NIL deals keeping more players in college now and diluting the draft talent pool?

[Buffalo_Stampede]

16 minutes ago, Sweats said:

 

 

 

Saban knew the jig was up and he could no longer compete for blue chippers, when the NIL and transfer portal came into effect. He no longer held the "market share" and thus, turned Bama into just another college program like everyone else who had to claw and scratch and promote for players across the country. He no longer held the upper hand on other schools, he knew it and he retired.

That, and he’s 73.

[boyst]

4 minutes ago, SoTier said:

Here's an article to better understand NIL:  NIL

 

 

 

The average length of NFL careers is about 3 years, so the percentage of players from every draft class who actually succeed, much less become long-term starters who make significant money, is tiny.   Many draftees will never make nearly as much in the NFL as they do from capitalizing on NIL while collegians.  This might not be true of first round picks or even most Day 2 picks, but certainly for kids drafted on Day 3.   A lot of Day 3 picks are proverbial "big fish in a small pond" types who aren't going to even make NFL practice squads.

 

 

NIL is about the NCAA allowing collegiate athletes the right to earn money off of their images, names or other likenesses, which the NCAA didn't allow until a 2021 court case.   Colleges still cannot pay collegiate athletes for playing sports.   NIL is about individual athletes profiting from their collegiate -- and in some cases, high school -- fame.

Exactly. It is about the individual. Not the sport. Sports will die. Wrestling, track, many men's sports have been destroyed already (title ix bull####).

 

The individual will prosper if he can be a solid superstar. But the poor kid who is just good enough to get out of the slums to get a half ride playing 3rd TE on FAU, or the kid who busted his ass for grades and sports to be 7th man on the bench at Memphis... They're not going to make money but I sure as ***** know they appreciate the education and scholarships.

 

I think, beyond these athletes being taxed appropriately, they need to surrender their scholarship for collecting nil.

[SoTier]

11 hours ago, boyst said:

Education, free meals, free living, tutors and aid to learn, clothes, health management, connections in business/life through boosters and such. And there is still the illegal ***** they got

 

You have obviously not had any experience with a big time collegiate sports program like football or basketball.  I worked as a tutor for a large Midwestern university's football players for a single semester in the 1970s.  This school was always in contention for the National Championship.  Even though I was a starving grad assistant and the money was very good, I couldn't continue participating in a system which I saw as extremely exploitive.   Most of these young men never sniffed the NFL, never got their college degrees, and certainly never made "connections in business/life through boosters".   When they used up their eligibility and/or were seriously injured, they were literally kicked to the curb.

 

The NCCA programs are much better now, but accepting a college athletic scholarship to a major Div 1 program is not nearly the ticket to a better life that many people believe except for those few collegiate athlete who become stars. 

[Bill from NYC]

I think that some of this depends on the school.

 

For instance, Alabama has at least 3 outside linebackers that are VERY good players but have not yet cracked the starting lineup. It would have probably been a mistake for them to declare before they had a chance to fully demonstrate their skills. 

 

In terms of watching college football. one of my favorite aspects of it is watching kids develop into great players. Maybe we will see more of this with NIL but I don't know.

 

[SoonerBillsFan]

14 minutes ago, Ya Digg? said:

 

I don’t know, for me I think these opinions are a bit extreme. Football in particular is weird-the player is always the enemy. Fans root for teams or schools, they never root for players. Think about it just in the Bills who are the enemies? Von and Stef because they got paid and Gabe because he is about to get paid. Most people don’t care about the players at all once they have served their purpose. 
 

it’s the same thing with college football-Nick Saban left because he lost his stranglehold on college football. He could see the playing field was being leveled and he got out (I think the college portal had a big reason for that as well). 
 

Pro football and college football seem to be the only places where people continually root for the giant billionaire owners  and mega billion dollar schools and fight against the people who are making those people all of their money 

I get it, players come and go, I am a Sooners and Bills fan. If Diggs is here great, Ill root for him. If not, I root for whoever replaces him. At least at college, you had some semblance of 3-year stability.

NIL needs some universal rules, but I believe the courts just ruled against any significant rules, which just made it Pay for play or Free agency at the College level

[boyst]

32 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

You have obviously not had any experience with a big time collegiate sports program like football or basketball.  I worked as a tutor for a large Midwestern university's football players for a single semester in the 1970s.  This school was always in contention for the National Championship.  Even though I was a starving grad assistant and the money was very good, I couldn't continue participating in a system which I saw as extremely exploitive.   Most of these young men never sniffed the NFL, never got their college degrees, and certainly never made "connections in business/life through boosters".   When they used up their eligibility and/or were seriously injured, they were literally kicked to the curb.

 

The NCCA programs are much better now, but accepting a college athletic scholarship to a major Div 1 program is not nearly the ticket to a better life that many people believe except for those few collegiate athlete who become stars. 

your assumption is grossly wrong 🤪. and taking about 50 years ago as experience is grossly different than just 15-20 years ago.

 

i played in a division 1 sport at a MAC school in the early 00's briefly (about 4 months). I was burned out and quit having been playing athletic competitive sports since 8 or 9 years old. i participated with 3 world class athletes on my team and associated with at least 3 future nfl players i can think of on the top of my head.

 

Your personal views and my personal views were much different and we will have to agree to disagree.

Edited February 29 by boyst

[SoTier]

13 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I get it, players come and go, I am a Sooners and Bills fan. If Diggs is here great, Ill root for him. If not, I root for whoever replaces him. At least at college, you had some semblance of 3-year stability.

NIL needs some universal rules, but I believe the courts just ruled against any significant rules, which just made it Pay for play or Free agency at the College level

 

This is not what NIL involves.   NIL allows to individuals to profit, if they can, from the sale of their names, images, and likenesses.  It's independent of the college, and the NCAA, up until 2021, prohibited this. 

 

The NCAA still prohibits colleges from paying athletes for playing sports, which would certainly benefit the most popular sports and the biggest schools in those sports to the detriment of less popular sports and smaller programs.   I think that the NCAA's transfer portal is what encourages "free agency at the college level" but that is definitely NOT NIL

 

 

[boyst]

33 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

I think that some of this depends on the school.

 

For instance, Alabama has at least 3 outside linebackers that are VERY good players but have not yet cracked the starting lineup. It would have probably been a mistake for them to declare before they had a chance to fully demonstrate their skills. 

 

In terms of watching college football. one of my favorite aspects of it is watching kids develop into great players. Maybe we will see more of this with NIL but I don't know.

 

those backup LB's may not be getting NIL deals now or anything specific. however, just 10-20 years ago they would be getting rental cars in someone elses name if they were at all decent or had a chance to impact the program in a year or two. they would be getting perks at local restaurants, bars, movie theatres, etc.

 

i know 1 player of a division 1 school that got a new rental car every two weeks or so provided by a booster. he went to almost all of his classes and was a top academic performer. this athlete was responsible for taking recruits on tours, which also gave him access to money set aside for them - his meal card always was overflowing. the guy was a backup most of his career and never went pro. by his guess he was able to pull in $20k a year from these perks.

[Mark80]

Nope, it's not like they never enter the draft and stay in college for their entire careers.  The talent pool is just delayed, but they will still enter it eventually.  In fact, the talent pool may increase as they will be older, stronger, faster, etc.

Edited February 29 by Mark80

[Freddie's Dead]

NIL was long overdue.  If it keeps kids in college, good for them.  Easier to have a degree in hand then have to go back for it.

 

Like Curt Flood, Ed O'Bannon will not profit from his legal victory.  But college athletes can no longer be exploited for billions by colleges and the NCAA.  At least now they can get a piece of that pie.

[Bill from NYC]

7 minutes ago, boyst said:

those backup LB's may not be getting NIL deals now or anything specific. however, just 10-20 years ago they would be getting rental cars in someone elses name if they were at all decent or had a chance to impact the program in a year or two. they would be getting perks at local restaurants, bars, movie theatres, etc.

 

i know 1 player of a division 1 school that got a new rental car every two weeks or so provided by a booster. he went to almost all of his classes and was a top academic performer. this athlete was responsible for taking recruits on tours, which also gave him access to money set aside for them - his meal card always was overflowing. the guy was a backup most of his career and never went pro. by his guess he was able to pull in $20k a year from these perks.

I am almost certain that they are getting paid. The starters that they will be replacing are both going to be early draft picks. One (Dallas turner) might even be in the top 10. 

As I implied above, I doubt that this is the situation at most schools.

[Sweats]

53 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

That, and he’s 73.

 

 

Saban doesn't seem the type to retire the way he did, even at 73.

He seems to me to be the type of guy to win one more Natty and then hang his hat. I think he knew he would never win another CFP with the NIL and transfer portal in effect and decided it was time to walk away.

 

That is solely my feelings on it, however, i don't think i'm very much wrong on it.

[boyst]

4 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

I am almost certain that they are getting paid. The starters that they will be replacing are both going to be early draft picks. One (Dallas turner) might even be in the top 10. 

As I implied above, I doubt that this is the situation at most schools.

Small school boosters support more than you realize. Maybe not as much money or to as many players but I've known of few small school dudes who got some nice kickbacks. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

57 minutes ago, Sweats said:

 

 

Saban doesn't seem the type to retire the way he did, even at 73.

He seems to me to be the type of guy to win one more Natty and then hang his hat. I think he knew he would never win another CFP with the NIL and transfer portal in effect and decided it was time to walk away.

 

That is solely my feelings on it, however, i don't think i'm very much wrong on it.

Typically when I see a college coach get out early they were probably doing something they shouldn’t have been doing. Also, Saban screaming the loudest against NIL always made me suspicious.

[Cheektowaga Chad]

Someone with more knowledge of NIL

 

What is stopping an NFL owner from "paying" college kids? Kind of like a recruiting tool when they get to the NFL 

[Ya Digg?]

6 minutes ago, Cheektowaga Chad said:

Someone with more knowledge of NIL

 

What is stopping an NFL owner from "paying" college kids? Kind of like a recruiting tool when they get to the NFL 

There's no guarantee that player will end up on his team.  For example why would Pegula pay Marvin Harrison?  No shot that guy ever plays in Buffalo

[Big Turk]

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

Here's an article to better understand NIL:  NIL

 

 

 

The average length of NFL careers is about 3 years, so the percentage of players from every draft class who actually succeed, much less become long-term starters who make significant money, is tiny.   Many draftees will never make nearly as much in the NFL as they do from capitalizing on NIL while collegians.  This might not be true of first round picks or even most Day 2 picks, but certainly for kids drafted on Day 3.   A lot of Day 3 picks are proverbial "big fish in a small pond" types who aren't going to even make NFL practice squads.

 

 

NIL is about the NCAA allowing collegiate athletes the right to earn money off of their images, names or other likenesses, which the NCAA didn't allow until a 2021 court case.   Colleges still cannot pay collegiate athletes for playing sports.   NIL is about individual athletes profiting from their collegiate -- and in some cases, high school -- fame.

 

BUT...the majority of underclassmen coming out are higher caliber talents than the ones that typically stay in, so the rate of them being selected earlier would be much higher.

11 minutes ago, Cheektowaga Chad said:

Someone with more knowledge of NIL

 

What is stopping an NFL owner from "paying" college kids? Kind of like a recruiting tool when they get to the NFL 

 

The rookie salary cap. Basically everybody knows what they are going to get paid at every position in the draft from signing bonus, to total contract value, to guaranteed money.  No negotiating on that...they can negotiate things like offset language, etc, but that's it. It's why you see almost no holdouts anymore of rookies because it's set in stone.  Only ones are fighting over offset language usually.

2 hours ago, boyst said:

Exactly. It is about the individual. Not the sport. Sports will die. Wrestling, track, many men's sports have been destroyed already (title ix bull####).

 

The individual will prosper if he can be a solid superstar. But the poor kid who is just good enough to get out of the slums to get a half ride playing 3rd TE on FAU, or the kid who busted his ass for grades and sports to be 7th man on the bench at Memphis... They're not going to make money but I sure as ***** know they appreciate the education and scholarships.

 

I think, beyond these athletes being taxed appropriately, they need to surrender their scholarship for collecting nil.

 

Mostly sports that nobody cares about.

Edited February 29 by Big Turk

[Big Turk]

1 hour ago, boyst said:

your assumption is grossly wrong 🤪. and taking about 50 years ago as experience is grossly different than just 15-20 years ago.

 

i played in a division 1 sport at a MAC school in the early 00's briefly (about 4 months). I was burned out and quit having been playing athletic competitive sports since 8 or 9 years old. i participated with 3 world class athletes on my team and associated with at least 3 future nfl players i can think of on the top of my head.

 

Your personal views and my personal views were much different and we will have to agree to disagree.

 

Yeah trying to compare the 70s to now might as well be comparing two different sports.

[boyst]

12 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

BUT...the majority of underclassmen coming out are higher caliber talents than the ones that typically stay in, so the rate of them being selected earlier would be much higher.

 

The rookie salary cap. Basically everybody knows what they are going to get paid at every position in the draft from signing bonus, to total contract value, to guaranteed money.  No negotiating on that...they can negotiate things like offset language, etc, but that's it. It's why you see almost no holdouts anymore of rookies because it's set in stone.  Only ones are fighting over offset language usually.

 

Mostly sports that nobody cares about.

nobody but the athletes and their familes who compete in the events

[Big Turk]

7 minutes ago, boyst said:

nobody but the athletes and their familes who compete in the events

 

That doesn't make money...people who aren't invested have to want to watch it regularly and in large numbers and pay a lot to do it.