chance would be. Would a potential trade for a QB (Cutler, Romo, et al) be better? Depends who you ask, and many different GMs would probably have a different answer . So if the Bills don't do as you would, they are " stupid" . Got it. McDermott can't worry about fans or whatever, he has to think about building a winner and winning a championship. If he doesn't believe that Tyrod can get him there, then move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 (edited) Moving on to who and moving on why? Considering the options it's !@#$ing stupid to move on from Tyrod. Having said that, count on the Bills being !@#$ing stupid.👍🏻 Hope so. You being positive about a Bills player weirds me out. Strange thats it's a mediocre to poor qb you chose. Might as well give you more to hate. Mitch T/Deshaun/Mahomes baaaaaabeeeee. Edited January 14, 2017 by Ryan L Billz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 This really isn't fair, it wasn't McDermott's decision to let Norman walk. What we do know is it happened and it was because of misguided over-confidence in their defensive system. Fair or unfair wgas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 (edited) And that's why fans aren't coaching or managing teams. There is no parallel between Rex and McDermott - McDermott is not a coach with an offensive background , so he will not exactly be putting " his offense" in a la Rex with the defense. The offense did well with what they were working with. Perhaps McDermott does not believe Tyrod can lead a team to a division title or a championship. He may not be back. Since the offense was had one of the better seasons in franchise history , it's likely that the following year would trend downward, even if every piece was kept in place. The Pegulas wanted the Rex hire to be a long term one, and realized the error of their ways. Fortunately they ended the marriage early rather than let it fester too long. This hire, like it or not, is a " reset" by the Pegulas. Can't let sqeaking into a wild card spot for an early exit ( Dolphins, anyone? ) become an obsession that gets in the way of their initial goals. Stability at the Head Coaching spot, and a culture change long term. Sexy Rexys uber laid back and casual style was not what they were looking for , and it showed in the constant game day clutter and confusion. I'm willing to give this some time , it doesn't look like a square - peg round hole Ryan situation redux. Build a program and get it right. The only thing last season or the last 15 have shown is that the team's personnel is good enough to go .500 or thereabouts . 1) If he changes something that is working for what he thinks is better that is putting his stamp on it. If you feel assured by the fact that he's not coming from the offensive side of the ball then you didn't listen to his PC. 2) OMG you have battered bills fan syndrome. Bills fans can't have nice things.....it's just not sustainable in your mind. The offense has been very effective for two years......DESPITE rarely having all of it's key pieces on the field at the same time.........perhaps the boat drinks are giving you amnesia? Not only were they 7th in the league in scoring after 15 games but they had turned the ball over less than any offense since the AFL/NFL merger! But by all means.......blow it up. Edited January 14, 2017 by #BADOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 1) If he changes something that is working for what he thinks is better that is putting his stamp on it. If you feel assured by the fact that he's not coming from the offensive side of the ball then you didn't listen to his PC. 2) OMG you have battered bills fan syndrome. Bills fans can't have nice things.....it's just not sustainable in your mind. The offense has been very effective for two years......DESPITE rarely having all of it's key pieces on the field at the same time.........perhaps the boat drinks are giving you amnesia? Not only were they 7th in the league in scoring after 15 games but they had turned the ball over less than any offense since the AFL/NFL merger! But by all means.......blow it up. No one has ever told Whaley and Pegula don't fix what ain't broke. But here we are. Lessons not learned. Again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 1) If he changes something that is working for what he thinks is better that is putting his stamp on it. If you feel assured by the fact that he's not coming from the offensive side of the ball then you didn't listen to his PC. 2) OMG you have battered bills fan syndrome. Bills fans can't have nice things.....it's just not sustainable in your mind. The offense has been very effective for two years......DESPITE rarely having all of it's key pieces on the field at the same time.........perhaps the boat drinks are giving you amnesia? Not only were they 7th in the league in scoring after 15 games but they had turned the ball over less than any offense since the AFL/NFL merger! But by all means.......blow it up. I can't even believe they are considering it. I'm still a Whaley fan even though he's obviously made mistakes, but he loses my support if he blows this offense up. Unless he pulls off something unforeseen that nets us a solid starter. That's highly unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 Im not against drafting a qb......but I really think moving on from a solid starter would be a huge mistake..... Say what you want about Tyrods passing yardage....he is in fact a solid starter in the right system Draft a successor....by all means do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 (edited) Im not against drafting a qb......but I really think moving on from a solid starter would be a huge mistake..... Say what you want about Tyrods passing yardage....he is in fact a solid starter in the right system Draft a successor....by all means do it We've already ditched the offense that TT was semi-successful in. We're tossing out the baby with the bathwater. And still trying to "win now." The Pegulas and Doug have screwed up again. "Hey what unit was decent last season? Okay, fire all those guys and switch everything around. Playoffs this year baby!" - Pegs and DW in 2014 and 2016. Terrible. Edited January 14, 2017 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 We've already ditched the offense that TT was semi-successful in. We're tossing out the baby with the bathwater. And still trying to "win now." The Pegulas and Doug have screwed up again. "Hey what unit was decent last season? Okay, fire all those guys and switch everything around. Playoffs this year baby!" - Pegs and DW in 2014 and 2016. Terrible. The Bills offense was flawed. You simply can not win 10 games in this league when your QB relies on his running with the ball skills as much as his throwing the ball skills. In those "must win" games against teams that are as good or better than the Bills, they always seemed to get the short end of the stick because Taylor could not deliver TDs and points when it counted the most. This isn't to put the blame entirely on him, it's to point out that in this league your QB needs to win the game in the fourth quarter in close or comeback situations at least 3 times if you're going to make the playoffs. We all like Taylor the person, but I think the team that goes with him as their starter next year (this includes the Broncos) is not going to make the playoffs because he just can't do it in crunch time against good teams. If they keep Taylor, then I'll just have to hope that his game can reach a new level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 The Bills offense was flawed. You simply can not win 10 games in this league when your QB relies on his running with the ball skills as much as his throwing the ball skills. In those "must win" games against teams that are as good or better than the Bills, they always seemed to get the short end of the stick because Taylor could not deliver TDs and points when it counted the most. This isn't to put the blame entirely on him, it's to point out that in this league your QB needs to win the game in the fourth quarter in close or comeback situations at least 3 times if you're going to make the playoffs. We all like Taylor the person, but I think the team that goes with him as their starter next year (this includes the Broncos) is not going to make the playoffs because he just can't do it in crunch time against good teams. If they keep Taylor, then I'll just have to hope that his game can reach a new level. That's ridiculous. We win 10-11 games this year with any decent defense and TT playing exactly as he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 (edited) The Bills offense was flawed. You simply can not win 10 games in this league when your QB relies on his running with the ball skills as much as his throwing the ball skills. In those "must win" games against teams that are as good or better than the Bills, they always seemed to get the short end of the stick because Taylor could not deliver TDs and points when it counted the most. This isn't to put the blame entirely on him, it's to point out that in this league your QB needs to win the game in the fourth quarter in close or comeback situations at least 3 times if you're going to make the playoffs. We all like Taylor the person, but I think the team that goes with him as their starter next year (this includes the Broncos) is not going to make the playoffs because he just can't do it in crunch time against good teams. If they keep Taylor, then I'll just have to hope that his game can reach a new level. I agree, it was flawed. And it was not going to win a Superbowl. But that's irrelevant. It was good enough to back into the playoffs and maybe win a game there with a great defense. We had the #1 rushing attack in the NFL by a lot. There was enough salvageable there to not blow it up. Do I think TT was the long-term answer? No. However, if the Bills were gearing up for a 2017 playoff push, which they are (a mistake but an understandable one), the move is not to bandaid the defense which sucked and rip out the whole offense. You put the best team possible forward. They are going to make the fatal mistake of taking a day 3 QB, keeping TT and changing his system. And I don't think anyone can argue that TT is at his most effective throwing the ball 15 times, and helping McCoy and TD Mike find wide open lanes because he's a threat to run. This is nothing new with the Bills. They did it 2014. Our owners and GM fundamentally do not the importance of continuity when things are okay. They have proved it again and again. Personally, I don't think it much matters because the 2014 defense is dead and gone and this group won't play to that level in 2 years or so. But if they revert to 2014 form with draft adds and FA's, which I think Whaley is banking on, and your goal is to make the playoffs, you do not destroy an offense top 10 in points scored. And that's not just TT. You can ditch him, get a guy like Watson, Romo, Rivers, and still keep the O together. But ditching the OC and his system and the QB is a recipe for disaster. TL;DR You change schemes, coaches and key players drastically when units SUCK, not when they have numerous tangible positives. Edited January 14, 2017 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 That's ridiculous. We win 10-11 games this year with any decent defense and TT playing exactly as he did. IMO, the defensive collapse in the Oakland game was because that side of the ball saw Taylor's blank stare and they knew he had no answer. He was done. It was like popping a balloon with a needle. Taylor has only 2 fourth quarter comebacks in 29 game starts. Just think about that. Fans can twist and turn Taylor's numbers as much as they like, but the name of the NFL game is winning the game in crunch time. If your QB can not do that, then you are not going to make the playoffs unless you play in the AFC south division. Is he never going to get to the next level of putting the team on his shoulders and winning the tough games? I don't know, but that's his major flaw and it's a very bad one to have. If he's a Bill next year I'll be rooting for him and hoping he can do it. That's just how I feel about it. I do like the guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 IMO, the defensive collapse in the Oakland game was because that side of the ball saw Taylor's blank stare and they knew he had no answer. He was done. It was like popping a balloon with a needle. Yeah. That was it. Otherwise the defense may have pitched a shutout. You convinced me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts