uticaclub Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 remember the 3 ints RJ threw in the first half. we might have gone to the super bowl if flutie played in the playoffs with the team he led there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach55 Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 remember the 3 ints RJ threw in the first half. we might have gone to the super bowl if flutie played in the playoffs with the team he led there What game are you talking about??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Rob Johnson was 10 for 22, 131 yards. No TDs or picks. He was sacked six times. He pulled it together enough to engineer a lead-changing FG drive as time ran down in the 4th quarter. The yardage and completion percentage was worse than any game Flutie had that year. The Bills played well enough in that game so that despite his earlier failures, Rob Johnson could have won it for them. I don't htink that proves anything for him, I think it just goes to show that we had a really good defense. Over the course of the season, Flutie had been more successful facing equal or better defenses. Just because we should have won the game with Johnson doesn't mean that we weren't more likely to have won with Flutie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Rob Johnson was 10 for 22, 131 yards. No TDs or picks. He was sacked six times. He pulled it together enough to engineer a lead-changing FG drive as time ran down in the 4th quarter. The yardage and completion percentage was worse than any game Flutie had that year. The Bills played well enough in that game so that despite his earlier failures, Rob Johnson could have won it for them. I don't htink that proves anything for him, I think it just goes to show that we had a really good defense. Over the course of the season, Flutie had been more successful facing equal or better defenses. Just because we should have won the game with Johnson doesn't mean that we weren't more likely to have won with Flutie. This is where I go ballistic about the '99 season. Stop with the revisionist history - DF looked horrible against good defenses in that year. That is a fact. I don't know how you can make the above claim that 10 for 22, 131 yards, No TDs or picks is worse than 18-40-155, No TDs and 3 picks. Of RJ's 6 sacks, I believe 3 came in the first two series when Phillips thought it would be a good idea to have a one-legged John Fina line up against Kearse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chas Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Ever since we picked RJ over him weve been cursed. That is when this 10 years of missery officially began. Home Run Throwback the first Game after he was replaced. All downhill from there. It is so simple, this missery is the FLUTIE curse. http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-top-...utie-vs-Johnson http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-top-...utie-vs-Johnson There is no doubt in my mind, the BB win if Fluti plays that game, is the 3rd greatest QB in team history behind Kelly & Kemp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-top-...utie-vs-Johnson http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-top-...utie-vs-Johnson There is no doubt in my mind, the BB win if Fluti plays that game, is the 3rd greatest QB in team history behind Kelly & Kemp Faint praise indeed for a franchise that's really had 2.5 decent QBs in its entire history. And you're nuts if you put DF ahead of Fergy & Lamonica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 This is where I go ballistic about the '99 season. Stop with the revisionist history - DF looked horrible against good defenses in that year. That is a fact. I don't know how you can make the above claim that 10 for 22, 131 yards, No TDs or picks is worse than 18-40-155, No TDs and 3 picks. Of RJ's 6 sacks, I believe 3 came in the first two series when Phillips thought it would be a good idea to have a one-legged John Fina line up against Kearse Tennessee was the #25 pass defense in 1999; Baltimore was #6 (incidentally, we were #1). Flutie had good games against Pittsburgh (#4) and New England (#7), and bad ones against Baltimore and Miami. He was inconsistent against good defenses, and of course, capable of throwing a total clunker against Tennessee. There was a chance Flutie would have had a good game, and better-than-even odds he would have had a bad game. But Johnson had a terrible game capped by a good drive. They gave him a chance to win, he took it, and they lost it for him after that. He didn't win it through the first 58 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Tennessee was the #25 pass defense in 1999; Baltimore was #6 (incidentally, we were #1). Flutie had good games against Pittsburgh (#4) and New England (#7), and bad ones against Baltimore and Miami. He was inconsistent against good defenses, and of course, capable of throwing a total clunker against Tennessee. There was a chance Flutie would have had a good game, and better-than-even odds he would have had a bad game. But Johnson had a terrible game capped by a good drive. They gave him a chance to win, he took it, and they lost it for him after that. He didn't win it through the first 58 minutes. If there's a constant memory of the '99 season, it's a sad reminder of just how good the Bills' D was in that season - perhaps the best in team's history. So, to attribute the team's success to any of the two QBs in that season is ridiculous, because DF was pedestrian at best that year, as good teams figured out his game. That's why it's crazy to think that he would have been the difference in the game, considering that in the 4 of last 5 games that he started in '99, the Bills didn't score more than 17 pts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StamerforPrez Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Ever since we picked RJ over him weve been cursed. That is when this 10 years of missery officially began. Home Run Throwback the first Game after he was replaced. All downhill from there. It is so simple, this missery is the FLUTIE curse. Stupid post, if you were someone who believes in curses how could you not go as far back to 4 super bowl losses? Also as mentioned above flutie lost in pretty bad fashion the year before in the playoffs against miami. I didn't agree with Flutie's benching especially in that timely fashion, but it did seem to me that he was starting to lose a little bit of his flutie magic as that season went on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Which is as retarded a thing you can say because when RJ walked off the field the Bills had the gane won. Instead we choke on the kick coverage. How is that RJs fault? Oh...please do not forget that Flutie's playoff recordf with the Bills is 0-1. Everyone forgets he lost us the Miami game the year before by fumbling ther ball at the 1yd line. Where was the freakin' Flutiie magic that day? RJ gets hammered and Flutie gets a mulligan. PTR I haven't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conch Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 It was the right decision to start Johnson. Flutie could have never won that game. Flutie wins that game going away. It would not have come down to a kick return. Our D that year was better than I thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Ever since we picked RJ over him weve been cursed. That is when this 10 years of missery officially began. Home Run Throwback the first Game after he was replaced. All downhill from there. It is so simple, this missery is the FLUTIE curse. Hindsight being 20/20, I don't believe that it has anything to do with Flutie. Rather, I would perhaps more correctly label it the AJ Smith/ John Butler/ Buddy Nix Curse. That was when the talent train left Buffalo for warmer destinations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boltuprite Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 If you actually believe in curses....then I'd say the curse started the day Polian was fired Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 I haven't. ahh..selective memory...what about eric moulds dropping flutie's bomb the first play of the game? And if I recall that fumble correctly it was a hit by Jason Taylor that produced it. Flutie definitely would have won the game against Tennessee. Which qb had a history of winning big games under pressure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 ahh..selective memory...what about eric moulds dropping flutie's bomb the first play of the game? And if I recall that fumble correctly it was a hit by Jason Taylor that produced it. Flutie definitely would have won the game against Tennessee. Which qb had a history of winning big games under pressure? Selective memory? Moulds didn't drop the ball, he fumbled it and was held while trying to get the ball back. Flutie was sacked by the fleetfooted Trace Armstrong, when he imitated RJ by waiting 1 hour in the pocket for the play to develop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 i think it's the curse of Pete Gonzalez, after he failed to make this team ... never been the same since (or "sense" as some posters are spelling it these days). jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beebe's Kid Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Flutie was winner, regardless of the level he played at...BC, CFL, NFL... the guy won games. It is remarkable that people don't see that. Rob Johnson is/was a talented athlete, with no decision making ability. That was our chance to win the Super Bowl...We could have beaten any team that year....we were where we were because of Flutie. It was his game to win/lose. Too bad all of the arguing about his doesn't get us in the playoffs again, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Although I am a Flutieman, it was however, the grittiest game of RJ's career. He won that game for us (with one shoe on). I hate RJ, but it wasn't his fault Special Teams relaxed and choked. Actually, Johnson had a statistically terrible game against one of the worst pass defenses in the league - Tennessee, whose pass defense was 25th in yards allowed and 27th in TDs allowed in 1999. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 This is where I go ballistic about the '99 season. Stop with the revisionist history - DF looked horrible against good defenses in that year. That is a fact. I don't know how you can make the above claim that 10 for 22, 131 yards, No TDs or picks is worse than 18-40-155, No TDs and 3 picks. Of RJ's 6 sacks, I believe 3 came in the first two series when Phillips thought it would be a good idea to have a one-legged John Fina line up against Kearse Gerry, the thing is that Johnson actually sucked. We didn't know it at the time because he did have talent and would occasionally feast against mediocre-to-bad defenses (the Saints, Rams, and Niners in 98; the Colts in 99; the Ravens in 97). Was Flutie a world beater in 1999? Of course not. But he was always a better game manager than Johnson because despite his weasel-like tendencies, he was smarter and craftier. (Actually, those are the attributes of a weasel, so perhaps I shouldn't say "despite.") Consequently, I do think he would have performed better than Johnson in TN. TN's offense was terrible that day too. Re 1999, I'll never forget that Ravens game. He was terrible against probably the best defense in the league, but pulled off two miraculous plays at the end. Fun stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steely Dan Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Ever since we picked RJ over him weve been cursed. That is when this 10 years of missery officially began. Home Run Throwback the first Game after he was replaced. All downhill from there. It is so simple, this missery is the FLUTIE curse. Actually, it's the curse of Superman. Ever since the Bills cut Dean Cain they haven't won a Super Bowl. Although I am a Flutieman, it was however, the grittiest game of RJ's career. He won that game for us (with one shoe on). I hate RJ, but it wasn't his fault Special Teams relaxed and choked. If Flutie had driven the team down field with one shoe on it would be the stuff of legend. However, the Flutians believe it's something to criticize Johnson about. It was the right decision to start Johnson. Flutie could have never won that game. Johnson did have the Bills winning when he stepped off the field. Flutie/RJ? who cares......lets face it they both were below average. I personally would have gone with RJ and he played very well in that Tenn game and had us in the lead with just a few seconds left and the special teams blew it. While RJ never really amounted to much, Flutie was really struggling down the stretch that year. Defenses had started to figure him out and slow him down. Alot of Flutians also fail to mention Flutie lost the year before in the playoffs at Miami as he threw an interception late in the game. All in all it was a wash......neither one of them was a qb good enough to take us anywhere and we have had the qb merry go round since then. I have never understood the flutie fascination and I still can't believe he is mentioned by some around here like he was Brett Favre. He had a small stretch of games in the NFL where he did anything. Most of his stats he racked up in the CFL. He really wasn't that good of a player and from what a lot of posters have said over the years, he is a pompous jerk off the field. What he said. I'll add this. The team had traded a first round pick for RJ and he was a lot younger than Flutie. The team should go with the QB who needs experience and showed over all that between him and Flutie it was a coin toss. Johnson has a SB ring. What does Flutie have? No matter who shouldve started, or who blew the game......that is when the Flutie curse began, 10 years of losing football. Any ideas on how to break this curse? Yes, take a picture of Flutie in his Bills uniform and kiss his crotchal area. Then hug the picture tightly while thinking about being married to Doug, and how many SB's he'd have won if only those meanie weanie NFL HC's had seen the true Flutie talent. Oh wait, I'm sure that's been done by the majority of his fans already. I guess that won't work. Give it up...you'll never convince Flutie fans of the facts. RJ sucked, but so did Flutie and everyone who watched the 1999 season that doesn't own a Flutie blow-up doll can see that. When Moulds and Reed were constantly open and the QB refuses to throw the ball, it's poor QBing to say the least. Faint praise indeed for a franchise that's really had 2.5 decent QBs in its entire history. And you're nuts if you put DF ahead of Fergy & Lamonica. I wouldn't put him ahead of Frank Reich. Reich led the greatest comeback in NFL history. Tennessee was the #25 pass defense in 1999; Baltimore was #6 (incidentally, we were #1). Flutie had good games against Pittsburgh (#4) and New England (#7), and bad ones against Baltimore and Miami. He was inconsistent against good defenses, and of course, capable of throwing a total clunker against Tennessee. There was a chance Flutie would have had a good game, and better-than-even odds he would have had a bad game. But Johnson had a terrible game capped by a good drive. They gave him a chance to win, he took it, and they lost it for him after that. He didn't win it through the first 58 minutes. Don't the Flutians tout Flutie's magical ability to come back in games? Doesn't that mean he hadn't QB'd the team to a decisive win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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