dave mcbride Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) This thread is pure I don't quite agree with OP (who has been on this board for nearly 20 years and is always one of the shrewdest observers), but I think you're kinda whistling past the graveyard here (ie, McCoy's contract). Edited December 21, 2015 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) I don't quite agree with OP (who has been on this board for nearly 20 years and is always one of the shrewdest observers), but I think you're kinda whistling past the graveyard here (ie, McCoy's contract). My point with regard to this thread is his assessment of McCoy as a football player. The contract extension is another matter altogether. Edited December 21, 2015 by 26CornerBlitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 39.3% of his contract is guaranteed, so he's locked in through next season with those guarantees. His guarantee percentage is a little less than the two players above him and the two below him. http://overthecap.com/position/running-back According to every other report his guaranteed money is $26M........the OTC figure was just his signing bonus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starrymessenger Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 McCoy has upside. If things ever come together while a Bill and he closes out his career here putting up numbers on a par with his production in Philly, he's a legit Hall of Fame candidate. He could wind up a player as good and as useful as Thurman. Not saying that will happen, but he's probably capable of it. It's not all only up to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 McCoy has upside. If things ever come together while a Bill and he closes out his career here putting up numbers on a par with his production in Philly, he's a legit Hall of Fame candidate. He could wind up a player as good and as useful as Thurman. Not saying that will happen, but he's probably capable of it. It's not all only up to him. Past two years.....515 carries for a very pedestrian 4.3 ypc and just 8 total rushing TD's. Things aren't going to come together. I'm not going out on a limb here. He's going to be 28 and he has a ton of mileage on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsForever Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Past two years.....515 carries for a very pedestrian 4.3 ypc and just 8 total rushing TD's. Things aren't going to come together. I'm not going out on a limb here. He's going to be 28 and he has a ton of mileage on him. You don't have to go out on a limb. McCoy has been in decline for 2 years now and he will continue to trend downward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 You don't have to go out on a limb. McCoy has been in decline for 2 years now and he will continue to trend downward. What are you talking about? His rush yards per game we better than last year and his receiving stats were much better. It's not fair to compare Shady's stats to workhorse RBs, because that's never been his game. Statistically this year was slightly above his career averages, so I don't see where people are seeing a decline. His cap and salary hit are immaterial because we haven't seen this owner to be overly concerned about spending to build a team. Let's leave the cap discussion with the departed owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 You don't have to go out on a limb. McCoy has been in decline for 2 years now and he will continue to trend downward. Congrats on your troll job. Top 5 troll ranking earned Where was your mouth when Shady rattled off 8 straight 100 yard games w our patchwork OL ? Oh yea you were quiet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Of all the things to complain about... This is a disappointing post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Of all the things to complain about... This is a disappointing post. Lamp game strong. Gotta push the envelope. Ej sucks fire Rex ain't gonna get it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsForever Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Congrats on your troll job. Top 5 troll ranking earned Where was your mouth when Shady rattled off 8 straight 100 yard games w our patchwork OL ? Oh yea you were quiet. 100 yards from scrimmage you mean? Hardly impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) According to every other report his guaranteed money is $26M........the OTC figure was just his signing bonus.That's odd. Spotrac lists his total guarantees as $26.5M in his header, but in the notes they list $18.25M total guaranteed. Perhaps he's got some injury only guarantees in there or something? Agents sometimes include salaries in years where it is difficult to cut a player to inflate the total guaranteed money and make themselves look good and attract more clients, but Spotrac and OTC usually ferret those out. Odd that OTC has one number and Spotrac has two. My bet is he's got some situational guaranteed money, probably injury. Even worst case the guarantees only mean he's definitely on the roster for two more seasons. Edited December 21, 2015 by BarleyNY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 100 yards from scrimmage you mean? Hardly impressive. Where were you with your hot takes ? Oh yea that's right, you're a troll who only posts when the bills lose or a star Rb takes a hit to the knees. I got my eye on you focker, you're game is weak and transparent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsForever Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Where were you with your hot takes ? Oh yea that's right, you're a troll who only posts when the bills lose or a star Rb takes a hit to the knees. I got my eye on you focker, you're game is weak and transparent. My game told you Marrone was not fit to be a headcoach 2 years prior to him leaving. My game told you the Bills were not a playoff team in 2015 and that adding guys like Clay and McCoy was not going to lead this team to any more wins. My game told you Charles Clay is not worth the contract. My game told you McCoy is injury prone, in decline and that expensive backs are a waste of resources in building a team. My game told you Whaley is severely overrated by a fanbase that thinks mediocrity is excellence. My game told you we are in cap hell, now everyone wants to dismantle 1/3 of our roster to free up cap space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 My game told you Marrone was not fit to be a headcoach 2 years prior to him leaving. My game told you the Bills were not a playoff team in 2015 and that adding guys like Clay and McCoy was not going to lead this team to any more wins. My game told you Charles Clay is not worth the contract. My game told you McCoy is injury prone, in decline and that expensive backs are a waste of resources in building a team. My game told you Whaley is severely overrated by a fanbase that thinks mediocrity is excellence. My game told you we are in cap hell, now everyone wants to dismantle 1/3 of our roster to free up cap space. Wow. Apologies then. You nailed all of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) What are you talking about? His rush yards per game we better than last year and his receiving stats were much better. It's not fair to compare Shady's stats to workhorse RBs, because that's never been his game. Statistically this year was slightly above his career averages, so I don't see where people are seeing a decline. His cap and salary hit are immaterial because we haven't seen this owner to be overly concerned about spending to build a team. Let's leave the cap discussion with the departed owner. First of all.......last year was supposed to be the OUTLIER, not the basis for expectation. League average is 4.2 ypc. Improving 2 ticks of a yard is ok for you? Really? We were told McCoy was injured in 2014....and tired from having to train so hard with Chip Kelly.......and Roman's offense was supposed to be better for him. You don't sign a scatback to a big contract to get 4.4 ypc and 3 TD's on 200 carries. Those are CJ Spiller year-one-under-Marrone type totals. My point is that people aren't taking an objective look at the effect it has on the Bills offense as well as it's salary cap. The lack of a physical aspect to his game, combined with the lack of fear of the big play means that defenses can play the run on the way to the QB. The Bills offensive line didn't just fall off of a cliff the last few weeks......teams are seeing the tape and adapting. So you have a choice if you want to slow that pass rush........get yourself a Tom Brady/Aaron Rodgers type QB who can beat the rush with quick passes all day.........or do what all the other top rushing teams have done......get a physical RB that allows you to soften up a pass rush the old fashioned way. Pound them to soften and in the process force them out of nickel/dime coverages. Scatbacks are out of style for a reason. The regular NFL defense is now the nickel.....which means more athletes on the field and less opportunity for dancers like McCoy. I'm not under the illusion that Williams and Gillislee are automatically going to run for 5.7 ypc and regularly bust off 30-60 yard TD's........one of the reasons they have is the reason I explained above. Teams are not respecting the Bills run game and then a big guy with long speed comes in and makes it look easy. And while it's nice to surprise opponents and gash them with a big back once in a while.......it's better to have consistent protection and wear down a defense with your running game. This IS NOT an offense that can execute 12 play drives......so how does a RB who specializes in small bites of yardage between the 20's fit with this personnel? Of all the things to complain about... This is a disappointing post. I'm sorry you don't like the timing but I pretty much said all that was needed to be said about Rex defense after week 2. Would you rather I complain about how poorly Tyrod looks when he has no time to throw the ball? A problem every highly pressured QB has, btw. I suppose that's more timely. There are reasons he is getting more pressured and it's not because they are playing great teams or because Richie Incognito suddenly turned into a pumpkin. Edited December 21, 2015 by #BADOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 I'm sorry you don't like the timing but I pretty much said all that was needed to be said about Rex defense after week 2. Would you rather I complain about how poorly Tyrod looks when he has no time to throw the ball? A problem every highly pressured QB has, btw. I suppose that's more timely. There are reasons he is getting more pressured and it's not because they are playing great teams or because Richie Incognito suddenly turned into a pumpkin. Timing doesnt change that most of your points are opinions that dont seem to be true. Shady can definitely hit the big play, and has done so a few times this year. I see him gain 8-9+yards at a time up the middle among the sweeps that get strung out for 0. We have the #1 rushing offense in the league and McCoy is a large part of that. Basically the main engine of it, really. If the offense is sputtering, he isn't the main problem. Or really a "problem" at all. Even when Tyrod has time, he only looks at one side of the field. And the OL definitely needs work. I know you have a lot of "cred" to lose if McCoy succeeds with all the trash youve talked since the trade, but it's not a good look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Timing doesnt change that most of your points are opinions that dont seem to be true. Shady can definitely hit the big play, and has done so a few times this year. I see him gain 8-9+yards at a time up the middle among the sweeps that get strung out for 0. We have the #1 rushing offense in the league and McCoy is a large part of that. Basically the main engine of it, really. If the offense is sputtering, he isn't the main problem. Or really a "problem" at all. Even when Tyrod has time, he only looks at one side of the field. And the OL definitely needs work. I know you have a lot of "cred" to lose if McCoy succeeds with all the trash youve talked since the trade, but it's not a good look. Kaboom. Reality sucks ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 That's odd. Spotrac lists his total guarantees as $26.5M in his header, but in the notes they list $18.25M total guaranteed. Perhaps he's got some injury only guarantees in there or something? Agents sometimes include salaries in years where it is difficult to cut a player to inflate the total guaranteed money and make themselves look good and attract more clients, but Spotrac and OTC usually ferret those out. Odd that OTC has one number and Spotrac has two. My bet is he's got some situational guaranteed money, probably injury. Even worst case the guarantees only mean he's definitely on the roster for two more seasons. Guarantee means you are going to get it, regardless. All we know for certain from those figures is that about $3M of that is definitely being amortized off in 2015. I would hope there aren't still $23M in guarantees still left unamortized going into next season.....but there may be. In any event....IMO the tape is going to force the team to cut his touches next season........and since 2/3 of his deal is guaranteed why does he have to sit quietly and take a back seat to anyone? So IMO the likelihood is that he is gone after next season.......whether the Bills have to eat $15-$20M in dead money to do so or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 right on, with all of it. You guys are insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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