Dorkington Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 The political extremists would have you believe there's only two options: give citizenship to everyone who crosses the border, or deport everybody who's crossed the border illegally. The simple fact of the matter is that neither of those is a remotely practical policy. Any serious talk about immigration reform has to include discussions on reforming the USCIS and the path to citizenship (I've known several people who've had to navigate the bureaucratic morass to a green card, it's ridiculous), voter ID and registration, what to do with the illegal immigrants already here (you can't just deport 12M Latinos, no matter how much you may want to), border security, labor policies, and probably a host of other things I'm not even thinking of. No one wants to seriously discuss those issues, though. It's easier and more lucrative to demagogue. There's no money in immigration reform, but a hell of a lot of money to be had demonizing it. I'll give this a +1 Those laws include entering this country legally. If the worst thing someone has done is enter into another country to find work opportunities, then frankly they have been living a good life. We have people out there who are thieves, murderers, rapists, etc who are free to live and work as they please (mostly) because they happened to be born to the "right" woman. Good people, with good intentions, shouldn't be treated like criminals, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 I'll give this a +1 If the worst thing someone has done is enter into another country to find work opportunities, then frankly they have been living a good life. We have people out there who are thieves, murderers, rapists, etc who are free to live and work as they please (mostly) because they happened to be born to the "right" woman. Good people, with good intentions, shouldn't be treated like criminals, imo. How are we going to employ or otherwise support all these extra folks when we can't employ or afford to support a big piece of the American population now? Not all coming into our country have had good intentions and now more than ever we are allowing bad people to enter and stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 How are we going to employ or otherwise support all these extra folks when we can't employ or afford to support a big piece of the American population now? There will never be a point where we employ 100% of American citizens. One could also argue that the immigrants coming in take jobs that most citizens don't want to take. And further, they spend money in the US, and that money spent creates more jobs. Not all coming into our country have had good intentions and now more than ever we are allowing bad people to enter and stay. Nope. I've already covered that, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azalin Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 Not all coming into our country have had good intentions and now more than ever we are allowing bad people to enter and stay. not only that, we're letting them out of our prisons too. http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/may/14/editorial-the-great-escape/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted May 15, 2014 Author Share Posted May 15, 2014 I'll give this a +1 If the worst thing someone has done is enter into another country to find work opportunities, then frankly they have been living a good life. We have people out there who are thieves, murderers, rapists, etc who are free to live and work as they please (mostly) because they happened to be born to the "right" woman. Good people, with good intentions, shouldn't be treated like criminals, imo. First of all, how do you know that's the worst thing they did? Second, we have immigration standards that are supposed to be met but won't be met with illegal immigration. Third, your position is showing blatant disregard for the law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 How are we going to employ or otherwise support all these extra folks when we can't employ or afford to support a big piece of the American population now? Not all coming into our country have had good intentions and now more than ever we are allowing bad people to enter and stay. Like I'd said, labor and economic policies have to be part of the discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 First of all, how do you know that's the worst thing they did? Second, we have immigration standards that are supposed to be met but won't be met with illegal immigration. Third, your position is showing blatant disregard for the law. The "law" is unrealistic. There's always going to be illegal immigrants. Rounding them up and kicking them out is wasteful, especially since many illegals are productive members of society. The "law" needs to be changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 The "law" is unrealistic. There's always going to be illegal immigrants. Rounding them up and kicking them out is wasteful, especially since many illegals are productive members of society. The "law" needs to be changed. We shouldn't round them up and kick them out, we should disincentivize them coming here by denying them any benefits for doing so, unless and until they can meet the requirements for legal residency or citizenship. It's not always about having a bigger stick. Sometimes it's just about removing the carrot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 The "law" is unrealistic. There's always going to be illegal immigrants. Rounding them up and kicking them out is wasteful, especially since many illegals are productive members of society. The "law" needs to be changed. We have very adequate laws on this matter. They just aren't enforced and haven't been for many years. Not many feel we can round them up and kick them out, but to continue to ignore border security and to have no regard for the costs of so much illegal immigration is irresponsible at best. Bush should have made border security a high priority after 9/11. There are many non-Latinos coming into our country across the southern border. Many with very bad intentions. Obama very blatantly goes out of his way not to enforce immigration laws or to secure the border. Like so many federal agencies, he uses border and immigration enforcement as an instrument to further his political agenda. He doesn't address or support American interests on the matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted May 15, 2014 Author Share Posted May 15, 2014 The "law" is unrealistic. There's always going to be illegal immigrants. Rounding them up and kicking them out is wasteful, especially since many illegals are productive members of society. The "law" needs to be changed. Then get the law changed. The last thing those on the left want is a fair and equitable law passed that would include enough border security to satisfy those on the right. Obama loves this as an issue and needs it to stay that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TH3 Posted May 15, 2014 Share Posted May 15, 2014 http://www.cnsnews.c...ght-be-citizens (CNSNews.com) – Speaking at the United States Conference of Mayors on Friday, Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson said the approximately 11 million people who are in the country illegally have “earned the right to be citizens.” “An earned path to citizenship for those currently present in this country is a matter of, in my view, homeland security to encourage people to come out from the shadows,” said Johnson, in what he remarked was one of his first public speeches since being confirmed as the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) chief in December. “It is also, frankly, in my judgment, a matter of who we are as Americans,” he said, “to offer the opportunity to those who want to be citizens, who’ve earned the right to be citizens, who are present in this country--many of whom came here as children--to have the opportunity that we all have to try to become American citizens.” - See more at: http://www.cnsnews.c...h.noIaIz3w.dpuf You do realize that CNS NEWS source is somewhat misleading with the leading sentence right? The HS did not say or imply that the 11 million have already earned the right to citizenship....he said that they should have the opportunity to earn the right to citizenship. There has not been a recent proposal from the left or the right that does not require a very long and involved process - lasting as long as 10+ years and involving paying penalties and back taxes - for those who are now residing illegally in the States to become citizens - thereby providing the "earning" element. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted May 15, 2014 Author Share Posted May 15, 2014 You do realize that CNS NEWS source is somewhat misleading with the leading sentence right? The HS did not say or imply that the 11 million have already earned the right to citizenship....he said that they should have the opportunity to earn the right to citizenship. There has not been a recent proposal from the left or the right that does not require a very long and involved process - lasting as long as 10+ years and involving paying penalties and back taxes - for those who are now residing illegally in the States to become citizens - thereby providing the "earning" element. 10 years should be enough time to get our borders secured, eh? No matter what, the left is just playing politics here. Their goal is to divide the C's from the R's. That's what the contention over securing the borders is all about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 There has not been a recent proposal from the left or the right that does not require a very long and involved process - lasting as long as 10+ years and involving paying penalties and back taxes - for those who are now residing illegally in the States to become citizens - thereby providing the "earning" element. Yet when Bush suggested anything similar, the left had kittens. You're all such a bunch of hypocrites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TH3 Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 Yet when Bush suggested anything similar, the left had kittens. You're all such a bunch of hypocrites. Who is the "you're" you speak of? I believe when Bush was in office - it was pretty much a bipartisan proposal cobbed up from previous proposals. Likewise - it was rejected by the far left and far right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted May 23, 2014 Author Share Posted May 23, 2014 (edited) It's our way or Obama will just sign another Executive Order (impeachable offense or not): http://www.breitbart...-t-Pass-Amnesty “We’ve waited 329 days, we’re willing to wait another six weeks,” Reid said, according toPolitico. “But at the end of six weeks, if something hasn’t been done, then there’s gonna have to be a move made. And it’s too bad we have to do that, because we all know things can be done administratively, but it’s better to change the law.” Schumer, who has previously said there could be legislation by "June or July," concurred. “They have about a six-week window, from June 10 after the last Republican primary until the August recess. If they don’t pass immigration reform them, the president will have no choice but to act on his own,” he said, according to The Hill. Schumer, along with Rep. Luis Gutierrez (D-IL), has said that this year is the last chance to pass sweeping amnesty legislation. The New York Democrat has also suggested that Congress pass the Senate's amnesty bill, which the Congressional Budget Office determined would lower the wages of American workers, but delay the implementation of it until Obama leaves office in 2017. Reid also endorsed Schumer's suggestion, which would give amnesty to all illegal immigrants who arrived in the country before 2014. Edited May 23, 2014 by 3rdnlng Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Jim Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 There will never be a point where we employ 100% of American citizens. One could also argue that the immigrants coming in take jobs that most citizens don't want to take. And further, they spend money in the US, and that money spent creates more jobs. Nope. I've already covered that, though. God I hate this argument. They are not taking jobs that most citizens won't do. They're taking jobs that citizens don't need to do. You know the saying "it's a slippery slope"? Well you hear it a lot but never hear people talk about the bottom of that slope. Well this is it. They're here, we can't deport them and they are doing jobs Americans don't need to do now but were very happy to do a few short generations ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Schumer, along with Rep. Luis Gutierrez (D-IL), has said that this year is the last chance to pass sweeping amnesty legislation. Why's that? Because ur gonna lose the Senate in the fall and the White House in '16? What does that tell ya Chuckie and Louie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Why's that? Because ur gonna lose the Senate in the fall and the White House in '16? What does that tell ya Chuckie and Louie? Fortunately, Chuckie is at least focusing on the important stuff. Like signing a letter to the NFL begging them to make the Redskins change their name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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