Jim Kelly on espn about our situation 1/4

[Maury Ballstein]

Sorry but STFU Jim- you always love the hires then hop on the fire bandwagon.

Unreal. Jim is 2000% right.

 

All the TT fanboys on Bills mafia are trashing Kelly too.

[Billschinatown]

I blame the BN for what Kelly said.

the BN is behind this.

I bet the BN has sources feeding Kelly bogus info.

BN!!!!!

 

It apparently wasn’t a coincidence that Kelly blurted out Tebow’s name; Kelly’s wife has disclosed on her Twitter page that the former Bills signal-caller had dinner on Sunday night with Tebow.

“JK is on his way home from having dinner with Tim Tebow,” Jill Kelly writes. “I can’t wait to get the full scoop! Can’t wait for draft day!”

 

you have to look at the top three quarterbacks in the draft, really study them. And you look for a guy

with good character, good leadership ability and good arm strength —

and a guy who doesn’t come from California.”

 

Jim Kelly good quarterback. Bad scout.

Edited January 5, 2017 by Billschinatown

[hondo in seattle]

Doesn't mean he is terrible either...and advanced metrics show regardless of what you think he is much better than most give him credit for...

 

I'll also point out that Aaron Rodgers stats playing without Jordy Nelson last year were near identical to Tyrods from a completion percentage, yards per attempt and TD/INT percentage this year(Tyrods were actually better in most categories)...

 

Is he anywhere near that level...no. That's the whole point...if Rogers can struggle badly without Nelson in an offensive friendly system, what do you think Tyrod will do?

 

for those that think playing without your best wideout and some games with practice squad caliber wideouts doesn't make a difference, it's not the case, it does, and it makes a big difference

 

I'm in the middle on Tyrod. He's done some good things and is clearly better than some of our FA options. But he's not an elite QB. I do, btw, give him some credit for the effectiveness of the ground game this year. His presence in the backfield - and the way the plays are designed - make it harder for defenses to key on Shady or MG.

 

Saying all that, I don't buy into advanced metrics. Virtually any metric invented to evaluate QBs does so on a per-pass-play basis. This is a flawed approach. Productivity matters.

 

A guy who goes 15 of 20 for 150 yards with no INTS and 1 TD doesn't contribute as much as the QB who goes 30 of 40 for 300 yards with no INTs and 2 TDs. Yet most statistical systems will rate those games equivalently.

 

Sometimes you need your QB to throw for 300+ yards. The goal is to score and win the field position battle. To do all that you need to 'matriculate' the ball down the field. TT hasn't shown a consistent ability to move the ball down the field with passes. As we all know, TT has only one 300 yard game on his resume.

So I think Jim is right to a certain extent.

 

Then again, looking at the past few years, the Bills have a .500 overall roster. Most new coaches don't get to take over winning clubs. Head coaching positions are so rare and difficult to come by that both Hue Jackson and Mike Pettine were persuaded to take the hopeless Browns job. The Bills roster is good enough to attract some good candidates though others might indeed shy away from a team with TT as QB.

Edited January 5, 2017 by hondo in seattle

[hondo in seattle]

Buffalo Rumblings: Quarterback isn’t a negative for Buffalo Bills coach search

Jim Kelly had some harsh comments about Tyrod Taylor, but they don’t jive with the reality.

 

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2017/1/4/14168166/buffalo-bills-coach-search-tyrod-taylor-blake-bortles

 

Actually, if I'm a coach in a league with a win-now mentality I'm thinking Denver is a better option than Buffalo. They may have the best roster and went 9-7 this year.

 

If I'm obsessing about QB, maybe I pick San Diego. Phillip Rivers may not have many years left but he's the best QB on an available team.

 

Buffalo is not the clear-cut best option. But we're certainly not the worst either, despite the 'dumpster fire' and 'dysfunction' remarks.

 

The real dumpster fire is San Francisco with a 2-14 type roster and a CEO/owner that the media is saying should fire himself.

 

When players are free agents they talk about a lot of stuff but usually sign the biggest offer. Coaches aren't much different, and we have an owner willing to pay not just for a good HC - but for a good OC and DC too.

[Dr. Who]

 

Actually, if I'm a coach in a league with a win-now mentality I'm thinking Denver is a better option than Buffalo. They may have the best roster and went 9-7 this year.

 

If I'm obsessing about QB, maybe I pick San Diego. Phillip Rivers may not have many years left but he's the best QB on an available team.

 

Buffalo is not the clear-cut best option. But we're certainly not the worst either, despite the 'dumpster fire' and 'dysfunction' remarks.

 

The real dumpster fire is San Francisco with a 2-14 type roster and a CEO/owner that the media is saying should fire himself.

 

When players are free agents they talk about a lot of stuff but usually sign the biggest offer. Coaches aren't much different, and we have an owner willing to pay not just for a good HC - but for a good OC and DC too.

I agree. We are a mediocre team, not a dumpster fire. We are in the middle of available options. Despite media and message boards griping, I think the Pegulas' willingness to spend and basic decency are a plus for us.

[OhDozeBills]

A little surprised at Kelly's comments on Tyrod. Not saying they are totally untrue, but TT is the best QB we've had in a long time. Sure he had some bad games, but he played well enough to give us 10 wins and into the playoffs for the first time in 16 years. Not to mention a ridiculously depleted WR core. It's not his fault the defense couldn't stop Jay Ajayi (twice) and couldn't defend a pass in week two versus the Jets. The defense also couldn't make a stop in 1st half of Seashawks game. Just seems like JK is writing the guy off, but who you gonna bring in to give us a legit chance to end the drought? Fix the defense, and a TT lead offense will get this team into the postseason.

[The Big Cat]

A little surprised at Kelly's comments on Tyrod. Not saying they are totally untrue, but TT is the best QB we've had in a long time. Sure he had some bad games, but he played well enough to give us 10 wins and into the playoffs for the first time in 16 years. Not to mention a ridiculously depleted WR core. It's not his fault the defense couldn't stop Jay Ajayi (twice) and couldn't defend a pass in week two versus the Jets. The defense also couldn't make a stop in 1st half of Seashawks game. Just seems like JK is writing the guy off, but who you gonna bring in to give us a legit chance to end the drought? Fix the defense, and a TT lead offense will get this team into the postseason.

 

Bills fans HAVE GOT TO STOP evaluating our QB's relative to the dismal two decades we've had at the position. How does he compare to the rest of the LEAGUE?

[CountDorkula]

 

Bills fans HAVE GOT TO STOP evaluating our QB's relative to the dismal two decades we've had at the position. How does he compare to the rest of the LEAGUE?

This + 1,153,136,157

[zow2]

A little surprised at Kelly's comments on Tyrod. Not saying they are totally untrue, but TT is the best QB we've had in a long time. Sure he had some bad games, but he played well enough to give us 10 wins and into the playoffs for the first time in 16 years. Not to mention a ridiculously depleted WR core. It's not his fault the defense couldn't stop Jay Ajayi (twice) and couldn't defend a pass in week two versus the Jets. The defense also couldn't make a stop in 1st half of Seashawks game. Just seems like JK is writing the guy off, but who you gonna bring in to give us a legit chance to end the drought? Fix the defense, and a TT lead offense will get this team into the postseason.

 

I'm thinking Kelly is the same as a lot of Bills nation. Completely frustrated with 17 years of no-playoffs. Therefore, people are so fed up they just find a weakness at whatever QB is playing for Buffalo and say "this isn't the guy....Boom,,on to the next". The patience is gone, we need instant franchise QB or bust. I've been the same way with alot of our QB's including the seasons we started EJ, Trent, JP, etc... I feel differently with the Tyrod situation. I think it would be a huge mistake to dump him. And the shame is he probably wants to leave Buffalo considering his treatment by Whaley (not really talking to him about week 17)...the media, some fans and now Kelly.

 

Don't you think a playoff team like Houston would kill to have Tyrod Taylor starting their playoff game this weekend...over Osweiler, Savage or Weeden? I think so.

[DriveFor1Outta5]

 

Bills fans HAVE GOT TO STOP evaluating our QB's relative to the dismal two decades we've had at the position. How does he compare to the rest of the LEAGUE?

It's a fact that during desperate times the human psyche always runs to simple solutions for complex problems. The 17 year playoff drought has created feelings of desperation. Now we are all searching for our heros and our scapegoats. The easy answer to the pathetic results of this franchise is to say we don't have a quarterback. That makes us feel good because we feel as if we have an answer. This makes it all seem to make sense. In reality we haven't had a franchise QB during the playoff drought. That doesn't mean there aren't many other reasons why we haven't made the playoffs. Plenty of teams with crappy QB's have made the playoffs since our last appearance. If we want to be a Super Bowl contender we need a franchise QB. Just making the playoffs doesn't always require one. There are other components to a team aside from the QB position. If those other components excel you can make the playoffs without a stellar QB. You may not go far, but it's still better than what this franchise has been able to do.

 

As far as TT is concerned, you are right that he isn't good enough. He isn't good enough to overcome playing with a roster of JV receivers, he isn't good enough to overcome a crap defense, he isn't good enough to make the proper reads a majority of the time, and he isn't good enough to consistently put up up big numbers. He IS good enough to be on a playoff team if it were a complete team. This means good receiver play,good defense,good special teams,coaching,Oline play, and a running game. The running game being an element we actually did have. I'd like to find a much a better QB, but to just send TT packing before we find a better option is senseless. To say he's the only reason we didn't make the playoffs would also be senseless.

Edited January 5, 2017 by DriveFor1Outta5

[OhDozeBills]

 

 

Bills fans HAVE GOT TO STOP evaluating our QB's relative to the dismal two decades we've had at the position. How does he compare to the rest of the LEAGUE

 

When you factor in his rushing yards, rushing TD's, lack of turnovers, sacks allowed, etc. I think he'd factor somewhere in the middle of the pack. The bottom line is the guy gave us a chance to win AT LEAST 10 games. The team needs to be better around him and the coaching needs to be better. We should focus on fixing the defense and getting two new kickers. I'd be excited to see what we can do with a top 10 defense coupled with what our offense has been able to do for two years now. Not sure how you can debate that. Getting rid of TT would be a mistake. He gives us a chance to be competitive and buys time for us to groom a guy like Cardalle and/or find a franchise QB in the draft. I think TT is close, and even though I don't think he's there yet, I do think he can continue to get better.

[The Big Cat]

It's a fact that during desperate times the human psyche always runs to simple solutions for complex problems. The 17 year playoff drought has created feelings of desperation. Now we are all searching for our heros and our scapegoats. The easy answer to the pathetic results of this franchise is to say we don't have a quarterback. That makes us feel good because we feel as if we have an answer. This makes it all seem to make sense. In reality we haven't had a franchise QB during the playoff drought. That doesn't mean there aren't many other reasons why we haven't made the playoffs. Plenty of teams with crappy QB's have made the playoffs since our last appearance. If we want to be a Super Bowl contender we need a franchise QB. Just making the playoffs doesn't always require one. There are other components to a team aside from the QB position. If those other components excel you can make the playoffs without a stellar QB. You may not go far, but it's still better than what this franchise has been able to do.

 

As far as TT is concerned, you are right that he isn't good enough. He isn't good enough to overcome playing with a roster of JV receivers, he isn't good enough to overcome a crap defense, he isn't good enough to make the proper reads a majority of the time, and he isn't good enough to consistently put up up big numbers. He IS good enough to be on a playoff team if it were a complete team. This means good receiver play,good defense,good special teams,coaching,Oline play, and a running game. The running game being an element we actually did have. I'd like to find a much a better QB, but to just send TT packing before we find a better option is senseless. To say he's the only reason we didn't make the playoffs would also be senseless.

 

What I'm hearing you say:

 

All we need is a top 10 WR and top 10 defense to go along with our historically good rush attack and then our QB would be serviceable.

 

 

 

Bills fans HAVE GOT TO STOP evaluating our QB's relative to the dismal two decades we've had at the position. How does he compare to the rest of the LEAGUE

 

When you factor in his rushing yards, rushing TD's, lack of turnovers, sacks allowed, etc. I think he'd factor somewhere in the middle of the pack. The bottom line is the guy gave us a chance to win AT LEAST 10 games. The team needs to be better around him and the coaching needs to be better. We should focus on fixing the defense and getting two new kickers. I'd be excited to see what we can do with a top 10 defense coupled with what our offense has been able to do for two years now. Not sure how you can debate that. Getting rid of TT would be a mistake. He gives us a chance to be competitive and buys time for us to groom a guy like Cardalle and/or find a franchise QB in the draft. I think TT is close, and even though I don't think he's there yet, I do think he can continue to get better.

 

If he was somewhere in the middle of the pack then his record in games facing a deficit would be much closer to .500 and not 2-14 (or whatever it's up to now). Sorry, but everything you're pawning above as fact is highly debatable.

[OhDozeBills]

 

What I'm hearing you say:

 

All we need is a top 10 WR and top 10 defense to go along with our historically good rush attack and then our QB would be serviceable.

 

 

If he was somewhere in the middle of the pack then his record in games facing a deficit would be much closer to .500 and not 2-14 (or whatever it's up to now). Sorry, but everything you're pawning above as fact is highly debatable.

Do you disagree that he played well enough for us to at least win 10 games? I'm not saying he's a top tier guy, but IMO he gives us a chance to be a solid team. He has what, something like 27 starts? I think he still has room to get better and I don't see another realistic option to field a competitive team in the near future. It was the defense that disappointed this year, overall the offense did their job.

[HeHateMe]

Tyrod has peaked. He is not a good QB. He is somewhat capable of making some good plays because of his mobility. I agree he makes the run game better too.

 

Guess what we have had a great run game for 2 years and have still stunk. He can't make the plays from the pocket that a QB needs to make. He lacks vision and timing with WRs. The next WR he throws open will be his first.

[LabattBlue]

Kelly has praised every QB we've had since he retired. His opinion doesn't mean much to me....

I'll second that.

[OhDozeBills]

Tyrod has peaked. He is not a good QB. He is somewhat capable of making some good plays because of his mobility. I agree he makes the run game better too.

 

Guess what we have had a great run game for 2 years and have still stunk. He can't make the plays from the pocket that a QB needs to make. He lacks vision and timing with WRs. The next WR he throws open will be his first.

How would you feel if the defense (before Rex ruined it) played like it did in 2014 and we were in the playoffs this year?

[QCity]

Kelly has praised every QB we've had since he retired. His opinion doesn't mean much to me....

 

I think that's really what's so damning. When a cheerleader like Jim says TT's not "the guy"... ouch.

[The Big Cat]

Do you disagree that he played well enough for us to at least win 10 games? I'm not saying he's a top tier guy, but IMO he gives us a chance to be a solid team. He has what, something like 27 starts? I think he still has room to get better and I don't see another realistic option to field a competitive team in the near future. It was the defense that disappointed this year, overall the offense did their job.

 

He has 29 starts. The Bills are 15-14 in those games.

 

Did he play well enough to win 10 games this year? No. If he had we would have.

[zow2]

Kelly has praised every QB we've had since he retired. His opinion doesn't mean much to me....

 

I disagree. He's been politically correct about the active QB's (not really praising). but this is the first time I can recall him dissing a Bills QB that's on the active roster, starting. I wonder if there's anything personal, like Tyrod not giving Jimbo the time of day.

[TaskerTough]

Jimbo is echoing 1BD's sentiments. Trying to sway fans for when he's eventually dropped.

 

I just wish I knew why 1BD has cooled so much on Ty. Is it just because he was "Rex's guy"? Is it really because he can't lead receivers/has terrible pocket vision? cuz they love EJ, and he is legally blind!

 

Why is Pegula Inc. so down on Ty? I just do not believe it is as simple as, "he's mediocre lets reach for the stars".