The Rebuilding Year Progress Thread

[KikO M G]

We have a very enjoyable "playoff possibilities" thread where it's okay unabashedly dream that the Bills will make the playoffs. I've posted in it several times.

 

But I also wanted a refuge for those who see this as a rebuilding year only for the Bills and are not that caught up in playoff possibilties.

 

For me, it depends on the day, but after that Brady performance last night I feel we are a few years away (at least) from the AFC East being anyone else's universe than the Patriots.

 

From the beginning of the year, I said 8-8 would be a triumph for this Bills team and leave them in pretty good shape to contend for a playoff spot next year. We do have a rookie QB and rookie HC after all.

 

Now I see 8-8 and doable, but 7-9 more likely. Considering that the Bills were 1-4 in games not started and finished by EJ Manuel, I think 7-9 is a sign of good things to come, as they would finish 6-5 in games EJ did play the whole game.

 

I want to see EJ continue to develop as a QB and the team learn how to win close games more frequently. I look at the Panthers team as a model for what we can be in a couple years. I'm not saying EJ will be as good as Cam, but I think you can see some similarities in the types of games the teams play.

 

 

[PaattMaann]

good thread

 

I dont think we are a couple years away, if you mean competing for playoffs...I see us challenging for playoffs next year (IF we stay healthy finally)...the defense is more or less there...add a LB, some CB depth and depending on the Byrd situation...this defense is playoff caliber

 

The offense needs time to gel together, and fix some holes...and obviously, EJ needs to be a better QB all around, which im hopeful - and maybe even confident - will happen down the stretch this season, making him confident and comfortable to execute the offense next season

 

And another year for Marrone/Hackett to learn the NFL will pay dividends.....win down the stretch this year to build confidence in the team, teach them how to win, make them believe this team CAN win, and come out next year firing....im not writing the playoffs off this year, theres about a 5 percent chance they could make it, but I am of the mind that everything we do to finish this year is for next season....

[BADOLBILZ]

We have a very enjoyable "playoff possibilities" thread where it's okay unabashedly dream that the Bills will make the playoffs. I've posted in it several times.

 

But I also wanted a refuge for those who see this as a rebuilding year only for the Bills and are not that caught up in playoff possibilties.

 

For me, it depends on the day, but after that Brady performance last night I feel we are a few years away (at least) from the AFC East being anyone else's universe than the Patriots.

 

From the beginning of the year, I said 8-8 would be a triumph for this Bills team and leave them in pretty good shape to contend for a playoff spot next year. We do have a rookie QB and rookie HC after all.

 

Now I see 8-8 and doable, but 7-9 more likely. Considering that the Bills were 1-4 in games not started and finished by EJ Manuel, I think 7-9 is a sign of good things to come, as they would finish 6-5 in games EJ did play the whole game.

 

I want to see EJ continue to develop as a QB and the team learn how to win close games more frequently. I look at the Panthers team as a model for what we can be in a couple years. I'm not saying EJ will be as good as Cam, but I think you can see some similarities in the types of games the teams play.

 

While it is kind of you to give the organization a pass.......this wasn't as much a rebuilding year as just a new opoortunity to start winning. Quick turnarounds are common in the NFL today.

 

Long term success is another story. Ultimately, if you want to win consistently for a long period of time, you need an elite QB.

 

The big question is whether or not EJ is an elite QB in the making. If he is, long term success is likely on the horizon.

 

If not, then the team could be "re-building" again next year or the year after that. I mean, coming into last season if I told you the Bills would be re-building in 2013 that would have seemed like a bad joke, right? They were supposed to be a playoff contender on the other side of a re-build. They lose Ryan Fitzpatrick and Andy Levitre and now they are......re-building? Really? The reality is that this season isn't really a re-build, talent-wise they are very competitive.......re-building is just an excuse for losing.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

We have a very enjoyable "playoff possibilities" thread where it's okay unabashedly dream that the Bills will make the playoffs. I've posted in it several times.

 

But I also wanted a refuge for those who see this as a rebuilding year only for the Bills and are not that caught up in playoff possibilties.

 

For me, it depends on the day, but after that Brady performance last night I feel we are a few years away (at least) from the AFC East being anyone else's universe than the Patriots.

 

From the beginning of the year, I said 8-8 would be a triumph for this Bills team and leave them in pretty good shape to contend for a playoff spot next year. We do have a rookie QB and rookie HC after all.

 

Now I see 8-8 and doable, but 7-9 more likely. Considering that the Bills were 1-4 in games not started and finished by EJ Manuel, I think 7-9 is a sign of good things to come, as they would finish 6-5 in games EJ did play the whole game.

 

I want to see EJ continue to develop as a QB and the team learn how to win close games more frequently. I look at the Panthers team as a model for what we can be in a couple years. I'm not saying EJ will be as good as Cam, but I think you can see some similarities in the types of games the teams play.

 

While EJ Vvs Cam comparisons seem compulsory, I have a hard time even contrasting the two. Cam is an incredible athlete, not good but great, a standout at the NFL level, elite... Like Randall Cunningham athletic.

 

EJ is much more of a Young/McNabb type of QB, more of a pocket passer but good enough athlete to make some plays with the feet.

 

EJ could have the potential to be as good as or better as a passer than Cam, but i don't seem him doing the magician stuff, ever.

 

Either way so far head to head it's EJ 1, Cam 0

Edited November 25, 2013 by over 20 years of fanhood

[xsoldier54]

Concur with the OP, 8-8 would be nice, but 7-9 more likely. Too bad about EJ getting hurt, because I think it could have been better. Either way, I like the direction we are headed.

[May Day 10]

I like where they are. Another good draft and a few well chosen FAs, and this team will be ready to be a realistic challenger to NE next season IMO

 

 

and I am normally pretty negative about the Bills

[Captain Hindsight]

I'm anxious to see how they do coming out the bye week. How focused will they be and will they be ready to beat an inferior opponent. That will tell me a lot about this team

[BADOLBILZ]

I'm anxious to see how they do coming out the bye week. How focused will they be and will they be ready to beat an inferior opponent. That will tell me a lot about this team

 

Agreed. The reality is that the Bills have been mathematically alive for the playoffs in November more often than not during the past 14 seasons and they have only finished on a real roll once in that time. Otherwise, inconsistent finishes have been a hallmark of this organization.

[hondo in seattle]

I've really been encouraged by Pettine. The defense is far more aggressive than it's been in years past and the result has been more big plays (Ints and sacks). And despite all the injuries in the secondary in the beginning of the year, the Bills are only giving up 5.1 yards per play which is solid. Pettine will only make the defense better and better while he remains with the Bills.

 

I've been less thrilled by Hackett. Obviously, he gets a bit of a flyer for the QB situation. Still the numbers aren't good. The Bills run a lot of plays in their fast paced offense so their overall offensive production isn't horrible. But they're only averaging 4.7 yards per play - third worst in the NFL. It's also concerning to see CJ's yards-per-carry drop by nearly 2 yards (from 6.0 to 4.1). Nathaniel doesn't seem to know how to create space for his star back.

 

And Danny Crossman has performed about as expected - badly. He wasn't a good ST coach in Detroit and according to Football Outsiders, the Bills are ranked 27th so far this year.

 

Let's hope the Bills make a run to end the season to create some positive momentum for next year and some credibility for Marrone. But even if they do, Marrone will need to make some hard decisions about his staff during the offseason. Crossman needs to go and Hackett needs to grow.

[RuntheDamnBall]

I think finishing this year out at 8-8 would tell me that they just had some bad luck with injuries and should be in the conversation for the playoffs next year.

 

Doing worse would be cause for concern, especially if EJ doesn't perform solidly.

 

Doing better... seems like a pipe dream at this point, because it would involve running the table.

[Flip Johnson]

I'm anxious to see how they do coming out the bye week. How focused will they be and will they be ready to beat an inferior opponent. That will tell me a lot about this team

 

Totally agree - a focused, winning performance would be a sign of the type of culture Marrone is building.

[bills1960]

I've really been encouraged by Pettine. The defense is far more aggressive than it's been in years past and the result has been more big plays (Ints and sacks). And despite all the injuries in the secondary in the beginning of the year, the Bills are only giving up 5.1 yards per play which is solid. Pettine will only make the defense better and better while he remains with the Bills.

 

I've been less thrilled by Hackett. Obviously, he gets a bit of a flyer for the QB situation. Still the numbers aren't good. The Bills run a lot of plays in their fast paced offense so their overall offensive production isn't horrible. But they're only averaging 4.7 yards per play - third worst in the NFL. It's also concerning to see CJ's yards-per-carry drop by nearly 2 yards (from 6.0 to 4.1). Nathaniel doesn't seem to know how to create space for his star back.

 

And Danny Crossman has performed about as expected - badly. He wasn't a good ST coach in Detroit and according to Football Outsiders, the Bills are ranked 27th so far this year.

 

Let's hope the Bills make a run to end the season to create some positive momentum for next year and some credibility for Marrone. But even if they do, Marrone will need to make some hard decisions about his staff during the offseason. Crossman needs to go and Hackett needs to grow.

 

Very good point on Crossman that people have been overlooking. The Special teams has hurt us about 3x more than it has helped us. The mishap with Powell was inexcusable and we've essentially gotten nothing out of our punt returns because the blocking has been so poor.

[BillsBytheBay]

Decade. Rebuilding decade.

 

We have a chance to make it this year, but because the AFC is so horrible this year.

[Captain Hindsight]

Decade. Rebuilding decade.

 

We have a chance to make it this year, but because the AFC is so horrible this year.

Eh, I willing to give each coaching staff their own rebuild. Hard to fault Marrone for drafting JP and Trent

[QCity]

The reality is that the Bills have been mathematically alive for the playoffs in November more often than not during the past 14 seasons and they have only finished on a real roll once in that time.

 

Well it's really not possible to be mathematically eliminated before November so that doesn't say much.

 

I will agree with most of the sentiment in this thread, it's not a rebuilding year but more of a test to see if we have our future QB. I don't see us beating a feisty Tampa team on the road nor the Patriots, who will need the final game for home-field advantage. A 7-9 record with EJ going 6-5 would be a sign that things are moving in the right direction.

[BillsVet]

The question for 2013 would be whether they'd be in year 0 of the latest rebuild or year 1. The former happens when a team doesn't answer enough questions about the important pieces it takes to win, namely the starting QB and whether that individual succeeds. We don't have enough evidence Manuel is the guy, with positive and negative signs which aren't uncommon for rookie QB's.

 

The best example of a year 0 to a rebuild happened in 2010 when few questions were actually answered during the season, like who the long term starter at QB would be and the defensive alignment. It seems like this year there's some clarity about the latter issue and perhaps a better solution to the former.

[FistingBot]

I'm shocked at how strong our draft class was this year. Regardless of how this year turns out, for once we look like we may have "hit" on all of our top picks: Manuel, Woods, Alonso, Goodwin. One more strong draft and I really like the future of this team. And, it has been YEARS since I have felt this way about the Bills.

[Leelee Phoenix]

I didn't think this was a rebuilding team this year. They had talent set in many spots. It's that people got caught up with "changes" in the staff and Marrone's babble.

 

On defense, they lacked any sort of MLB, a pass rusher beside Mario, and CB2 was arguable. Kiko was a great pick, the secondary performed amazingly well (except when depth got so bad that Justin Rogers had to play), the pass rusher still needs to be found. And they've got a great mind with Pettine, please stay here.

 

Offense was set besides the QB and WR depth. Jury remains out on EJ, which is obviously the most important thing. Woods and Goodwin at least appear to be useful deserving roster players, which is an upgrade. Countered by completely ignoring the LG position and Kraig Urbik's play has really dropped this year, along with Erik Pears being done. OL has become more of an issue.

[BillsBytheBay]

Eh, I willing to give each coaching staff their own rebuild. Hard to fault Marrone for drafting JP and Trent

that's not my point at all. I just prefer to not think of it as rebuilding. We stink. We have stunk, and the only thing to change that is to stop stinking. I'm not faulting anyone. I liked parts that we had along the way. Edited November 25, 2013 by JaxBills

[NoSaint]

so far so good, i think. like you said, 7 wins would be headed the right direction, and a reasonable expectation. its definitely not a linear process but generally i think things are trending the right way with some highs and lows mixed in.