Bust or Breakout: Can Keon Coleman make an "Eric Moulds" style great leap forward

[DapperCam]

5 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

players don’t usually get drafted in the 1st round unless they have raw talent. i’m not sure people understand when i say RAW talent. Talent that hasn’t been put together and harnessed. That’s Keon. There’s more that goes into athletics than 40 times 

Keon wasn’t drafted in the 1st round, and he was over drafted. Who knows where he goes if we don’t take him.

[Rousseauisnoschmo]

3 hours ago, Dr. Who said:

I am not giving up, either. I don't much like the odds, but it could still work out.

Exactly.

[Rousseauisnoschmo]

6 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

What? Just saying, if you think there’s “hindsight” to most of these thoughts, use the search function. You can go back a long time and find lots, and lots, and lots of posts on the topic from MANY posters. No one is looking back with hindsight like, “I’m really surprised this Keon Coleman thing hasn’t gone well.” 🤣🤣

Yea. Not really just saying. At least own your own post. Arrogant. Condescending. I know. You don't. Typical of some here.

[Comebackkid]

Seems like last year before the injury that Keon was getting some seperation...he put some dudes in a blender at times

 

saying moulds was huge...really moulds was 6'2 210  and keon is 6'3 215.    and ripped as well.

 

plus moulds was in a system designed to throw the ball down the field very effectively,   

no one in our system is eating right now and when they do its usually short yardage.

 

i think keons production is half keon and half play calling.   he does have his strenghts on the field.

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

1 hour ago, DapperCam said:

Keon wasn’t drafted in the 1st round, and he was over drafted. Who knows where he goes if we don’t take him.

1st pick of the 2nd round. my bad, smart guy. 

[Kirby Jackson]

10 hours ago, Rousseauisnoschmo said:

Yea. Not really just saying. At least own your own post. Arrogant. Condescending. I know. You don't. Typical of some here.

I’m struggling with why this is still a topic. It felt like we put this to bed a few months ago. Now, we want to revisit if he’s similar to one of the best WRs that the Bills have ever had?? What are we doing here?

 

FWIW, the majority of the Keon blame goes to Beane. Keon is the same player that he was. He has to own some for not getting any better but 80% of it falls to Beane for the idea of Keon. That was not a viable succession plan to Diggs and Gabe. He doubled down this year by pumping him up and avoiding WR in the draft. He added a quality role player in Palmer to replace a role player in Mack. He just had to have a better plan to address the boundary. Instead, he went on the radio talking trash to the morning guys about how right he was. Here we sit, with the exact same flaw that we could all see for 2 years.

Edited 52 minutes ago by Kirby Jackson

[hondo in seattle]

If the binary choice is whether Keon is a bust or the next Eric Moulds, sadly I vote bust.  

 

Moulds HOF-type talent was wasted during the drought.  It would have been great to see what we would have done if Moulds (at his peak) was paired with Andre Reed during SB runs of the 90s.  What a duo that would have been!

 

I hope Keon gets better but he'll never come close to Moulds's level.  

[BillsFanForever19]

8 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I think people are missing the point - the OP wasn't comparing him as a player or even peak as Moulds, he simply used Moulds as an example of someone who started slow and then broke out.  There is all this focus on discussion comparing the two, but that wasn't the point.  

 

And I think *this* is missing the point of what a lot of people are making.

 

Moulds was a 4.5 40 guy at the Combine who was deceptively fast. He was built like a Greek God and had a WR frame while Coleman's body is more like a Basketball player. He was physically dominant against Corners - both at the line and at the point of attack.

 

The reason people make the comparisons are to show that Moulds' issues were things that could be overcome because he was physically gifted and very athletic. He just needed to lock in mentally and get past the yips of drops. 

 

Coleman's main issues aren't fixable things. He'll always be a 4.61 guy who somehow plays even slower than that. He could put on muscle, but he'll still have a lanky frame and that mass would just result in him being even slower. He is physically limited.

 

And that's the point of the comparison. Saying Moulds overcame a slow start so Coleman could too is like saying Josh Allen overcame his issues so Will Levis could too. There's physical gifts that Moulds had that made that possible that Coleman simply doesn't.

Edited 8 hours ago by BillsFanForever19

[BillsFanForever19]

2 hours ago, DapperCam said:

Keon wasn’t drafted in the 1st round, and he was over drafted. Who knows where he goes if we don’t take him.

 

I wasn't high on Coleman going into the Draft and I'm not high on him now.

 

But this idea that Coleman was over drafted and would have free falled if we didn't take him is overblown and inaccurate.

 

He went exactly in the area he was expected to go. Had we not taken him, the Patriots would have selected him 4 picks later - if no one jumped ahead of them.

 

In that spot, they Drafted Ja'Lynn Polk who was *truly* overdrafted. He was expected to be a 3rd to 4th Round selection. They reached for Polk there bc he was the next best Outside WR (who didn't have red flags) on the board and bc they missed out on Coleman (who they were high on).

Edited 9 hours ago by BillsFanForever19

[Alphadawg7]

8 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

And I think *this* is missing the point of what a lot of people are making.

 

Moulds was a 4.5 40 guy at the Combine who was deceptively fast. He was built like a Greek God and had a WR frame while Coleman's body is more like a Basketball player. He was physically dominant against Corners - both at the line and at the point of attack.

 

The reason people make the comparisons are to show that Moulds' issues were things that could be overcome because he was physically gifted and very athletic. He just needed to lock in mentally and get past the yips of drops. 

 

Coleman's main issues aren't fixable things. He'll always be a 4.61 guy who somehow plays even slower than that. He could put on muscle, but he'll still have a lanky frame and that mass would just result in him being even slower. He is physically limited.

 

And that's the point of the comparison. Saying Moulds overcame a slow start so Coleman could too is like saying Josh Allen overcame his issues so Will Levis could too. There's physical gifts that Moulds had that made that possible that Coleman simply doesn't.

Keon ran a 4.53 at his pro day, other WRs with similar speed have gone on to have great to even elite careers, and Will Levis is a weird example as obviously he could break out too - like guys such as Baker, Darnold, Geno, Gannon, Young, etc did after slow starts, changing teams, etc.  

 

But none of that matters, he was never comparing the two, he was just talking about breaking out after a slow start.  
 

And yes it’s still possible, but I do have concerns of he can here in this offense based on the reasons I already stated.

[folz]

My question is what does Steve Smith have against Keon Coleman? Is it personal?

 

He trashed him before the draft. After week 8 last year (of his rookie season), he put out a similar "hit piece" video to the recent one calling Keon a bust (just 8 weeks into his career). After the Baltimore game week 1 this year, he made sure to put out a quote to tell everyone to "pump the brakes on the Keon Coleman hype train" (because Keon had a good game), and then this most recent video trashing Keon.

 

I mean, I know this is the era of podcasts and everyone has an opinion, but, I have a hard time thinking of another former NFL receiver trashing a young receiver so much and calling him a bust after the first 8 games of his career. I remember breaking down Smith's video last year (didn't even watch the recent one, no reason to), he was trying soooo hard to point out problems that he even talked trash on positive/good plays that Keon made. It seems unusual to me how aggressive he is in his stance. I mean Keon doesn't play for his former team or anything. Their colleges weren't rivals. They grew up in different states. Why does he care so much to continually trash him? If he sucks, he'll find his way out of the league. Why give him so much attention if you think he is trash? He wasn't a high draft pick that everyone is praising. He's a second round receiver trying to find his way. Why does Smith feel the need to go out of his way to tear Keon down?

 

 

All I'll say, in regards to the thread, is that I haven't given up on Keon.

 

 

15 hours ago, JESSEFEFFER said:

I don’t understand why so many Bills fans want to make a hobby out of crapping on our young players as they try to establish their careers.  Most of the featured whipping boys of the recent past have worked out eventually.  

 

Exactly. Back in the day, we understood that some players took longer (2-3 years) to develop. Not every guy is ready to break out as a stud week one of his rookie year.

 

Terrell Bernard, Spencer Brown, Connor McGovern, Khalil Shakir, Dalton Kincaid, Cole Bishop

 

Now it's Keon Coleman, DeWayne Carter, TJ Sanders, Landon Jackson, 

 

Do they all work out? No. But have a bit of patience either way, because some of them will.

 

Edited 59 minutes ago by folz