GaryPinC Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 https://mattwaldmanrsp.com/2016/12/30/kyle-posey-debunking-the-tyrod-taylor-myth/ You be the judge. Great discussion, thanks. What to do about TT?: We rank near the bottom of the league in YAC both in 2016 and 2015, according to: https://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/team-yards-after-catch-statistics/2016/ In 2015 our YAC was 4.40, 2016 it is 4.26. So as an offense our passing has regressed a bit this year. I look at YAC, because in my mind the lack of YAC are largely due to QB choice of where and when to throw the ball. Check downs and late/inaccurate delivery. Also, according to PFF TT's completion % is down by 2 this year: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/T/TaylTy00.htm Great job David Lee! Reminiscent of your work with Fitzy! From the article, look at this video and Sammy Watkins at the bottom of the screen: https://videos.files.wordpress.com/zNNRe3jK/ttvid4_dvd.mp4 Do you think Brady makes the same choice as TT or does he key on and hit Sammy in stride the moment he gets a step on the DB? I was at the Browns game and saw this same play, watched Sammy get open but TT never saw/looked at him, as in this Miami instance. But is this TT's fault? He does make decisions and try to see the field, but his abilities have not developed this year IMO. The big issue could be coaching, and I thought Anthony Lynn saying that he hopes he gets TT for an offseason is very telling. I think he's intimating Lee et all have failed to address TT's issues. That is not surprising because my impression of Lee is that of a technique expert, not a decision-making coach like TT would need. To bring it home, I think TT's development will take more time and if he quickens his decision-making, especially pre-snap reads, he could be a good starting quarterback. We should restructure his contract to give him a reasonable raise next year but push most of the guaranteed money back a year and maybe throw in a bit more since we were stupid enough to assume he would develop into a starting QB this year. Obviously we keep our flexibility if he doesn't develop after another year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 Agreed. Cardale will look so bad Whaley might get fired and the controversy to add another QB in the draft will be settled. I'm NOT a Whaley guy, so that's an acceptable outcome for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilarian Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 Drew Brees is a future HOF qb. His vision is keen and his accuracy is impeccable. What you failed to mention about Brees is that there were serious questions about his health relating to a shoulder problem. The same issue where the Miami doctors declined to give him a clean bill of health that resulted in that organization passing on him as a free agent. What most of us are hoping is for TT to develop so he can become a reasonable starting qb so this team can compete. The comparisons you are making are an extreme stretch and far fetched What you need to realize is that his accuracy and his pocket awareness stunk in 2003 hence the 11 TDs to 15 INTs and a completion percentage of 57.6. Brees made a huge turnaround in his third year of PLAYING! Some Bills fans (not you John) seem to think that simply being on the team and holding a clipboard is equivalent to being on the field and actually playing. The year I was talking about happened in 2003 and in 2004 went 11-4. Brees didn't separate his shoulder until the 2005 season and had surgery that offseason. Miami had a strong interest in Brees but their doctors wouldn't pass him so NO signed him. Thank the good lord! The comparison I'm making is very accurate and very relevant! Brees himself credits that benching by Marty S for allowing him to rethink his patience in the pocket. The entire point is that it took two full seasons of playing before Brees finally came into his own and the difference between 2003 and 2004 is like night and day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 And your response was just a wealth of knowledge, right! Big difference is Brees was a 3rd year guy whereas Tyrod is a 6th year guy. That is huge, not to mention Brees is a 1000x better QB. I agree that comparing TT to Brees is silly. Brees is a HOF. Why not compare TT to other middle of the pack QB's. Not Brady. Not Brees. As for the 6yrs in the NFL, people need to stop with that. He didnt start a single game in the NFL before starting in Buffalo last yr. He had a total of 35 pass attempts in 4yrs in the NFL. 50% practice speed does not equal game day speed. And its not like anyone can say that hes in the same system so he should be familiar with it. New team. New system. First start. Hes still only 27. EJ is 26. Cardale is like 24 already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilarian Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 (edited) I agree that comparing TT to Brees is silly. Brees is a HOF. Why not compare TT to other middle of the pack QB's. Not Brady. Not Brees. As for the 6yrs in the NFL, people need to stop with that. He didnt start a single game in the NFL before starting in Buffalo last yr. He had a total of 35 pass attempts in 4yrs in the NFL. 50% practice speed does not equal game day speed. And its not like anyone can say that hes in the same system so he should be familiar with it. New team. New system. First start. Hes still only 27. EJ is 26. Cardale is like 24 already. I watched Brees a lot in his first two seasons and he stunk big time!!! Why does anyone on earth think the team would have used the first overall pick on QB Eli Manning and then traded him to NY when he said he wouldn't play for the Chargers if they knew Brees would be as good as he has developed into? The Giants then picked Phillip Rivers in the draft with the 4th pick to trade for Eli. Thus my entire point! http://www.bigblueview.com/2013/12/4/5168342/eli-manning-philip-rivers-2004-trade-new-york-giants-san-diego-chargers Thank you for that second paragraph, though. Edited January 1, 2017 by Nihilarian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USABuffaloFan Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 https://mattwaldmanrsp.com/2016/12/30/kyle-posey-debunking-the-tyrod-taylor-myth/ You be the judge. Taylor is not a true pocket passer. No interest in seeing this experiment, move on. He doesn't make Watkins better, McCoy better or Clay. He helps the Bills running stats, that's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voodoo poonani Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 But has he progressed? I think he was better last year, so you can say he regressed. I also think he has been more cautious this year. A lot of that may be not trusting the receivers. Watkins was out; Woods was hurt a lot; and Goodwin is awful. If we get better there, and get him another QB coach to work with, I think he could be good. He may not be the franchise QB, but he could lead us to the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in San Diego Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 Taylor is not a true pocket passer. No interest in seeing this experiment, move on. He doesn't make Watkins better, McCoy better or Clay. He helps the Bills running stats, that's it. The OL has to create a pocket to allow a pocket passer to pass. The only hot pockets this OL creates are in the micro wave oven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Doug Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 What you need to realize is that his accuracy and his pocket awareness stunk in 2003 hence the 11 TDs to 15 INTs and a completion percentage of 57.6. Brees made a huge turnaround in his third year of PLAYING! Impossible. I read on here that those 4 years TT was helping Flacco put his jock on were crucial for his development and as a result, we can expect no more improvement. Impossible to think improvement at the most crucial position in football doesn't come from holding a clipboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 Here it is. Good reading. Started by FireChan of all people: http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/184548-fergys-op-ed-on-mobile-qbs-and-their-career-trajectories/ Great reading. Great discussion. I just wish mods wouldn't automatically lock all old threads. Should be pinned. Thanks bro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 What you need to realize is that his accuracy and his pocket awareness stunk in 2003 hence the 11 TDs to 15 INTs and a completion percentage of 57.6. Brees made a huge turnaround in his third year of PLAYING! Some Bills fans (not you John) seem to think that simply being on the team and holding a clipboard is equivalent to being on the field and actually playing. The year I was talking about happened in 2003 and in 2004 went 11-4. Brees didn't separate his shoulder until the 2005 season and had surgery that offseason. Miami had a strong interest in Brees but their doctors wouldn't pass him so NO signed him. Thank the good lord! The comparison I'm making is very accurate and very relevant!Brees himself credits that benching by Marty S for allowing him to rethink his patience in the pocket. The entire point is that it took two full seasons of playing before Brees finally came into his own and the difference between 2003 and 2004 is like night and day. With respect to the highlighted area I have to respectfully disagree with your comparison between the two qbs. Brees took a few years before he became comfortable as a pocket passer. It's not unusual for young qbs to make a quantum leap after a couple of years. It's simply part of the developmental process. TT is a different brand of qb who has to adjust his college run and shoot game to a more complex and sophisticated passing game. Your point that although he has been in the league for five or six years he has limited actual playing time is valid. However, I am still troubled by his development pace in that I'm not sure I saw much progression in his game from a reading and reacting standpoint. Where we may be in accord is that although I have issues with TT's prospects more than you do I acknowledge that as of right now he is still our best option at qb. EJ is gone and Cardale who I find to be an intriguing prospect still needs more time. I don't want to see him rushed. Another area where we think differently but in a certain respect come together is Whaley's status as a GM. I think more highly of him than you do but on the other hand it is obvious that he can longer avoid assuming responsibility for the roster he assembled and its lack of production. He is the one who will be selecting the next HC so he can't make the excuse that his coach is not handling the roster well. I don't believe the GM is going to use his first round pick to select a qb. He needs immediate help to bolster the roster so his position will not be in jeopardy from the very irritated owner who is presiding over two struggling pro teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts