2020 Our Year For Sure

Surely you meant abstain in the subtitle, as opposed to sustain.

Some of the biggest problems with these threads have nothing to do with your arguments. You tried to make a point that good teams don't tie up big money on WRs. Yes, the original premise of the thread was not using high draft picks on WRs...but then you said this: At this point, you went beyond the thread's original intention...this sentence is purely about the money tied up in the WR position. Even if we do draft a WR at #11, you can't make the claim we'd be paying our WRs as a group significantly more than last year's Pats* with Moss/Stallworth/Welker, or the Colts with Harrison/Wayne/Gonzales. BlueFire pointed this out, and you chose to go back and claim that sentence was about not wasting high picks on recieivers, when it was actually about not wasting big money on recievers. You would have been better served simply admitting you took the concept too far, and that the statement was wrong. The arrogant tone you take turns people off to your theories as much as, and maybe more than, your arguments do. Its okay to admit you're not infallible. None of us are.

$125 million to Hall and Javon Walker. Linemen? We don't need no stinkin linemen.

I clearly remember, after the season, a poster here linking to one of those websites that really pick apart the NFL's stats, and they showed that Lynch had the best ypc average when running off tackle to the right side. This would support the notion that Walker is actually a good run blocker, which is exactly what the word on him was when we got him. I believe the drawback to his game is that he can be beat by some of the quicker defensive ends in the passing game. So you may have that a bit backwards. And seeing as you'd hardly spend a 1st round pick on a guy you know is going to be a backup, I don't see us going tackle. Dockery is obviously going to start and from my perspective Butler did a fine job last year...maybe we could use some depth/competition at guard, but IMO that also need not be addressed on the 1st day. I'd be open to a center in the 2nd round, but unfortunately all that I've heard is that none of them warrant going until the 3rd. Still, if they do like somebody there, I'd be happy with the pick. Just one other comment...I had no interest in taking a corner on the 1st day before the Will James signing, so I'd certainly pass on them now. We have 3 rock solid corners and a young guy with potential, with 2 of those four having decent size. In all honestly I'd rather they go back to safety than add another corner on the first day. Just my (likely wrong) opinions.

I'd love to get Chad Johnson. You're right, it won't happen, but I'd gladly deal our 1st rounder for him. Third best reciever in the game, IMHO.

It actually makes very little sense. If you take a wide reciever in rounds 1 or 2, he's going to start. Then we have Roscoe and Reed in the slot...that's already a very deep group of recievers. There just wouldn't be anything left for Johnson. I'm really baffled by people who thought (and some who still seem to think) we were (or are) going to acquire two new recievers. Its just completely unnecessary. We have two deep threats in Roscoe and Evans, a good 3rd down guy who can work the middle of the field in Reed...there's just one role that needs to be filled, a possession reciever with SIZE who can help in the red zone. You don't need two guys to fill that roll.

Bills 10-6 Pats* 10-6 Jets 6-10 Dolphins 5-11

I have a bad feeling we're getting a corner.

For what its worth, I'd like to see the data recovered, every once in awhile I'd enjoy looking at some of my really old posts...but I wouldn't pay for it, so do what you please.

You're clearly a "Losman apologist." Whatever that means.

25 Million copies of George Washington tells me they do not believe he will be outplayed by Butler and Preston.

Actually, there was nothing Seattle could really do about it. After they put the transition tag on Hutchinson, Minnesota signed him to a contract with a poison pill in it. The deal he signed with the Vikes was for 7yrs/$49M including $16M guaranteed. But there was a stipulation in the contract that stated that if Hutchinson was not the highest paid offensive lineman for his team, then the entire $49M was guaranteed money...while the Seahawks had Walter Jones who would've been higher paid and made that stipulation relevant if they matched the offer, the Vikes obviously didn't have a lineman that would qualify. Seattle didn't really have a choice but to decline to match and let Hutchinson go.

With this poison pill tactic teams are using now, you wonder why anybody would bother trying to sign an RFA the old-fashioned way. The league needs to put a stop to this quickly.

Late-game stop against Jacksonville? Are you referring to the game in which Jacksonville took over with 2:58 left from their own 38, and our defense allowed them to go 62 yards in 2:30 to score the game-tying touchdown with 34 seconds left? You're right, a truly heroic defensive effort. "(:34) 9-D.Garrard pass short right to 18-M.Jones for 3 yards, TOUCHDOWN. Caught 3 yds. into end zone, along right sideline. 10-J.Scobee extra point is GOOD, Center-88-J.Zelenka, Holder-2-C.Hanson. JAX 24 BUF 24, 11 plays, 62 yards, 2:30 drive, 14:32 elapsed" link Fortunately, our offense was able to get into position for the game-winning field goal, despite taking over with only 22 seconds left.

I think McGahee will be here. I'm not sure about Spikes because we may decide we could put his cap room to better use, but I personally would like to give him another shot.

If I'm understanding your point correctly here, you're not happy with Price being used as a possession reciever, and maybe believe he should have been used more as a downfield threat. I think a problem with this is that Evans' bread and butter is the long ball. With Evans making plays 30-40 (or sometimes 83) yards downfield and certainly drawing the attention of defenses this upcoming year, the best thing we can get from our #2 would be a big, reliable target that Losman can easily find on 3rd downs. Someone with a natural ability to get open on short and intermediate routes, which I think is one of Price's biggest shortcomings...he just doesn't get open enough. My basic point is that with Lee Evans, a consistent playmaker on one side, its really inevitable that our Offensive Coordinator is going to use our other reciever as a possession reciever. If we had a #2 WR with the ability to take advantage of all the attention Evans is sure to get from defenses this year, it would dramatically improve our overall passing game, and our 3rd down percentage (which was a problem this year). At some point, we need to examine our recievers because a #2 with more of a presence could take this offense to another level. Seeing as we do have other needs, however, this offseason (may or) may not be the time. I've made a couple of lengthy posts in other threads about why I think we can go best player available early in the draft so I won't get into that now. But I do believe Dwayne Jarrett is a player who should at least be on our radar if the top players on our draft board aren't around when we pick. And if we end up trading down, I think Robert Meachem from Tennessee and Dwayne Bowe of LSU (who may be around in the 2nd round) are two big recievers that would add a new dimension to our offense and alleviate the pressure that Evans will get. Otherwise, I still think Price is somewhat expendable. I believe Josh Reed at least matches his abilties as a possession reciever if he can stay on the field (meanwhile, his injury probably caused a slight inflation in Price's mediocre stats). Price wasn't really used much in the capacity of a downfield threat, as you mentioned, so there wouldn't be much loss in that department. And during the season I was thinking that those WR screen plays that we ran to him should have been going to Roscoe Parrish anyway. Speaking of Roscoe, he had a reception against Jacksonville to set up a game-winning field goal that showed me he can replace Price's "toe work" that you mentioned. In all likelihood, Price stays this year, and its not the end of the world. I just think we should be keeping our eyes open to the WR position because an upgrade could go far in the way of helping Losman, Evans and McGahee play to their fullest.

Great avatar

Why? On a general note, I have this suspicion that our management realizes we're picking football players as opposed to positions...even if some members of this forum do not.

I doubt it. When would you say the offense opened up and JP's performance improved? Week 9 was Green Bay, week 10 was @ Indy, week 11 was @ Houston, and week 12 was Jacksonville...I'd say the offense opened up starting week 11 with the Texans, and I'm sure you'd agree. So drawing a line right where JP and the offense picked things up, here are Price's numbers: first 9 games 27 catches, 3 catches/game 231 yards, 25.6 yards/game last 7 games 22 catches, 3.1 catches/game 171 yards, 24.4 yards/game stats are from here As I see it, we have no reason to believe Price's production will be any better next year. Even when the passing game was clicking, he still wasn't providing us with what we need from our #2 reciever. With no increase in the numbers there's no reason to expect him to improve next season.

With the money it costs to franchise Clements counting against the cap this year, I doubt Derrick Dockery would be a Bill. Whats more valuable, one year of outstanding cornerback play, or seven years of a running game?

Strange line of thinking. How often do teams find a great outside linebacker in the 3rd round? Or a great cornerback? Or a quality run-stuffer? Maybe we should just skip our 3rd rounder altogether. Although I do believe Lindell is getting on in years, maybe we could draft his replacement?

Its only funny to Monty Python fans.

I know you want to trade down...but what if we can't? Why can't we consider all positions at #12? Okay, so who IS the 1-technique answer? Who are we locked into so much that we can't consider other positions, like OL, WR, DE, etc.? Again, who is so much better? As I said, I do realize you want to trade down, probably to the range where we'd be able to draft the crazy name from Penn State or Timmons...but if we can't trade down and are drafting from 12th, again, who are we so in love with that we must make a pick at this position and can't look at the entire draft board? Right. It doesn't really make sense for a Tampa 2 team to draft a CB 12th overall anyway...but even if we did, that draft pick wouldn't be any more of a sure thing than Youboty is. You realize this, and yet you still think we must pick from one of these positions in the 1st? On the contrary to what you stated, I don't think there's any reason why we can't pick the best player available. If we get a hard-on for Jarrett, Lynch, Anderson, Brown, or anybody else...and really think one of these guys is the type of player that will make an impact in the NFL...why can't we draft them? Can't defense be the priority without being the 1st rounder? If we drafted offense in the 1st and defense in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 6th and 7th...what would you say our draft emphasized?

Yeah, think of all the guard-tackle combos we could have on the right side: Preston-Whittle Preston-Walker Preston-Butler Preston-Pennington Whittle-Walker Whittle-Butler Whittle-Pennington Butler-Whittle Butler-Walker Butler-Pennington Merz-Whittle Merz-Walker Merz-Butler Merz-Pennington Walker-Butler Walker-Whittle Walker-Pennington And this is excluding Reyes, and anyone else who we acquire. Even if you were to assume Walker will start, there's still 7 different ways we could line up. Should be an interesting preseason.

It's funny cause its troo.