reddogblitz Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 What made Bledsoe a "cancer"? Was having Bledsoe around another year really that much more a gamble than banking playoff hopes on Jeff Blake, or some other journeymen? Maybe we could have gotten Kelly Holcomb a year earlier? Besides gettting old and declining skills, I am still not sure why you hate Bledsoe so much...as bad as he was, I think keeping him another year, before throwing the woefully unprepared Losman into the fire, would have been a good move.... This is pretty much what I think. With Drew at the helm we had a highly motivated well functioning machine that won 8 out of the last 9 games in 2004. We also should have won a few of the early ones but got some horrendous calls like the push out TD against Jacksonville. Anyway, we had some serious mojo and momentum working. Then cutting the starting QB for a rookie is just plain dumb. That's why it was one of my biggest blunders of the 2000s. I think if we had kept Drew in there for another year and built on the momentum we had, we may have had a really good year. I'm still pissed about this. Drew was the only decent QB we've had since Flutie was run out of town on a rail. I'm sorry, I just don't think any team can win 8 of 9 games with a crappy cancerous QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 He was 'supposed' to be THE leader, yet all he cared about was collecting a paycheck. It didn't take long for that mentality to spread throughout the team, & it is still here to this day. Some Bills tried to stop the cancer, remember when AVP got hurt trying to keep TKO from ripping off Bledsoe's head? The very first move TD should've made after the brutal 2003 season ended was kicking Bledsoe out of town, NOT extending him. To TD's credit, at least he did carry through the next most important step & didn't re-sign the quitter Ruben Brown, you Ruben. Who knows how good J.P. could've been if he wasn't around Bledsoe his rookie year? He picked up a lot of Brain Dead habits, that's for sure, some role model & tutor. I am not sure where you are getting all of this from, but it sounds sort of speculative on your part. The whole TKO thing has been a rumor on this board for years, but, I haven't heard anyone confirm it. From what I know of the inner workings at 1 Bills Drive (I know someone who has worked there since the early 1990's, and another who worked for the team for about 5 years, up until last year) and neither had anything bad to say about Bledsoe, nothing of the sort. From all that I heard, he was popular with his teammates, and was the undisputed leader. Bledsoe may have sucked his final 2 years, but re-signing him hardly falls in the catastrophic category as the Panther re-signing Delhomme after his melt down last year. Most teams just don't cast aside a vetran starting QB, as many scars as his game might have, unless they are fairly certain they have a better option. There is always the hope that he will be able to tap the better part of his game. I think his biggest problem was, he got old... nothing else. Never the most mobile of guy, he just took too many hits, and his body (not his arm) started giving out on him. The Bills hired Sam Wyche to babysit and groom JP Losman..hold his hand. To blame his inability to mature on Bledsoe is kind of silly... funny you call Ruben Brown a quitter. I know it was always popular amongst Bills fans to say he was overrrated, but he was still worlds better than anyone who has held his position since. He "quit" to protest the way things were being done by the coaching staff. Even took a swing (IIRC) at a coach. Is that a lot worse than having a linebacker going after the head of the starting QB (alledgedly) on his own team, as you are applauding Spikes for? As for all the bellyaching about Pat Williams being let go, I remember starting a thread at the time, saying it was a huge mistake...many of the luminaries here on the board, insisted I didn't know what I was talking about. They came up with all kinds of stats, showing that "fat Pat" (as they loved to call him) was only on the field for something like 30% of the plays, and that his play was in great decline... it seemed like a good move, by many, at the time. I think, in judging any franchise, you have to give them a pass, to some degree, on making judement calls on talent...they are going to wrong sometimes. I think hiring GM's and coaches who are obviously in over their heads (see GM Levy, and coach Jaruon) are far worse offenses than passing on signing a player, or letting someone else go in free agency. Athletes skill levels increase and decrease all the time. GM's and coaches are evaluated for the mental acumen, not their physcial attributes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 The New Year is approaching ... what is your opinion on the ONE WORST Front Office move of this decade? My pick .... Willis McGahee ... 2003 draft section #23. We passed on:Larry Johnson (#27), Dallas Clark (#24), Rashean Mathis (#39), Anquan Boldin (#54), Osi Umenyiora (#56), Lance Briggs (#68), Jason Witten (#69) Ok. so hindsight is 20/20 and we didn't know these guys would be good... but did we really need a RB??? Travis Henry in the preceding year (2002) had 1,438 yards and 13 TDs... And so did 32 other teams.....Draft is a crap shoot.. We could have had Steve Hutchinson since OG was a need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 Drafting Mike Williams. Drafting Whitner over Ngata. Hiring Donahoe, Williams, Mularkey and Jauron. Letting Pat Williams go. Drafting McGahee. I thinking Pat Williams is the only issue here....We knew he was good and he was willing to give a Home Town discount...Yet Greg Williams chose to get rid of his FAT Men..... All the other items you mention is hindsight and is a crap shoot anyways... Donahoe was considered a genius GM coming out of Pittsburgh with a fire in his belly to prove to the Rooneys that they kept the wrong guy. Drafting Whitner was based on the defensive philosophy.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 Keeping Johnson over Flutie I agree. Instead of keeping a stellar vet w/ a good track record in terms of postseason wins, they instead went w/ RJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 Another to add to this list.... Resigning Peerless Price Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 I am not sure where you are getting all of this from, but it sounds sort of speculative on your part. The whole TKO thing has been a rumor on this board for years, but, I haven't heard anyone confirm it. From what I know of the inner workings at 1 Bills Drive (I know someone who has worked there since the early 1990's, and another who worked for the team for about 5 years, up until last year) and neither had anything bad to say about Bledsoe, nothing of the sort. From all that I heard, he was popular with his teammates, and was the undisputed leader. Bledsoe may have sucked his final 2 years, but re-signing him hardly falls in the catastrophic category as the Panther re-signing Delhomme after his melt down last year. Most teams just don't cast aside a vetran starting QB, as many scars as his game might have, unless they are fairly certain they have a better option. There is always the hope that he will be able to tap the better part of his game. I think his biggest problem was, he got old... nothing else. Never the most mobile of guy, he just took too many hits, and his body (not his arm) started giving out on him. The Bills hired Sam Wyche to babysit and groom JP Losman..hold his hand. To blame his inability to mature on Bledsoe is kind of silly... funny you call Ruben Brown a quitter. I know it was always popular amongst Bills fans to say he was overrrated, but he was still worlds better than anyone who has held his position since. He "quit" to protest the way things were being done by the coaching staff. Even took a swing (IIRC) at a coach. Is that a lot worse than having a linebacker going after the head of the starting QB (alledgedly) on his own team, as you are applauding Spikes for? As for all the bellyaching about Pat Williams being let go, I remember starting a thread at the time, saying it was a huge mistake...many of the luminaries here on the board, insisted I didn't know what I was talking about. They came up with all kinds of stats, showing that "fat Pat" (as they loved to call him) was only on the field for something like 30% of the plays, and that his play was in great decline... it seemed like a good move, by many, at the time. I think, in judging any franchise, you have to give them a pass, to some degree, on making judement calls on talent...they are going to wrong sometimes. I think hiring GM's and coaches who are obviously in over their heads (see GM Levy, and coach Jaruon) are far worse offenses than passing on signing a player, or letting someone else go in free agency. Athletes skill levels increase and decrease all the time. GM's and coaches are evaluated for the mental acumen, not their physcial attributes. 1. Extending Bledsoe WAS a total catastrophe, all you have to do is look at the Steelers game that year. Not only would Shane Matthews have won that game, he probably would've won at least 1 of the early-season games that year when Bledsoe was particularly brutal. Take Bledsoe off the 2004 team, and this franchise never hits the lowest of lows that exist today with no foreseeable future. Bills make the playoffs, TD stays, Marv never becomes GM, and Jauron never becomes head coach. Major and multiple disasters are averted. 2. Instead of grooming JP, Sam Wyche and his magic alarm clock spent all training camp trying to salvage a 10+ year Brain Dead vet's timing, WTF?!? Stick a Jeff Blake or a Shane Matthews in there, and Wyche would've been able to dedicate the proper amount of time working with a very green #1 draft pick QB. Of course, JP's broken leg didn't help either, Troy Vincent. 3. TKO did not quit on the team as that POS Ruben did, he tried to kill the cancer, BIG difference. If Ruben would've tried to rip off Bledsoe's head instead of QUITTING, I would still respect him. Ruben didn't like the way the coaching staff was running things? The coaching staff wasn't the big problem, it was Bledsoe. Gilbride went on to get a ring with the Giants, while Bledsoe killed the Bills and almost killed the Cowboys (don't know what the hell Tuna was thinking, bringing him in). It's funny how some people forget things as time marches on. Believe it or not, there are those who think a sad sack loser like Fergy was a very good QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 1. Extending Bledsoe WAS a total catastrophe, all you have to do is look at the Steelers game that year. Not only would Shane Matthews have won that game, he probably would've won at least 1 of the early-season games that year when Bledsoe was particularly brutal. Take Bledsoe off the 2004 team, and this franchise never hits the lowest of lows that exist today with no foreseeable future. Bills make the playoffs, TD stays, Marv never becomes GM, and Jauron never becomes head coach. Major and multiple disasters are averted. 2. Instead of grooming JP, Sam Wyche and his magic alarm clock spent all training camp trying to salvage a 10+ year Brain Dead vet's timing, WTF?!? Stick a Jeff Blake or a Shane Matthews in there, and Wyche would've been able to dedicate the proper amount of time working with a very green #1 draft pick QB. Of course, JP's broken leg didn't help either, Troy Vincent. 3. TKO did not quit on the team as that POS Ruben did, he tried to kill the cancer, BIG difference. If instead Ruben would've tried to rip off Bledsoe's head, I would still respect him. Ruben didn't like the way the coaching staff was running things? The coaching staff wasn't the big problem, it was Bledsoe. Gilbride went on to get a ring with the Giants, while Bledsoe killed the Bills and almost killed the Cowboys (don't know what the hell Tuna was thinking, bringing him in). It's funny how some people forget things as time marches on. Believe it or not, there are those who think a sad sack loser like Fergy was a very good QB. Equally funny when people use their own opinions, as facts, to win an argument. Really, Shane Matthews? And Joe Ferguson sucked? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 It's funny how some people forget things as time marches on. Believe it or not, there are those who think a sad sack loser like Fergy was a very good QB. I never forget. Bring back that duct tape avatar, Rico! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 Equally funny when people use their own opinions, as facts, to win an argument. Really, Shane Matthews? And Joe Ferguson sucked? Yes, Shane Matthews. Bledsoe was that brutal. And to his credit, Fergy did have 1 or 2 bright moments, but ultimately yes, he was a sad sack loser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 I never forget. Bring back that duct tape avatar, Rico! Can't, that website is GONE, & I didn't save it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 This is pretty much what I think. With Drew at the helm we had a highly motivated well functioning machine that won 8 out of the last 9 games in 2004. We also should have won a few of the early ones but got some horrendous calls like the push out TD against Jacksonville. Anyway, we had some serious mojo and momentum working. Then cutting the starting QB for a rookie is just plain dumb. That's why it was one of my biggest blunders of the 2000s. I think if we had kept Drew in there for another year and built on the momentum we had, we may have had a really good year. I'm still pissed about this. Drew was the only decent QB we've had since Flutie was run out of town on a rail. I'm sorry, I just don't think any team can win 8 of 9 games with a crappy cancerous QB. Ye of short memories. You can't remember how immobile Bledsoe was? How he always seemed to never be good enough to win a game, but could always find a way to LOSE a game (Bruschi sack and subsequent fumble by Bledsoe while driving for winning score against the hated Pats)? And let's not forget about his colossal hold time and tendency to STARE down his receiver before deciding to think about possibly throwing the ball. Drew had awesome arm strength. His accuracy was not too bad. But his extreme immobility and holding onto the ball sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo long was really what helped the Bills to lose games. Well, that and his timely turnovers. Especially against the Patriots. Oh, and the Bills 'D' was somewhere in the top 5 category most of the years Bledsoe was in Buffalo, if I recall. That, and having the best punter in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharper802 Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 Not my recollection. Williams was hyped as the next Munoz. McKinney had some red flags coming out of college, ironically I believe it was his dedication to the game You are correct and if memory serves he held out for about 1/4 of his rookie season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted November 5, 2009 Share Posted November 5, 2009 Oh, and the Bills 'D' was somewhere in the top 5 category most of the years Bledsoe was in Buffalo, if I recall. That, and having the best punter in the league. And that was the peak of the Bobby April era, I believe. McGee was a demon and Fast Freddie Smith was going to the house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Ye of short memories. You can't remember how immobile Bledsoe was? How he always seemed to never be good enough to win a game, but could always find a way to LOSE a game (Bruschi sack and subsequent fumble by Bledsoe while driving for winning score against the hated Pats)? And let's not forget about his colossal hold time and tendency to STARE down his receiver before deciding to think about possibly throwing the ball. Drew had awesome arm strength. His accuracy was not too bad. But his extreme immobility and holding onto the ball sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo long was really what helped the Bills to lose games. Well, that and his timely turnovers. Especially against the Patriots. Oh, and the Bills 'D' was somewhere in the top 5 category most of the years Bledsoe was in Buffalo, if I recall. That, and having the best punter in the league. Ye of short memories With Drew we won 7 or 8 of the last 9 games in 2004. Yes our defense was #2 in the NFL. But you don't win 7 out of 9 if your QB sucks. Just doesn't happen. He threw 20 TD passes that year. He wasn't the greatest, but I'd have liked to see him get one more year to buildo the 9-7 season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkyMannn Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 And to his credit, Fergy did have 1 or 2 bright moments, but ultimately yes, he was a sad sack loser. I followed the team for all of Joe F's career. When he retired, he was like the 20th all time QB in a lot of categories, which was kind of surprising, cause he WAS a SS loser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Can't, that website is GONE, & I didn't save it. All this time, I thought it was a self-portrait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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