Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 think strong safety-type players. little more height though. and zack thomas was an exeption. not the rule. like london. with us we have to get guys in able to cover gronk Shea McClellin 6'3" 260, 4.64 - 40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Anybody think they kick Dareus out to DE and Mario to OLB on passing downs? Since Mario was doing well at 3-4 OLB I wonder if they mix in the 3-4 more than we think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Bobby Wagner Utah State 6'0" 235 OLB Lavonte David Nebraska 6'1" 233 OLB Ronnell Lewis Oklahoma 6'2" 253 OLB Audie Cole North Carolina State 6'4" 242 OLB Sean Spence Miami (FL) 5'11" 231 OLB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Bobby Wagner Utah State 6'0" 235 OLB Lavonte David Nebraska 6'1" 233 OLB Ronnell Lewis Oklahoma 6'2" 253 OLB Audie Cole North Carolina State 6'4" 242 OLB Sean Spence Miami (FL) 5'11" 231 OLB Can't draft all those kids, Barbie. I'll take Ronnell Lewis or this kid: Miles Burris San Diego State 6'2" 246lbs The school is a bum factory for the most part. This kid, however, can play. Excellent football skills. Johnny on the spot on most defensive plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 From what I have read and heard, it's just the opposite. Wanny wants to simplify the defense, and let players play rather than think. They even told Mario, for example, that he wouldn't have to drop back in coverage much on zone blitzes. They want to just line up and go after the quarterback, and let the plays have simple distinct duties and run to the ball. Two Ds that made great strides in one year - GB a few years back, Texans last year. In both cases, all the player interviews I heard credited the new DC with having simplified the defense so they could react more quickly and instinctively. Of course, a simplified D with more straightforward responsibilities is not necessarily inconsistent with some of what was listed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 And Zach Brown looks great but doesn't seem to have great fundamentals. I like what Mayock said about him.. Great athlete, very fast but I'm waiting to see on tape that first strong sound fundamental tackle. Don't know if we should pick someone that still needs to learn how to play properly. It would really be something if those sorts of days were in the rearview mirror... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 I think Irvin will be one of the best players from this draft. Almost every play I've watched of Irvin (about 175-200 snaps) has been maximum-effort, full-speed football. You watch some players, even good ones like Andre Branch and Dontari Poe and you can see them cruising from time to time. With Irvin he plays every play as if it's his last one. He is a hardcore football player. For some dumb reason, West Virginia played Irvin as a DE in 3-4 and 3-3 fronts. He's 6'3" and 245 pounds and was playing mostly a 5-technique against 300-pound OTs. On obvious passing downs he would split out to a 7-technique. He was totally miscast as a DE and yet had 22.5 sacks (not including the 2 in Bowl Games) over the last two seasons. In spite of being miscast he more than held his own physically by showing great hand use, combativeness and explosion to match up against much larger men. Irvin will be an OLB in the NFL and is probably perfectly suited as a 3-4 rushbacker but I think he'd be an awesome 4-3 backer too. He shows great sense and instincts and his agility scores were by far the best at the combine. Bruce Irvin had the best times in all of the drills among DEs, ILBs, and OLBs. He outperformed Luke Keuchly and Lavonte David in almost every drill and blew away the entire field in the short shuttle and 3-cone drill where he had historically significant scores on top of 4.50 forty time which was also the best against every OLB, ILB, and DE… one of the best times ever. I loved Von Miller last year but personally I think Irvin is a better prospect than Von MIller (he's as elite an athlete and much more physical) and will start rocketing up draft boards. Bruce Irvin's best use would be as a pass rusher but with his speed, quickness, agility, and instincts, he could play any linebacker position easily. He could easily blanket tight ends and running backs and he'd be effective playing in zone coverages IMO. sold. Where do you think he goes in draft? Sounds like he is rising up draft boards. http://seahawksdraftblog.com/bruce-irvin-is-ready-to-crash-the-2012-nfl-draft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 (edited) sold. Where do you think he goes in draft? Sounds like he is rising up draft boards. http://seahawksdraft...-2012-nfl-draft Apparently this player evaluation was written after his highly-successful 2010 season when he had 14 sacks as a non-starting, situational pass rusher. He had only 8.5 sacks in 2011 but was the focal point of most offenses… and like I said, what is a 245 pounder doing playing 5-technique on a 3-man front? While his numbers went down, there was no dropoff in his actual play, his intensity or his effort. He just had to deal with a lot more blockers. This guy looks like a Lawrence Taylor clone to me. Many scouts had his 40 time at the combine clocked in the 4.43 range. Besides his 40 time, his 3-cone drill and 20-yard shuttle were among the best ever recorded and well faster than Keuchly's times. As the evaluator in your link agreed with me, this is Von Miller with much more natural power and a warrior complex as a football player. He plays mean and with violence even though I haven't seen a single personal foul penalty on the guy. People will call me crazy but I'd have zero problem if the Bills picked this guy at #10. IMO, he's way beyond Keuchly or Zack Brown. There are 3 video links at the bottom of this review of Bruce Irvin: http://nflmocks.com/...ineers-footbal/ Edited March 18, 2012 by San Jose Bills Fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 This Bruce Irvin kid from West Virginia is a serious player. http://draftbreakdow...vs-clemson-2011 Amazingly at Morgantown he played mostly 3-4 DE but as a linebacker he'll be a holy terror. He, Keuchly and Zack Brown are among the fastest LBs I've ever seen. Thing is, #10 is too high for any of them, IMO, so I'm hoping one of them will be available for our 2nd round pick… which may be wishful thinking. Irvin will most likely go in the third round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Irvin will most likely go in the third round. He won't make it out of the first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 He won't make it out of the first. No doubt physically the kid is a first round talent, but he doesn't have a true natural position. He played defensive end in college. can he play outside linebacker in the pros, that is the question. therefore his stock should remain at around the second or third round in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 This Bruce Irvin kid from West Virginia is a serious player. http://draftbreakdow...vs-clemson-2011 Amazingly at Morgantown he played mostly 3-4 DE but as a linebacker he'll be a holy terror. He, Keuchly and Zack Brown are among the fastest LBs I've ever seen. Thing is, #10 is too high for any of them, IMO, so I'm hoping one of them will be available for our 2nd round pick… which may be wishful thinking. SJR...Too bad the draft situation doesnt quite line up perfectly with our huge needs at LB. I know we cant reach at 10. i wouldnt be averse to another D lineman or LT at 10.Can never have enough D line talent. And while our O line is ok---they are far from a strong unit. many on here are pushing for a CB. I know we have a need there.But I think we have all seen the folly of building from the outside in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Read today's Buffalo News article:Wanny on this years D ""It was that way in Miami with Jason Taylor and [Adewale] Ogunleye and [Tim] Bowens and [Daryl] Gardener," Wannstedt said. "It was that way in Chicago with [Richard] Dent and [steve] McMichael and Trace Armstorng. In Dallas, we had Leon Lett and Russell Maryland and Charles Haley. As our guys up front go, so will our defense go. That's why organizationally, we felt that this was such a high priority."" "I really believe the game has changed some," he said. "Ten years ago, eight years ago, when all the fire zones and blitzes became a big, big factor, you were able to scheme and trick guys and pick up a lot of sacks because offenses weren't ready to handle it. Now the good offenses are." "You've got to attack a protection and make 'em block you one on one," Wannstedt said. "If you have good enough players, better players, and they win one on one, you get sacks and pressure. If your players aren't good enough, you can run the same blitzes as other teams, but you aren't going to get the pressures." Wannstedt says the approach used by the Super Bowl-champion New York Giants is the most effective -- if a team has the players to execute it. "I've always believed that you gotta mix that in," Wannstedt said of blitzing. "But if you can get to the point, like the Giants are, where you can create pressure with four guys, now in the secondary you don't have to run single coverage. You can run two or three different coverages. You can double guys, trap guys. It gives you a lot more flexibility back there. That's our goal."" We are going to create pressure with our front 4 and our D will go as far as they can take us. His next emphasis was on the secondary. We won't be having 3 LBs on the field that much at all. And when LBs are in the game, they are not rushing the passer. They are being a London Fletcher/Poz - making tackles and playing coverage. LBs on our scheme are somewhat overrated (we are not the Steelers), we need them to be able to wrap-up and tackle. Dominate front 4, great coverage secondary and good tacking average LBs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 He won't make it out of the first. Like I said, the third round http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/19/bruce-irvin-arrested-for-destruction-of-property/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBeck/cuba Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 If Zach Brown fell to us in the second it would be amazing, but I doubt it. The kid I like here is Bobby Wagner. He didnt participate in combine due to illness but was a beast in Ssenior bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Like I said, the third round http://profootballta...on-of-property/ Beating up a sign will not affect his draft value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 People will call me crazy but I'd have zero problem if the Bills picked this guy at #10. IMO, he's way beyond Keuchly or Zack Brown. In a prior post you made the claim that you thought Irvin was a better prospect than Von Miller, the second pick in last year's draft and the rookie defensive player of the year. As another poster pointed out Irvin is projected as a third round pick. I'm not going to call you crazy but I am going to say that you are overly enthusiastic and invested on this particular player. If Nix took Irvin with their first round pick he should be fired on the spot for being grossly inept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 zack brown, ronnell lewis, sean spence. then you got the tweeners like mercilus, perry, curry. who could possibly play at de/olb as well. then you got inside lbs that could possibly play outside like luke k, burfict. seems like wannsted wants speed at the lb position Ronnell Lewis basically played DE with his hand on the ground at Oklahoma... Projecting him to an NFL 4-3 OLB is a HUGE stretch...I could see the projection if he had 4.5 speed...But he's a 4.67 guy with virtually zero experience in Coverage...I really don't know where this idea that he is a 4-3 OLB comes from...Maybe in time...But I doubt it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 In a prior post you made the claim that you thought Irvin was a better prospect than Von Miller, the second pick in last year's draft and the rookie defensive player of the year. As another poster pointed out Irvin is projected as a third round pick. I'm not going to call you crazy but I am going to say that you are overly enthusiastic and invested on this particular player. If Nix took Irvin with their first round pick he should be fired on the spot for being grossly inept. That's perfectly fine, John. As always, I'll stand by my convictions… like most of us here would. Time will prove me right or wrong. Actually I believe if you can evaluate players and you watch the ample video evidence on Irvin, that you won't be able to draw any other conclusion than the one I hold. When you see how grossly he was misused at West Virginia (a 245 pound, 5-technique, 3-4 defensive end) and you see his above the 99th percentile athleticism (confirmed by his dominating performance at the combine), and the fire and violence and hunger he plays football with… yeah I believe this guy is going to be one of the 2-3 great players from this draft. BTW, I liked Zack Brown earlier but I saw some more recent video compilations of the guy and I've really soured on him. He had a particularly disastrous effort against Missouri this year where he was completely indifferent, often out of position, and was shying away from physical contact. Others here have championed Lavonte David and I agree that David is a very special player… but on my team I'd take Irvin first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 That's perfectly fine, John. As always, I'll stand by my convictions… like most of us here would. Time will prove me right or wrong. Actually I believe if you can evaluate players and you watch the ample video evidence on Irvin, that you won't be able to draw any other conclusion than the one I hold. When you see how grossly he was misused at West Virginia (a 245 pound, 5-technique, 3-4 defensive end) and you see his above the 99th percentile athleticism (confirmed by his dominating performance at the combine), and the fire and violence and hunger he plays football with… yeah I believe this guy is going to be one of the 2-3 great players from this draft. BTW, I liked Zack Brown earlier but I saw some more recent video compilations of the guy and I've really soured on him. He had a particularly disastrous effort against Missouri this year where he was completely indifferent, often out of position, and was shying away from physical contact. Others here have championed Lavonte David and I agree that David is a very special player… but on my team I'd take Irvin first. I thought I caught word of some legal trouble from Irvin last weekend- any details out yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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