Is Aron Schobel a mediocre player?

[Fake-Fat Sunny]

No.

 

There are a couple of posts below on the issue of resigning Clements which make the point in a comparison that was not the central topic of the thread that Schobel is a "mediocre" NFL player.

 

Since this claim was not the centrak topic of the thread and quite frankly is unsubstantiated by any logical evaluation I thought it was worth posting as a separate thread.

 

Look, I know folks were disappointed in Schobel's sack production after hwe signed a big contract and rightly so in terms of the lowering of his sack production, but to jump to the conclusion that he is somehow a mediocre player (a worse than average NFL player) simply is unsupported as a football opinion.

 

Consider this:

 

1. Schobel was the DE on one of the second ranked statistically D team in the league. Do you really think they achieved this lofty position and result even though they got "mediocre" play from their RDE?

 

2. If memory serves me correctly the team led the league in sacks and Scgibek easily led this team in sacks (8 to second place 5 for Adams). His personal totals disappointing for fans yes, but mediocre no.

 

3. A big part of his low sack total strikes me as the flexibility the athletic Schobel offered the Bills which allowed him to do the short zone pass coverage credibly in the run blitz so others could rush effectively.

 

4. Schobel's big problem as he developed was his being weak at the point of attack on runs and sometimes taking bad tackling angles (particularly as a rookie) however, by using him well in the run-blitz this both plays to Schobel's strengths and away from his weaknesses. he struck me as more effective and better used in 2004 than in previous years.

 

5. For me the really big deal about the job Schobel did last year was that his play and that of Kelsay and Denney allowed the Bills to carry only 3 DEs when the import of this position and the rotation the Bills use on the DL really dictated that they keep 4 DEs. Thw great play and athleticism of all three DEs led by Schobel (who strikes me as a better player than either Kelsay or Denney) allowed the Bills to devote a valuable roster spot to keeping a designated long snapper and even shop for a long snapper after Dorenbos was injured. Their play gave us the flexiibility to activate rather than lose Jason peters because we had an extra roster spot.

 

Th notion that Schobel for some reason should be judged mediocre has nothing to do with a good football judgment in my mind. By no means is he perfect and their can be great improvements in his play, but the notion that the 4th leading tackler on the #2 D in the league is a mediocre player is nothing short of laughable.

[Chilly]

Aron Schobel sucks.

 

Aaron rocks tho.

[MrLocke]

I think Aaron is a steady defensive end. Not in the same class as say Strahan or Simeon Rice or Freeney or Julius Peppers, but I think he is probably in the next class below. one of the things that maybe holding him back is the end opposite to him. Now I know Kelsay is solid but I do not think Schobel is in the same kind of situation as John Abraham and Shaun Ellis where both of these guys have a terrific end opposite them. I would love to see Kelsay step up his game next year and get into the 8-10 sack range because if he does this team will have a pair of terrific ends.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

We didn't lead the league in sacks but where tied for 3rd with 45

 

atl- 48

phil- 47

tampa/buf/ne/ind-45

 

 

two of these teams are not like the others.

 

Atl- patrick kearny and sack master dt rod coleman Phil- Jevon Kearse tampa- simeon rice ind- dwight freeney

 

 

Those 4 teams have what many consider "elite status" de's, While Ne/Buffalo rely mostly on the run blitz and zone blitz to get pressure on and sack the quaterback.

 

 

Schobel is a good player, he's steady and definitly not a hole in our defense. Is he elite? hardly. It all depends what you're looking to get out of your defensive end.

 

If you're looking for 10-15 sacks a season, than aaron schobel isn't that guy. If you're looking for a de who will give you a solid 8 sack season, who is quick enough to drop back into coverage, and pressure the qb and lead to errant throws than schobel fits that bill.

 

Schobel is a highly underrated player, No he's not julius peppers, but he's good enough for what's asked of him. It still would be nice to have a pure pass rusher on this defense.

[34-78-83]

We didn't lead the league in sacks but where tied for 3rd with 45

 

atl- 48

phil- 47

tampa/buf/ne/ind-45

two of these teams are not like the others. 

 

Atl- patrick kearny and sack master dt rod coleman  Phil- Jevon Kearse  tampa- simeon rice  ind- dwight freeney

Those 4 teams have what many consider "elite status" de's, While Ne/Buffalo rely mostly on the run blitz and zone blitz to get pressure on and sack the quaterback.

Schobel is a good player, he's steady and definitly not a hole in our defense.  Is he elite? hardly.  It all depends what you're looking to get out of your defensive end.

 

If you're looking for 10-15 sacks a season, than aaron schobel isn't that guy.  If you're looking for a de who will give you a solid 8 sack season, who is quick enough to drop back into coverage, and  pressure the qb  and lead to errant throws than schobel fits that bill. 

 

Schobel is a highly underrated player,  No he's not julius peppers, but he's good enough for what's asked of him.  It still would be nice to have  a pure pass rusher on this defense.

369391[/snapback]

 

 

That's a fair description in my opinion.

[RJsackedagain]

I didn't know they had a Schobel brother named Aron .... who does he play for??

[MrLocke]

I didn't know they had a Schobel brother named Aron .... who does he play for??

369409[/snapback]

 

Maybe he is a couson like Bo. There is Aaron ofcourse Matt the TE for the Bengals and Bo Matt and Aaron's cousin a defensive end for the Titans.

[Bill from NYC]

No. He is a talented DE, a somewhat rare species these days.

While he is not a Julius Peppers genetic mutant, I think that many of us take his blazing speed for granted.

Yesterday, I stated that he lost approx. 10 million over the life of his contract by signing a year before he was to be a UFA. Most seemed to think that number was a tad high, which I will concede, but Grant Winstrom signed for much more money than AS as I somewhat vaguely recall. How much better is he than AS?

He also played well vs. Ogden and Pace in 04, not a small task.

In summary, I don't compare him to Bruce, Reggie, nor Richard Dent, but he was a great draft pick; is a very good player, and an even better signing (the extension) by TD.

[OBXBILLSFAN]

Schobel is a good, solid pass rushing DE. He is not an All Pro, but a good player on a very good defensive team.

[Coach Tuesday]

I think the Bills' scheme has to be considered too - I get the sense that the ends aren't asked to rush upfield as much, but that they instead often are sent in a "contain rush" whereby pressure is brought from other places (blitzing LBs, Milloy, corners, etc). What I like about Schobel is his willingness to stop the run, and IMO he has significantly improved that element of his game. Although obviously he doesn't have the athleticism of the "elite" passrushers like Freeney or Peppers, he is undoubtedly a playmaker.

 

Another thing I like about Schobel is his contract - I feel as though we got perfect value in this instance. We have him wrapped up for the duration of his Productive Years, at a very reasonable price. I'd love to do the same with Clements, but it will be much tougher.

[rockpile]

I think Schobel is a very good DE; not everyone is going to be a Reggie or Bruuuuce!

 

His biggest weakness is when he rushes the QB on an outside arc. This works if you are playing a QB who takes a 7 step drop and becomes a statue, allowing him to use his great speed to outrun the containment. It does not work if the QB can step back up into a pocket, giving the OL or FB time to just keep him outside.

 

If he could learn Bruce's inside spin move, he could be all pro.

[BuffOrange]

He's a good pass-rusher when we have a 31-10 lead on the Rams in the 4th Qtr.

If we're tied with NE in the last 3 minutes, I have zero confidence in him getting anywhere near Tom Brady.

 

He is the best DE on the team. If you made a list of the best DE for each of the 32 teams though - he's not going to be in the top 10. If that's not mediocre, then it's something between 'mediocre' and 'good'.

[OnTheRocks]

i would say he is a "nice" player. very much like Phil Hansen. Nothing more. Nothing less.

[LabattBlue]

Schobel is an okay player who was in the right place at the right time and got himself a nice contract. As stated earlier, one of the biggest flaws in his game is taking too much of an outside charge which takes him out of the play on both rushes and passes far too often. He is young enough to improve and become a better player. Let's see if the contract has made him complacent or does he have the desire to get better.

[RJsackedagain]

i would say he is a "nice" player.  very much like Phil Hansen.  Nothing more.  Nothing less.

369548[/snapback]

Great, a nice player is all fine and dandy, but the Bills need a bad @ss mother hucker on that d-line to make opposing team's QBs his B word. They haven't had one of those since that got who got his shoes sniffed by Dennis Hooper

[OnTheRocks]

Let's see if the contract has made him complacent or does he have the desire to get better.

369631[/snapback]

 

 

the one thing i learned last year by watching practices during training camp is that Jerry Gray and Tim Krumrie are so intense, i can't see them letting anyone on thier side of the ball become "complacent".

[ganesh]

He's a good pass-rusher when we have a 31-10 lead on the Rams in the 4th Qtr. 

If we're tied with NE in the last 3 minutes, I have zero confidence in him getting anywhere near Tom Brady. 

 

He is the best DE on the team.  If you made a list of the best DE for each of the 32 teams though - he's not going to be in the top 10.  If that's not mediocre, then it's something between 'mediocre' and 'good'.

369515[/snapback]

I would call someone mediocre if they are in the lower 25% of the DEs in

the league...whcih means he has be the 24th best DE in the league....

 

I think he is more in the 10-15 range....which i would call good but not great.

[ganesh]

i would say he is a "nice" player.  very much like Phil Hansen.  Nothing more.  Nothing less.

369548[/snapback]

 

Hansen I think was overrated...He had Bruce Smith on the other side to

take the double teams off....Schoebel is better than Hansen....Hansen struggled

the year Bruce Smith left the bills.

[Rubes]

2. If memory serves me correctly the team led the league in sacks and Scgibek easily led this team in sacks (8 to second place 5 for Adams).  His personal totals disappointing for fans yes, but mediocre no.

369377[/snapback]

 

Who the hell is Scgibek?

[AKC]

I like his talent but was disappointed in 2004 to see him revert back to his reliance on favoring the outside move. He was making good progress on his inside move exiting the '03 season but he seemed to lose confidence in it between seasons and took too many of those looping sprints around the OT. Some of that is by design but I'd like to see Krumrie get him back on track to become less predictable by taking an inside move with more frequency.