Mikie2times

I drafted him in fantasy, mistake one, fantasy aside, you can't tell me Buffalo had such robust offensive options Spiller shouldn't have been more involved. He's one of the most explosive players in the NFL, contract year, and we barely use him. Sure he got injured, but prior to the injury he wasn't getting a lot I looks either. I thought he was 100% gone entering this year. I can't imagine getting him 10 touches a game made him want to be Bill either, but maybe a coach who likes CJ comes on board and can get his attention. With him off such a bad year maybe the market isn't that favorable. Am I the only one who would like him back? I don't hear anybody really saying his name at all. Right coach, I think he brings a lot to the table. If nothing else in a situational role.

I would pull the trigger on number 1.

Ted Washington in his prime. I don't think he gets near to respect he deserves. From us or the rest of the league. I don't remember the last time I heard his name mentioned.

I wonder how many draft picks these 3 players would be worth.. Brady Rodgers Luck Brady because he's likely the best old man, more gas in the tank vs Peyton IMO. Rodgers because he's likely the best on his prime guy. Then Luck because he's likely the best younger QB. This obviously would never happen, it's just interesting to think how many picks a team would be will to offer for these guys.

Good management, flipping burgers to running an NFL organization, is largely about being able to predict what potential consequences could happen in the future as a result of the actions you take now. Weighing those consequences against the potential benefits and determining what the best course of action is. This is not an easy skill, not for one man or a group of advisors. It takes a special way of thinking to not only predict what potential future events could ocur but at what liklihood is the chance they will. In sum, the Bills failed in this regard when it pertains to the negotiation of Marrones contract.

Genius Chip Kelly wants Mariota more then any team wants any player in this years draft. If he doesn't figure out a way to make that happen obviously Foles would be off the table. As for the people comparing foles to anything we have, dogging him, saying he's not worth it. Most are refrencing one year, last year, his 3rd year in the league. Most sare saying he's a turnover machine. In 2013 he had 27 TD's and 2 Int's. Using that as a basis to analyze his future is just as stupid as using 2014. At the least, that 2013 year shows a better season then any quarterback we have had since Jim Kelly. For his career he has 46 TD passes and 17 INT's. What an atrocity for what will be a 4th year QB. On top of it all he's a downfield thrower, not a check, check, check. If you don't want Foles or think a better, more likely candidate could be avaliable I'm all ears. Based on age, performance, and trade likelihood, he is the best possible option and I'm convinced he will be wearing a Bills uniform next year.

Out of all the QB options that make sense, that seem possible, I see this being far and away the most likely QB to start for the Bills next season. Very strong arm, young, potential for a Franchise QB. His skill set matches with our offensive skilled players. I'm nuetral on him, but for me, he's our best option. So much better compared to say Cutler. A thought that makes me cringe. The Eagles will sell out for Mariota with Chip now in control of all roster decisions. That's his guy, perfect guy for his offense, he already knows more about him then any NFL executive, scout, or coach. He wants a more versitle QB. Somebody that can be a threat to run. I don't think they would go Herschel crazy in an attempt to trade up, but I have no doubt they will aggressivly seek a trade up. When the dust settles, they will deal Foles to us, likely for a 3rd rounder. Which is a bargain for a team acquiring a starting QB. How many starting QB's have we wasted 1st round selections on? I would even sell our 2nd rounder if we had to, not both, but I would be willing to part with a #2 given the nature of our situation and what is avaliable. If we want to talk about potential long term solutions, actual viable ones, I just don't see anybody else that seems attainable, young, and has the skills Foles does. If this does in fact happen, upgrade. Which I suspect will be a theme we will keep seeing as we find ourselves stuck in this period of uncertainty. I think we answer the question marks and not only answer them, but we upgrade them, not only QB but HC. I would feel pretty solid with this core, a good HC, a developing back up Manuel and a starting Foles.

I feel the same way. I think the combination of obsessive fan base, short list of pro teams, small market, and the media coverage probably make Buffalo among the more difficult places to work, specifically for a QB and HC. People want to minimize the crowd/media effect but I don't see it. I watched the same thing happen to Michigan football for years. The Media/Fan base just attacked them relentlessly, as they're probably even ahead of the Lions as the most beloved football team in Michigan. The pressure was so severe and so consistent it removed the ability for decision makers to provide stability in critical areas. What happened for Michigan has been happening in Buffalo for as long as I've been a fan. Why would anybody want to work in that environment? It's not about having thick skin, it's about not having to work in that environment if you don't have too. The flip side to this for the players and coaches, if you want to be immortal, you play in Buffalo. But you have to play well. Jim Kelly will be talked about in Buffalo for decades after Marino will be talked about in Miami. Michigan got that "A" player in Harbaugh, hard nosed, said screw it, I want this challenge. Michigan had deep pockets. We will need our guy to develop on time, time that history has shown to be very limited if you play for the Bills.

I agree on all everyting about the shenanigans that followed. I'm certainly glad he left after all that has come out, but I remember at the time feeling surprised. Even without the benefit of knowing more information now, I don't think any of us should have been surprised he left or that the Bills didn't challenge more. If anything this is the path that seemed very likely.

Personally, I don't care for Marrone all that much. I don't know what he has done to gain such appeal. He made Syracuse a .500 team and never broke our playoff drought. Now he's some kind of hot commodity. Again, this doesn't make sense to me. If he stayed I would have taken him and supported him, but I still would be wondering the whole time if any tangible reasons exist why I should put my confidence in this man. Since he left he has faced an avalanche of criticism. A lot of it deserved, but at the same time, I can't blame Marrone for making the best business decision possible. This is a business, even though as fans it seems more pleasure, but for Marrone, it's like his 9-5. So as far as him being castrated for leaving, I'm not very supportive of that. It made sense for both of us and both parties did a good job making the correct decisions. If you look at Marrone situation purely from a business stand point this decision is a no brainier and he played his hand exactly how he should have. He had new ownership surrounding the team, he had to know he had one more year to reach the playoffs or he would be on the street. A proposition he currently faces with no starting QB and several question marks. The current job market is wide open, as much as it's ever been. He had interested teams. None of that would be guaranteed if he got fired following the 2015 season. The job market could be more competitive and he might be looked at in the same favorable light he's looked at now. Within all this he had a strained relationship with Whaley. So when he put some feelers out to determine teams interest and saw that he got a solid response, he said why not leverage this guy. So that's exactly what he tried to do. Buffalo wasn't going to play those games, I'm glad they didn't. Our management team did the correct thing by not yielding to the demands of a career .500 coach with zero playoff appearances. So both parties did the right thing.

I echo what others have said. It mattered. This is the deal in football. If you get knocked down you get back up. Duh. It's a lot easier to motivate a group after they get knocked down. What is not easy to do is keep a group playing at a high level once you have success. Success breeds complencey. The type of slow, creeping, sneaky compleceny that is strong enough to pop the inflated heads of all but the best teams. In the loss to the Raiders the Bills showed they did not belong in the playoffs. Oakland put a bullseye on Buffalo's back based on the success they had vs Green Bay, Buffalo got sucked into hearing how amazing it was they shut down Rodgers all week on ESPN. After a defining moment such as the one we had against the Packers a great coach, a great tean, one that deserves the playoffs HAS to know at that moment they face the biggest threat of a letdown. Which is exactly what they had and in a win or go home game no less. Proud of the team this year, but they have a ways to go about learning how to be successfull.

I'm thinking Schwartz has more then a little to do with how well the Bills played against the NFC North. He basically had the entire script on that Division and it showed.

Most people don't picture gay people having sex when they think of gay people. No it is not a pleasant thought for most straight men, but again, it generally isn't thought about by straight men. If I meet a gay person, he/she, is well, sort of just a person. I tend not to visualize penises going into any cavities. That's sort of messed up that you think about that stuff. I'm really not trying to be a prick, my mind just doesn't go to that place. I really don't give a fug about Sam being gay or not. Glad we didn't draft him, only from the standpoint that I don't want our team distracted with media. Which is a possibility. If the talent was high enough I wouldn't care. It would be worth the media risk, but the talent just wasn't high enough. As far as me not giving a fug, it's just because I don't care if people are gay or straight. Sexual orientation really isn't a choice for the overwhelming majority of people. I recognize this as a step in the correct direction of society, not nearly as strong as Jackie Robinson, but similar in it's circumstance. Unfortunately, 60+ years post Robinson and I still feel a lot of racism, at least behind closed doors. The unfortunate thing about the less tolerant is they seem to breed faster.

Your line of thinking is correct in some ways and flawed in others. Yes, the trade is technically the same as us giving 2 first round picks and a fourth to Cleveland under a scenario in which Cleveland Drafted Sammy Watkins and traded him to us. But Cleveland did not draft Sammy Watkins, more importantly the bills were getting one first round pick no matter what. Neither of which you factor into this equation. You got 1 addition (Sammy Watkins our guaranteed 1st round pick ) - 2 Subtractions, next years 1st round pick and the 4th round pick. The net loss is the 1st round pick and the 4th round pick. We had no net loss regarding this years 1st round selection. In fact we had a net gain. Let's look at this in more detail not factoring in any weight to future years picks being worth less then current years picks. The scale teams use to value selections has the following.... 4th Pick = 1800 points 9th Pick = 1350 points So the Bills gained 450 points this year according to the standardized scale teams use. In 2015 the Bills will lose both a 1st round pick and a 4th round pick. If we draft between 15th to 20th next year it will result in a max loss of 1125 points at 15 at 20 it's 912 points. So if you don't factor in a following years pick to be more devalued (which it is) the Bills would lose an average of 1018.5 Points in 2015 if you feel they will average between the 15th and 20th slot. They Gained 450 in 2014. So the net difference is - 568.5. Now, I'm of the mindset that Sammy Watkins was a #1 or #2 OVR draft pick. This just happened to be an insanely talented draft. So if he does in fact have the value of a #1 or #2 the Bills get an additional 800 to 1200 points in draft pick value. Which would put them well ahead even under conditions that aren't accurate (again, future picks are valued less). I tend to think the Bills got a guy more likely to be a 1 or 2 type then a number 4. Just because something costs a lot, it doesn't mean you still didn't get a great deal.

Thanks my bills brethren. At that time the decision made sense on all fronts. I know I wasn't fair weather, I don't think you can be a fan of this team and hold that title, it just bummed me out that I lost touch with it so much over the last few years and it felt a bit fair weather. I was starting to hate all the innards of the team and what are you supposed to do when it's YOUR team and you hate the front office and don't exactly enjoy the players? I know a lot of you know what I'm talking about. Just the frustration with how the franchise has been ran and the results. Now I'm more stable on the finances, I'm pretty pumped to get back into it again. It was a lot of fun when I took more interest in it. I feel safe for the first time in a long time in doing so. Safe in the sense that it's worth the commitment of time and energy. Everything has seemed to hinge on the QB since Jimbo left which has left us completely SOL for the better part of my life. Now we have a team. A very good collection of players and when you have that it opens a lot of possibilities. I think we have the right front office in place, the right coach, and it sure as heck doesn't hurt that we drafted Sammy. The second I saw him as a True Freshman I thought this guy is going to make one heck of a pro. I would have never thought in a million years he would be wearing our colors. This is going to be an exciting couple years. Edit* Said since Jimbo left, change that to post MCM. Those Bills Defenses with Flutie and Johnson were nasty.

Ya, I really don't have a problem with this move or even the comments from McCoy. CJ is pure lightning, Freddie is effortless power and grace, Brown is blunt force trauma. CJ and Freddie are great on 3rd down, Brown is not. It really will be a pain in the rear keeping up with these three. All 3 are very different, so slapping a "he's just a back up RB" statement on Brown is a little unfair. His style likely makes it easier for CJ and Freddie as both do for him, past that Brown could play much larger role on this team in 2015.

You would have to think at some point age catches up to Freddie. He glides and he didn't get abused as a younger player, that helps, but he's getting very old for RB standards. CJ always seems to get hurt as his touches increase. He's one of the most dynamic players in the game but he has a hard time staying healthy and is at the end of his contract. If anybody remembers Derek Holmes, that's sort of what Brown reminds me of. Sometimes he can get cute, but he runs angry. It's a great compliment to CJ and Freddy for right now as all 3 have different styles. It's also great protection for us, because CJ and Freddy might not even be in the equation in a another year. Brown is starting material and potentially the most viable work horse style back of the 3 both in 2014 and moving forward.

He's responding the way I would expect him to respond, defensively. Which explains his snap reaction. He's sick of answering questions pertaining to the QB position when his current QB has been labeled a premature bust (I think EJ will bust, but I also recognize it's impossible to tell after 1 year, I just didn't like him at FSU). He's also got guys with starting experience in the system as back ups right now. Perhaps the thought of adding a slightly more skilled back up, while making us better, makes him a bit apprehensive, as that is the type of player the fans could be calling for if EJ starts slow. Not that those fans calling for such a switch would benefit us or be right, it's just a predictable situation. When in reality, as far as any potential back ups go that we could bring in, after learning the system they would likely not be much better then what we currently have, given the time the players we have spent in the system. In sum, back off my Starter and I think my back ups are about the same as what is available without the risk of a sloppy mess. If this is in fact his thought process, I can't really blame him.

I've been here a pretty long time. This is actually my second handle, a long time ago when the site changed I lost my log in and restarted. Let's just say I've been around nearly since the beginning. I grew up in Michigan and started to love the Bills as a kid. Lions never interested me, I turn 32 on Tuesday, so that would make me a Bills fan for 24 years now. The last 6-7 years I have to say I feel a bit ashamed, almost like a bandwagon fan. Before that time I could tell you the two deep on the practice squad, I knew every player, every players strengths/weaknesses. I live, cried, and died Bills every Sunday. About 7 years ago I ended up taking a shift at work on Sunday, a fairly lucrative shift, being a Sunday, nobody really wanted it. This meant no more live Bills games. It was a difficult decision, but I have to say it felt a little easier to make just based on the direction of the franchise. This is how I mean it felt sort of bandwagonish, I sort of turned my back on things, I still followed games of course, but live, cry, and die? Not anymore. No postings on potential playoff scenarios in which I so happily used to do on the site. No in depth player knowledge. The bottom line, I was a burned out fan, scorn for many years, looking at a team of players I didn't really care for, drafted by management I didn't really like. I saw no reason to try and enjoy this team because any moment of joy seemed to be so marginal for so many years. We always seemed to draft outside in. I have no hair but if I was blessed with some more I would have certainly ripped it all out. Well, my hiatus is now over. On Monday I'm going back to requesting Sundays off again at the start of the season and returning to full fandom. I like the front office, I like the coaching staff, for once I think they're working hand and hand and building inside out. In this league you either win with a great team or a great QB, I don't think EJ is going to be a great QB (still up for debate) but i do think we have the pieces in place for this to be a great team. This team is young and athletic. IMO this draft will prove to be the draft that helps break the Playoff drought. I watch a ton of college football (I do have Saturdays off) I think Sammy Watkins will end up being the best WR we have had since Eric Moulds, I also thought he was the top overall player in the draft. Few people can come in at his age and dominate 20/21 year old players as Watkins did as an 18 year old. You just don't see it very often. This is an elite prospect. Cyril Richardson in round 5? That was an unreal value. This kid has dominated the BIG 12 for multiple years. Between Kouandjio and Henderson at Tackle, one will work out and in a potentially big way. Both slid substantially but for different reasons. Bryce Brown has a heck of a lot to show you. Great compliment to Spiller. Loved our FA selections. This team is going back to the playoffs soon, I have waited so long for it, I'm sure as heck not going to miss it now.

IMO Sammy Watkins will turn out to be the best/most talented draft pick since Eric Moulds, which dates back to 1996. I think Watkins could prove to be even better then Moulds, which is saying a ton. Moulds nearly had 10,000 yards receiving. All I can say is wow. Very happy about this selection. Watkins is a very rare talent, he would go #1 OVR in most draft classes.

As a team that spends less, has a below average winning %, and rates low in the sexy city factor, it is very frustrating to see a player we drafted and developed let go with nothing in return. In most cases this team is not going to acquire elite talent via free agency, Mario was a major exception, but typically we go for value guys in free agency, then we acquire our real talent in the draft. Drafts in which our recent record accurately reflects our ability to evaluate talent (we don't do a fantastic job at it). This all makes losing a guy like Byrd or other home grown talents even more frustrating. He's a guy we did a great job with in our draft selection and in development, since we lack pools of money, win%, and sexiness we lose a lot of the better selections we make. Almost every time we lose a player in a similar situation as Byrd we hear the same comments. Why didn't we get something for him in return? Since it's such a readily used statement hear I was wondering if anybody had any basis for making such a statement. Is it common practice to leverage a a franchised player and acquire draft picks for him? Better stated, what % of franchised players are traded for draft pick compensation. I have no idea what the answer to this is but I would be inclined to think it's rather low. Probably less then 10% maybe even less then 5%. I don't think it happens very frequently just based on the nature of the situation. Usually a franchised player seeking exile will hold out on the first tag, it's the second tag in which things unravel. If the player is hell bent on hitting the market at that point, literally hell bent, is a tag/trade a good position to be in? As a team you take on the league wide impression that you're not very player friendly in negotiation something maybe an elite team can afford but not one with so many chips against them. On top of that you lower your bargaining position by a large margin as teams know you basically just signed a time bomb for a sign a trade, they have no problem letting you hold that bomb as long as possible. Best case scenario, in the majority of the cases, you either get marginal compensation or the trade never happens and you have a guy that you don't want playing for you an entire year (because he clearly doesn't want to play for you). I know we like to indulge in the Monday Morning QB talks, I just think this tag and trade concept so readily used is better served for Madden vs the real NFL.

I just don't get our philosophy at the QB position the last decade. It's either a Rookie or a fringe Vet we hope can pan out. Then we go all in on that one player. Then we treat the player like we treat our coaches. Anywhere from 2-3 years and see you later. Usually the decision to only try the experiment 2-3 years is justified because we haven't picked good coaches or good QB's since the glory days, still, it's always 2-3 years of wasted time, repeat the process and start all over again. We force ourselves into these commitments because we always are drafting a first round QB. God forbid we target some 3rd-6th round players, use a couple selections at QB in a year (many QB's do in fact pan out at the mid round level). Proportionately, a completely disproportionate amount do comparative to other positions. It's such a critical position, it would just be nice to get a few mid level draft picks spent at QB. Take on more of a volume strategy. Best man for the job and we don't get that forced 2-3 year commitment a first round pick guarantees. Even though he didn't pan out Trent Edwards was probably my most optimistic QB draft pick we had in a long time, just because he wasn't a damn 1st rounder and has potential. You just don't know what your getting with those types, but what you don't get is the investment factor. They need to win the job and perform well to keep the job. Just about all first round QB's barring abomination will get at least 2 years. It is way too early to tell with EJ, which is an easy statement to make, it's true, also one we have used with countless other quarterbacks over the years. Personally, I don't think EJ is our guy. I base it more just from watching him at FSU vs his first season. I remember always thinking when I saw his FSU games that he was gonna rob a team one day. Great skill set, the kind that gets you drafted in the first round, but he didn't seem to have the overall game I would expect to see translate to the NFL. He struggled in the areas I was concerned about, areas most rookies struggle in. We will see. Either way I would like us to look at 1 or 2 mid level QB's this year in the draft.

I know I'm a little late to the party here as this thread seems to have turned into a debate on homosexuality. Perhaps this was already discussed, I read threw about 10 pages and didn't find anything. I would have serious concerns over drafting Sam just because he's never really played a down as an openly gay man. We can say he has at Missouri, OK, his teammates knew about it but that is it. He was a beast on the field. He already won over that teams respect by being the best player on the team. Nobody on the Tigers was slurring him, nobody was crossing him, no opposing teams or fans knew anything about him. The NFL is going to be a much different environment. He likely isn't going to walk in and dominate, not according to his original draft projections. So he's not earning any teammates respect by simply being the best. He likely will take a lot of locker room shots, he certainly will be taunted endlessly on the field by opposing players, and depending on the location, he's likely to get his fair share from drunk a-holes. All the while, the cameras will be rolling 24/7 on the entire situation making a spectacle of it all. It's one thing if Sam was a projected top 10 guy and this has him sliding well into the 3rd or 4th round and you can scoop him up with major upside, but Sam was never projected at that level. It was debatable if he was even 3rd rounder or better before this announcement. Making an NFL team is hard enough as a straight man, this guy will go thru hell to make it in the league and he stands a decent chance of having to go thru that hell without even starting for several seasons. I guess the point I'm trying to make here is what is the upside? How does drafting a mid level player who walks into this situations beneficial to any team? I just see drafting him as a bad business decision, just too much media and unknown variables in the equation for a guy that is likely a fringe starter or situational pass rusher.

Thanks guys, I might be able to handle staying up until 2-3am Sunday night. I think it would be hard to get past Monday without hearing something. If nothing else I usually have a few coworkers ask me if I saw the game, one Dolphin fan in perticular. For that price, OD streaming, even if it's just a review it seems well worth it. No more posts about EJ live, I'm signing up!

Now that might be viable, thanks man! It needs to be on demand streamed content, I dont have cable. So that looks like it could be my best bet. Affordable rates also. I wonder how long it takes for the games to show up? I would love it if I could hibernate and not know the score, come home, and watch the full game after work.