bobobonators Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 (edited) I constantly find myself drooling whenever I think of the Hawks and how good their team was this year, and quite frankly how solid they have been over the last 3-4 years (since Carroll came on). The Hawks have drafted really well since 2010, but one draft in particular stands out to me: In 2010 (Carroll's first year), the Hawks drafted RD 1 - Okung; RD 1 - Earl Thomas; RD 2 - Golden Tate; RD 4 - Walter Thurmond; RD 5 - Kam Chancellor 4 of those 5 players were critical components of this team and even Walter Thurmond contributed substantially as the Nickel CB earlier this year. You can't possibly do it any better than the Hawks did it in 2010. Yes getting Lynch in a trade turned out to be a good move for them and yes drafting RW in the 3rd round pretty much put them over the top, but that 2010 draft set the foundation for a team that would come to win the Super Bowl 4 years later IMO. Icing on the cake thereafter for the Hawks was another solid draft in 2011: landing Richard Sherman in the 5th round; KJ Wright in the 4th round; and Byron Maxwell in the 6th; and lastly Malcolm Smith in the 7th. Looking past Sherman, all those other players also made major contributions to this Hawks team that won the Super Bowl and are all very solid players. And last, but certainly not least, another gem of a draft in 2012 which pretty much propelled the Seattle Seahawks over that final hump: Rd 1 - Bruce Irvin; Rd 2 - Bobby Wagner; Rd 3 - Russell Wilson; Rd 4 - Robert Turbin. I mean WOW is all I have to say. Tip of the cap to Carroll and Schneider - some of the best drafting I've seen in a long, long time. Will Marrone and Whaley's 2013 Draft be the beginning of OUR Super Bowl run? Hopefully 4 years from now I'll be able to create the same thread and state how EJ Manuel in Rd 1; Robert Woods in Rd 2; and Kiko Alonso in Rd 2 put us on the path to greatness. Edited February 6, 2014 by bobobonators Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bananathumb Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 This is why I reached for the term "dynasty" in another thread. After watching the NFL (especially Bills) for many years, I have concluded that it is not who is drafted that matters, but who is doing the drafting and coaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted February 6, 2014 Author Share Posted February 6, 2014 This is why I reached for the term "dynasty" in another thread. After watching the NFL (especially Bills) for many years, I have concluded that it is not who is drafted that matters, but who is doing the drafting and coaching. Completely agree. I still think that Carroll's time at USC really gave him a major advantage in talent evaluation with respect to the new wave of players that were coming into the NFL. College coaches spend more time recruiting players than they do coaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I constantly find myself drooling whenever I think of the Hawks and how good their team was this year, and quite frankly how solid they have been over the last 3-4 years (since Carroll came on). The Hawks have drafted really well since 2010, but one draft in particular stands out to me: In 2010 (Carroll's first year), the Hawks drafted RD 1 - Okung; RD 1 - Earl Thomas; RD 2 - Golden Tate; RD 4 - Walter Thurmond; RD 5 - Kam Chancellor 4 of those 5 players were critical components of this team and even Walter Thurmond contributed substantially as the Nickel CB earlier this year. You can't possibly do it any better than the Hawks did it in 2010. Yes getting Lynch in a trade turned out to be a good move for them and yes drafting RW in the 3rd round pretty much put them over the top, but that 2010 draft set the foundation for a team that would come to win the Super Bowl 4 years later IMO. Icing on the cake thereafter for the Hawks was another solid draft in 2011: landing Richard Sherman in the 5th round; KJ Wright in the 4th round; and Byron Maxwell in the 6th; and lastly Malcolm Smith in the 7th. Looking past Sherman, all those other players also made major contributions to this Hawks team that won the Super Bowl and are all very solid players. And last, but certainly not least, another gem of a draft in 2012 which pretty much propelled the Seattle Seahawks over that final hump: Rd 1 - Bruce Irvin; Rd 2 - Bobby Wagner; Rd 3 - Russell Wilson; Rd 4 - Robert Turbin. I mean WOW is all I have to say. Tip of the cap to Carroll and Schneider - some of the best drafting I've seen in a long, long time. Will Marrone and Whaley's 2013 Draft be the beginning of OUR Super Bowl run? Hopefully 4 years from now I'll be able to create the same thread and state how EJ Manuel in Rd 1; Robert Woods in Rd 2; and Kiko Alonso in Rd 2 put us on the path to greatness. I recall the Earl Thomas pick being somewhat controversial because he passed on his old safety from USC, Taylor Mays, who was an All-american. I remember Mays actually saying something about it, that he felt disrespected or something. But Mays has gone on to be very average with the Bengals, and was almost cut this year. One of the biggest assets Carroll brought to the job with Seattle (in which he serves in a FO role as well which is why he makes so much $) was his expertise in college talent evaluation, and that has really bore itself out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted February 6, 2014 Author Share Posted February 6, 2014 I recall the Earl Thomas pick being somewhat controversial because he passed on his old safety from USC, Taylor Mays, who was an All-american. I remember Mays actually saying something about it, that he felt disrespected or something. But Mays has gone on to be very average with the Bengals, and was almost cut this year. One of the biggest assets Carroll brought to the job with Seattle (in which he serves in a FO role as well which is why he makes so much $) was his expertise in college talent evaluation, and that has really bore itself out. Agree 100%. Lets hope Marrone passing on Ryan Nassib for EJ Manuel will produce similar results!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All I Need is Hope Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 The consistently finding value in the later rounds, and the overall balance on the Seahawks is pretty amazing. Wilson makes the plays that he needs to, when they are needed; but the Seahawks aren't 100% reliant on him being phenomenal. Contrast this with the "find an elite QB and they can hide a lot of other deficiencies" model (Patriots, Packers, Broncos). Not sure if one or the other is better, just different philosophy... I would be happy if the Bills could get close to either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 The consistently finding value in the later rounds, and the overall balance on the Seahawks is pretty amazing. Wilson makes the plays that he needs to, when they are needed; but the Seahawks aren't 100% reliant on him being phenomenal. Contrast this with the "find an elite QB and they can hide a lot of other deficiencies" model (Patriots, Packers, Broncos). Not sure if one or the other is better, just different philosophy... I would be happy if the Bills could get close to either. In my mind, building a team model is more sustainable over time and resistant to X-factors like injuries, suspensions, or early retirements...it allows the team to function as a whole and permitting talent to find its way on to the field without the attention on one as an individual. For example, Seattle, is known as the "Legion of Boom", indicating there is a wide, diverse array of players and talent that comprise the totality of Defense...one goes down with injury, the success can still function. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted February 6, 2014 Author Share Posted February 6, 2014 In my mind, building a team model is more sustainable over time and resistant to X-factors like injuries, suspensions, or early retirements...it allows the team to function as a whole and permitting talent to find its way on to the field without the attention on one as an individual. For example, Seattle, is known as the "Legion of Boom", indicating there is a wide, diverse array of players and talent that comprise the totality of Defense...one goes down with injury, the success can still function. Yup. Agree completely. The same could be said about Russell Wilson. As great as he is, you could probably argue that any QB in the top 15-18 would've had similar success this season. They're definitely not a 1 man show on either side of the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPS Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 (edited) I constantly find myself drooling whenever I think of the Hawks and how good their team was this year, and quite frankly how solid they have been over the last 3-4 years (since Carroll came on). The Hawks have drafted really well since 2010, but one draft in particular stands out to me: In 2010 (Carroll's first year), the Hawks drafted RD 1 - Okung; RD 1 - Earl Thomas; RD 2 - Golden Tate; RD 4 - Walter Thurmond; RD 5 - Kam Chancellor 4 of those 5 players were critical components of this team and even Walter Thurmond contributed substantially as the Nickel CB earlier this year. You can't possibly do it any better than the Hawks did it in 2010. Yes getting Lynch in a trade turned out to be a good move for them and yes drafting RW in the 3rd round pretty much put them over the top, but that 2010 draft set the foundation for a team that would come to win the Super Bowl 4 years later IMO. Icing on the cake thereafter for the Hawks was another solid draft in 2011: landing Richard Sherman in the 5th round; KJ Wright in the 4th round; and Byron Maxwell in the 6th; and lastly Malcolm Smith in the 7th. Looking past Sherman, all those other players also made major contributions to this Hawks team that won the Super Bowl and are all very solid players. And last, but certainly not least, another gem of a draft in 2012 which pretty much propelled the Seattle Seahawks over that final hump: Rd 1 - Bruce Irvin; Rd 2 - Bobby Wagner; Rd 3 - Russell Wilson; Rd 4 - Robert Turbin. I mean WOW is all I have to say. Tip of the cap to Carroll and Schneider - some of the best drafting I've seen in a long, long time. Will Marrone and Whaley's 2013 Draft be the beginning of OUR Super Bowl run? Hopefully 4 years from now I'll be able to create the same thread and state how EJ Manuel in Rd 1; Robert Woods in Rd 2; and Kiko Alonso in Rd 2 put us on the path to greatness. Goodwin is part of that mix as the R3 pick. He's already better than TJ. It will be interesting to see how pMeeks and d.williams end up too, though I think they were selected to fit into Pettine's scheme. Good topic. Edited February 6, 2014 by TPS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellyto83TD Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Does Ralph Wilson still own the team? Is his younger personal clone running the team? Then no we have no hopes of duplicating what Seattle has done. Reaching in round 1 for a QB that should have still been on the board a lot longer than that should have been the first clue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Yup. Agree completely. The same could be said about Russell Wilson. As great as he is, you could probably argue that any QB in the top 15-18 would've had similar success this season. They're definitely not a 1 man show on either side of the ball. This. Wilson deserves his praise but let's not pretend Seattle doesn't win the SB with Manning or Brady or 1/2 the other starters in the league. I don't think there's any new secret formula here; you need to draft well. Teams that can't do that don't win. And not just in the first round or two, but in all the rounds. That is how you get a deep team. There was some article a couple days ago about the Jets copying the Seahawks' 'model'. lol...yeah, 'don't !@#$ up the draft' is a great model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Completely agree. I still think that Carroll's time at USC really gave him a major advantage in talent evaluation with respect to the new wave of players that were coming into the NFL. College coaches spend more time recruiting players than they do coaching. Yep. I think this played a huge role in Jimmy Johnson's success. He took over the job with a #1 over all QB entering his 2nd season, and got a boatload of draft picks from the Walker trade (I still think it shouldn't have been allowed by the league, but they wanted America's Team back in the mix, and Jerry Jones was ready to put a lot of money into the league). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like A Mofo Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 The Bills need to hit in the draft almost every year, and multiple picks, that is the only TRUE way to long term success Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckinny Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 lets hope the Bills 2013 class was our begining! This draft should show what sort of model we are going after. I think in years past we simply went BPA at any position, IE Spiller, this year should show we take the player that fits us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 lets hope the Bills 2013 class was our begining! This draft should show what sort of model we are going after. I think in years past we simply went BPA at any position, IE Spiller, this year should show we take the player that fits us! I completely disagree. The problem in the past was they DIDN'T take the BPA, but instead reached on players, trying to fill holes. The Spiller pick was more Gailey wanting to have a specific type of RB, to help make his offensive plan work, similar to the Whitner pick, which was to get an "elite" Safety to run the Tampa 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 lets hope the Bills 2013 class was our begining! This draft should show what sort of model we are going after. I think in years past we simply went BPA at any position, IE Spiller, this year should show we take the player that fits us! Closer. not yet. maybe. BPA is the way to build and then add the missing chinks when you can. This might be the first year to have some fun and not stress. i mean we have discussed everything form wr te to LB to OT and back again. And all those are available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Did they have great drafts, or do they have a coach that knows how to use his players? I think it's a combo. Also, lots of pass interference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalover4life Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Does Ralph Wilson still own the team? Is his younger personal clone running the team? Then no we have no hopes of duplicating what Seattle has done. Reaching in round 1 for a QB that should have still been on the board a lot longer than that should have been the first clue Stop trolling. Doug runs this team. I have agreed with almost every major move this team has made since marcell dareus was drafted. The only one pick I really freaked out about was Russell Wilson. I really wanted EJ, and still think he can make it if coached up properly in the offseason. I have complete faith that our team will make every move necessary to improve this offseason. Edited February 7, 2014 by buffalover4life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) It's not just the draft picks. Case in point: Brandon Browner.......who couldn't make it in the NFL and went to Canada.....then suddenly returns to the NFL as that rarest of animal.....a 6'4" Pro Bowl CB. Of course his "lifetime" suspension in November didn't really slow the Seahawks because they have a secondary full of big guys who are somehow twice the player they were expected to be. Ahem. The Seahawks have had 7 PED suspensions in the last 3 years......Richard Sherman had his overturned on a technicality after claiming he drank from a teammates adderall laced water bottle. Which come to think of it might be a great way to keep energy flowing and mentally sharp for 3 hours every Sunday. My strong suspicion is that the Seahawks have the finest PED program in the league........perhaps ever......and that in a few years people will look back and say it was too obvious to miss. I would call that program "Seahawks 24/7" which means diligently following the trainers guidelines for staying jacked while keeping it masked to prevent a positive drug test. I saw a lot of these guys in college........including a complete non-prospect named Jermaine Kearse......and their improvement is uttlerly too good to be true. My belief is that they haven't actually drafted that well....but the combination of an unscrupulous head coach and a desperate need to match the super talented Niners caused the 'Hawks to develop Seahawks 24/7. Edited February 7, 2014 by BADOLBEELZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Those are strong accusations - though not necessarily unfounded, Badol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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