Magox Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Magox you like to point out crusades when all anyone does is discuss the truth and facts of what Trent did on the field. You seem to be the only one on a crusade here...and two of them... 1. You are on a crusade to prop Trent up to have done more than he has. In fact, you blatently ignore factual stats to the contrary. 2. You are on a seperate crusade to discredit a Pro Bowl QB to further prop up Edwards... We will just have to agree to disagree because I dont even know how to respond to your outrageous claims for Trent and even worse ones from Cutler...especially when you continuously blatently ignore factual evidence to the contrary of your discussion... No biggie...everyone is entitled to their opinnion...see you on another thread... I'm sure we will continue this discussion, if not on this thread on another one, like always Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 One last thing Magox...3 games dont make a career, especially in a 25 year old QB...otherwise Trents would be over as he had a 3 game stretch that had us 0-3 in our division that was light years worse than Cutlers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 I never said that Cutler wasn't a bad qb. I said it on another thread a couple times that Up to now, Cutler is more accomplished. He made the probowl, has the bigger arm, classic gunslinger. His 4th quarter qb rating is good. But the bottom line is, that up to now, when they needed him most, he didn't deliver. That is not an unfair statement. It is the truth. Will Cutler have more important games in his career moving forward. I would think that he most likely will. But up to now, in the 3 biggest games of his career, he hasn't produced. So when this thread was created, the original poster stated his reasons why he wouldn't want Cutler, and I stated mine. fair enough? The bills were 5 and 2 going into week 8. As I assume you remember they then lost four straight. During that span the Bills not only fell below .500 but they obliterated their conference record. In that 4 game stretch, Trent threw for 784 yards and scored 4 Tds (1 of them rushing), while comitting 10 turnovers. I mean as long as we are talking about important games, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 One last thing Magox...3 games dont make a career, especially in a 25 year old QB...otherwise Trents would be over as he had a 3 game stretch that had us 0-3 in our division that was light years worse than Cutlers... Your right, it doesn't make a career. and PushthePile, your right to, Trent had some bad games where he looked at times to lack confidence. In my view, I wouldn't want to trade for Cutler, considering what Trent has shown in his first full year with limited talent, his maturity that he has shown, and what we would have to give up to get him. Now that Trent is entering his second full year, with more weapons, and more experience, I think next year will be a more accurate way to determine if He is our future qb. agreed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Your right, it doesn't make a career. and PushthePile, your right to, Trent had some bad games where he looked at times to lack confidence. Now that Trent is entering his second full year, with more weapons, and more experience, I think next year will be a more accurate way to determine if He is our future qb. agreed? See, even I agree with that...the most sensible thing you said all day... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Your right, it doesn't make a career. and PushthePile, your right to, Trent had some bad games where he looked at times to lack confidence. In my view, I wouldn't want to trade for Cutler, considering what Trent has shown in his first full year with limited talent, what we would have to give up to get him. Now that Trent is entering his second full year, with more weapons, and more experience, I think next year will be a more accurate way to determine if He is our future qb. agreed? Trent in my mind deserves to be the starter next year and I agree that it will be the best gauge as to what he has. I am very skeptical about how much he can improve but I do believe it's possible. With that being said if he doesn't improve on his production, he's done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizell Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Now that Trent is entering his second full year, with more weapons, and more experience, I think next year will be a more accurate way to determine if He is our future qb. agreed? best post I've seen by you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 best post I've seen by you. still waiting for yours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted March 18, 2009 Author Share Posted March 18, 2009 The point to all of this remains that while QB is the most important position in football, giving up boatloads of picks for Cutler is ridiculous. No one on here has any clue what the Bills would have to give up to acquire this guy, and therefore any debate about getting him is non-sensical. I don't think he's a guarantee to win that many more games than Edwards. But I guarantee you the price over Edwards will be high. But people come out of the woodwork to say it has to happen. Building an entire team for now and the future would drastically be affected by giving up draft picks. And who's to say Cutler wouldn't want a huge contract right away? Probably something in the 5-6 year range for 13M+ per. The deal loses luster considering the financial price and amount of resources it'd take to get him. And BTW, Denver has Ryan Clady, so Peters is not a commodity for them. When you look at the on-field product alone here, sure it looks nice and shiny to trade for JC. Peel back a few layers, and it's not all that great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 The point to all of this remains that while QB is the most important position in football, giving up boatloads of picks for Cutler is ridiculous. No one on here has any clue what the Bills would have to give up to acquire this guy, and therefore any debate about getting him is non-sensical. I don't think he's a guarantee to win that many more games than Edwards. But I guarantee you the price over Edwards will be high. But people come out of the woodwork to say it has to happen. Building an entire team for now and the future would drastically be affected by giving up draft picks. And who's to say Cutler wouldn't want a huge contract right away? Probably something in the 5-6 year range for 13M+ per. The deal loses luster considering the financial price and amount of resources it'd take to get him. And BTW, Denver has Ryan Clady, so Peters is not a commodity for them. When you look at the on-field product alone here, sure it looks nice and shiny to trade for JC. Peel back a few layers, and it's not all that great. These are very valid points BillsVet. I have primarily argued with posters who have tried to claim Cutler wouldn't be an upgrade over Edwards. Lost in the mix is at what cost would that trade come. Without the knowledge of trade talks, who knows what the Broncos are looking for. The same can be said for all of the trade Peters threads. How can anyone have a firm opinion on trading a player in or out, when the return value is unknown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizell Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 still waiting for yours Wow. Are you always this nice when you get a compliment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 The point to all of this remains that while QB is the most important position in football, giving up boatloads of picks for Cutler is ridiculous. No one on here has any clue what the Bills would have to give up to acquire this guy, and therefore any debate about getting him is non-sensical. I don't think he's a guarantee to win that many more games than Edwards. But I guarantee you the price over Edwards will be high. But people come out of the woodwork to say it has to happen. Building an entire team for now and the future would drastically be affected by giving up draft picks. And who's to say Cutler wouldn't want a huge contract right away? Probably something in the 5-6 year range for 13M+ per. The deal loses luster considering the financial price and amount of resources it'd take to get him. And BTW, Denver has Ryan Clady, so Peters is not a commodity for them. When you look at the on-field product alone here, sure it looks nice and shiny to trade for JC. Peel back a few layers, and it's not all that great. It depends. Cutler for Edwards straight up, or Cutler for Edwards and a late pick, i would take those trades in a heartbeat. Cutler for Edwards and a 1st...ehhh, not so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 OMG, I must have missed this in my first reply...LMAO, you are out of your mind! Clutch when we needed him? In the 4th qtr of the Mia game he had a passer rating of 35, a lost fumble, and an INT...oh yeah, always clutch! You are losing it Magox... Divisional Games: We lost them all as you know...cant make the playoffs if you cant win in your division Mia: 67.2 QB rating, 0 TD, 1 INT, 2 fumbles, 1 lost, 227 yards (both turnovers in 4th qtr) Mia: DNP NE: 49.2 QB rating, 1 TD, 2 INT's, a measly 120 yards passing NE: 70.1 QB rating, 0 TD, 0 INT, 1 fumble lost, a whopping 128 yards passing Jets: 79.3 QB rating, 1 TD, 2 INT's, 1 Fumble lost, 289 yards passing Jets: DNP In 6 divisional games (the games we need him bad) he played in 4...in those 4 he totaled: 4 games, 2 TD's, 8 turnovers, 764 yards passing (191 per game, including 2 games UNDER 130) Oh, he is sooooo clutch...man you are off your rocker with this Trent stuff...in all honesty, and I am dont mean this to be as an ass, but that comment above that you wrote is the craziest thing I have ever seen you post... This doesnt even include the must win game on Monday night in Cle where he went for 148 yards, 1 TD, and 3 INT's... Do you think you might want to rethink that statement? Be honest... This is all water under the bridge. At this point, it's all about projection, not past results. Of course, making projections depends to an extent on past results, but you also have to look at tendencies that'll either move a player to the next level or make him stagnate at his current level. Admittedly, I'm an Edwards fan, but I really do think that he's got a lot of upside. Cutler? He certainly has talent, but there are tendencies of his that really, really worry me -- the attitude and brain of Jake Plummer combined with the big arm of Drew Bledsoe. Bledsoe and Plummer each had a couple/few good seasons, but they very clearly plateaued at a certain level. When I look at Edwards, I see someone who stands between Brady and Pennington in terms of how they play the game (I'm not talking about past production, obviously), and it's probably worth mentioning that Chad Pennington had one of his best seasons in 08 playing for a team that went 1-15 the year before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 It isn't happening. I like Cutler, he is tough and this team lacks toughness. http://tinyurl.com/cqlqod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 He is so tough he is whining like a little girl (sorry little girls). Don't need a QB with such a thin skin. Boo hoo for Cutler. He needs to grow up. Has a strong arm but so did Jeff George. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12Kachy Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 The bills would never part ways with Trent. No matter what, the Bills will hold onto Edwards as the starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12Kachy Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 The bills would never part ways with Trent. No matter what, the Bills will hold onto Edwards as the starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 Your right, it doesn't make a career. and PushthePile, your right to, Trent had some bad games where he looked at times to lack confidence. In my view, I wouldn't want to trade for Cutler, considering what Trent has shown in his first full year with limited talent, his maturity that he has shown, and what we would have to give up to get him. Now that Trent is entering his second full year, with more weapons, and more experience, I think next year will be a more accurate way to determine if He is our future qb. agreed? What is the BS CRAP about "first full year" you KEEP SPOUTING about Trent? After starting his ENTIRE 2nd year (when healthy) as well as a NUMBER of games his rookie year, why can you not just say "in his 2nd year"? The ONLY full year starting JP had (with MORE LIMITED talent I might add) was 06, yet I WELL REMEMBER his HATERS telling us all HE HAD more than enough CHANCE to prove himself. The HATERS were saying this in 06 & 07. If Trent does not produce in 2010 I DO NOT WANT TO HEAR "It was ONLY his 2nd FULL year starting" he will have started MORE GAMES than JP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebug Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 What is the BS CRAP about "first full year" you KEEP SPOUTING about Trent? After starting his ENTIRE 2nd year (when healthy) as well as a NUMBER of games his rookie year, why can you not just say "in his 2nd year"? The ONLY full year starting JP had (with MORE LIMITED talent I might add) was 06, yet I WELL REMEMBER his HATERS telling us all HE HAD more than enough CHANCE to prove himself. The HATERS were saying this in 06 & 07. If Trent does not produce in 2010 I DO NOT WANT TO HEAR "It was ONLY his 2nd FULL year starting" he will have started MORE GAMES than JP. Wah, Wah, Wah. Just can't let it go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 Wah, Wah, Wah. Just can't let it go. Can't let go of what? The VENOM you HATERS spouted about JP, or the FACT that when anyone has a LEGITIMATE criticism of Trent they are rebuffed with "fan boy" or have to listen to BS like he is "ONLY A ROOKIE" in Trents 2nd year or "FIRST FULL YEAR STARTING" in Trents 3rd YEAR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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