oldmanfan

He is a narcissistic con man who right now is trying to tear down our democracy by making false accusations about the election. You want unity and to break corruption (as if his administration has done either)? We need a viable third party and/or have those in the middle politically (like you and me I suspect) take the country back from the fringe lunatics.

An outsider is one thing. A pathologic personality like Trump's is another.

We had a fair and free election and we have a three year old trying to now say our entire election process is wrong. And let's recall, he was claiming this before votes were even cast to protect himself against having to admit his own failure. This has potential devastating consequences for the future. There is an article on Politico's web site, indicating there are Republicans that lost elections by dozens of percentage points that refuse to concede, and instead are talking about irregularities and machine problems and all this crap. If our electoral system is destroyed, there goes the country. And that cannot be allowed to stand. We need to save the country at this point. If he refuses to leave, then arrest him and charge him with sedition. If he actively tries to foment rebellion (as in get people like The Proud Boys) to riot) then charge him with treason. And if supporters riot, take them into custody and charge them. If Congressmen or women support this, don't swear them in as they are in violation of the Constitution and as such would not be faithful to their oath. And I would say the same thing if it were a Democrat acting this way. We have passed the point of being ridiculous now. We are letting the three year old dictator wanna be to foment insurrection and it must be stopped.

Ok boys, let’s matriculate the ball down the field!

Laws be damned? Go ahead and try- you’l be dead or in jail.

It is done. It was done Nov 3rd. The only reason we have to put up with this is because a 3 year old in the White House is having a temper tantrum. If he tries anything else like forcing legislators to change the will of the people he should be arrested for sedition.

But it could lead us towards somehow improving weakened immune systems.

Well, the connection is simple: the virus. Why it affects people differently has to do with initial viral load, the patient’s immune system, and co-morbidities. I’d focus on children and why they can carry a large viral load and still have low incidence of symptoms.

I am guilty of getting too hot under the collar myself at times. Feel free to call me out if I do so.

Ideally we should outfit everyone in the country with N95 masks, as they are the most efficient and can be fitted better than cloth. The gaiter ones should not be used. That would be my first move if I were running the show

Unfortunately folks will drift to their own echo chambers with like minded individuals, which will just inflate division and ignorance. We are at a time when problem solving for all the issues facing the country is needed, but no one understands the value of discussion and compromise

Underrated. Great leader, handles team dynamics well. And a good winning record.

You can't say masks are a tool for the spread of the virus but not a solution. Those don't match, and do not agree with both observational studies as well as many lab studies indicating that masks can help control spread of droplets and aerosols, the vectors by which the virus is transmitted. I would encourage you to look at the Duke study on masks, it shows that different masks are more effective at controlling droplet spread. One of the issues with designing really good research is to avoid bias up front. That is the biggest issue with studies I have reviewed and rejected for publication; they have a preformed conclusion and try to set up experiments to support it. It might be mask studies reflect that a bit, depending on the specific study you review. But the bigger issue with observational studies, especially with masks, is you depend on the study participants to independently do what you ask in the way you instruct them, or they falsely report what they're doing. For masks, I suspect there is some of that going on, either not wearing them correctly or saying they wear them and don't. I know you live there and see a lot of mask wearing, but you don't know what's going on behind the scenes. I could theorize on other unknown variables that could be affecting rates. Perhaps the spread in very small aerosol droplets is increasing, which would be an argument for all to wear surgical or N95 masks (see the Duke study which would concur), and that would then be an issue for government to be able to supply these. Perhaps virus lasts longer on surfaces than currently believed. But just knowing something about viral infection in general, I can't think of other independent variables that would affect things, Respiratory viruses spread by either contact or inhalation. Covid seems to be highly infectious, which means that strenuous use of mitigating factors is needed to slow things down. Again, slow things down and not completely prevent. You can't let great be the enemy of good. The mitigating strategies, on their own are good things (really the only things) we can do right now while waiting for vaccines to be widely distributed. Vaccines will be great, masks and hand washing and such a re good. They are not mutually exclusive.

No, not at all. You talk about science; I am a clinical lab director and researcher for 40 years, so I am a scientist. And science generally is not an all or none phenomenon. The mitigating factors I described are just that, mitigating factors. When used correctly they will greatly diminish the spread of the virus. They are not cures. If used correctly they deprive the virus of hosts for infection We will have vaccines now, and the early data is they seem to be very effective. But to have them to work, or to have things like masks and such work, it requires a team effort. This is a public health crisis and requires public unity to fight it. That is why these silly arguments about masks need to stop, and why people need to get vaccinated.

I suspect your estimation of either the number of people properly wearing masks, number of people really doing distancing, or number of people properly hand washing may be off. This is an extremely contagious virus so it has to be all hands on deck continuously and correctly. Unfortunately that isn't being done as well as it could be. We all need to remember these are mitigating strategies designed to limit spread, they don’t completely eliminate.

Good point

Indeed. I’m comfortable in that regard. And you?

The protestors should have distanced more. They were outside and the ones I watched the participants were masked. So not perfect to be sure. Better than inside with no masks. Data means something. Guesses don’t.

Show me data. That's what science believes in. If you are so sure of this (an I have already said that if protestors were out there unmasked it was dumb and should not have been done), then go look at infection rates before and after in the communities where there were protests. Either prove your point or don't.

As a scientist I believe in data. I haven't seen data that shows an uptick in Covid infection rates in cities where protests took place. Doesn't mean the data isn't there, just that I haven't seen it. So I would suggest if you want to make your point, find data to do so. Simply saying it must have caused an uptick is not science. Logically one would think so, but data proves it. Show me data. There is data on a pretty significant positive infection rate at the White House including you know who. Oh, and you mentioned lockdown. Outside of I think California in certain areas, at present I am not aware of any quarantines or absolute lock downs. Again, if that is in error feel free to correct me. At the initiation of the pandemic lockdowns were put in place, primarily to protect hospitals from being overrun. If infection rates continue to increase, states and communities will have to look critically at ICU space, bed availability and such. But right now the emphasis is on the mitigation strategies.

Couldn’t agree more

Oh, the fake Internet tough guy is back. I think I hear your Mommy calling. Perhaps it's nap time? As for the video, we don't nee this kind of crap in this country. We don't need a civil war sparked by the narcissistic impulses and overblown ego of the man-child that leaves office next month.

The difference between the protests and the Trump rallies were that, from the footage I saw, protestors were masked and Trump rallies weren’t. Both were outside, at least many of the Trump rallies, which helps. Of course, you had the Trump rally inside in Tulsa that appears to have triggered infection, and the meetings, etc. at the White House that caused infection.The protests were not as safe as desired, I heard commentators discuss that. I don’t know if there is data on the infection rates in communities with protests and if they increased post-protest. If you have data on that I’d be happy to review it. And I would not write off anyone to any reason where stupidity caused a higher risk to Covid than needed. I understand why people protested but from the perspective of Covid it was dumb and they should have found other ways to do so.

Because everyone should get vaccinated, otherwise they put themselves at jeopardy.

Not racist. Stupid, but not racist.