Mark Vader Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: Of course military flyovers and national anthems are political. An anthem is a exaltation of national pride. That is about the most political statement there is. That's more cultural than political. If a flyover had signs that said, "Vote for this candidate", then it would be political. Would you consider the Army-Navy Game or any other sport amongst the military academies to be political statements? 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 The US has moved away from a melting pot to a mosaic. The cracks show when you look too close. We moved away from a common national theme, narrative. Hanging on to that theme has been politicized, especially by one side who wants to retain that patriotic narrative. 1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said: You must not have read my posts, I am not worried about a thing. I was just pointing out the antagonistic nature of Juronimos posts. There are things to be concerned with if you are a paid subscriber. Why no attach good faith and take them at their word and not make it political. I’m not a subscriber of that publication so I don’t care. For me NYT taking over will make me less likely to ever buy a subscription however. But my wife being a NYT subscriber might actually start to get into sports. Call it a wash. She was just asking me: "Who's Antonio Brown?" I said: "A silly labor struggle." 😆... It piqued her interest. Did I get too political? 😏 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 Also, what happened to just being prideful of your country, that never used to be political, it was just us being proud of what we had accomplished however blemished. The creep of ideology in one direction over time has made it a controversial thing to wave a flag, sing the national anthem, and be proud of your country lest you be called a Nazi. This does seem to be getting overtly political, to no one’s surprise. I’m not wanting to get in trouble, so if this needs to be moved or whatnot like a mod earlier said, then let’s do it. If you see fit of course. 1 minute ago, Mark Vader said: That's more cultural than political. If a flyover had signs that said, "Vote for this candidate", then it would be political. Would you consider the Army-Navy Game or any other sport amongst the military academies to be political statements? Agreed, but everything you do, every action you do, everything you say, these days is political. That’s the sad reality. Legacy of micro-agressions come home to roost. 3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 3 minutes ago, HamSandwhich said: You must not have read my posts, I am not worried about a thing. I was just pointing out the antagonistic nature of Juronimos posts. There are things to be concerned with if you are a paid subscriber. Why not attach good faith and take them at their word and not make it political. I’m not a subscriber of that publication so I don’t care. For me NYT taking over will make me less likely to ever buy a subscription however. There were those that are outwardly political about why they wouldn’t but there many that were not. He lumped them all together and acted like they were beneath him. What exactly then is the concern, if not politics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 2 minutes ago, HamSandwhich said: You must not have read my posts, I am not worried about a thing. I was just pointing out the antagonistic nature of Juronimos posts. There are things to be concerned with if you are a paid subscriber. Why not attach good faith and take them at their word and not make it political. I’m not a subscriber of that publication so I don’t care. For me NYT taking over will make me less likely to ever buy a subscription however. There were those that are outwardly political about why they wouldn’t but there many that were not. He lumped them all together and acted like they were beneath him. No, you lumped them together. My satire was 100% aimed at the people making it political who said the "evil" NYT was going inject all their "crap" into the Athletic. If you won't take my name out of your ham stuffed mouth then tag me in post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 Just now, GoBills808 said: What exactly then is the concern, if not politics? I was simply providing a good faith alternative to what Jauronimo saw as malice from posters on this board. That’s what we need more of but that in itself appears political. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted January 7, 2022 Author Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 minute ago, Mark Vader said: That's more cultural than political. If a flyover had signs that said, "Vote for this candidate", then it would be political. Would you consider the Army-Navy Game or any other sport amongst the military academies to be political statements? It is only cultural now because it is embedded. It started as political. And something doesn't have to be partisan to be political. Doesn't have to be about red or blue. It is about the causes that the league chooses to support and promote. As for the military academies? No. There is a reason why there is a load of military at those games. There isn't a reason for them to be at NFL games beyond the league making a political statement about its support for the military. There is absolutely no doubt that they are political statements. You don't see them as such because they fit your view of what football should be, but they are overtly political. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 minute ago, Jauronimo said: No, you lumped them together. My satire was 100% aimed at the people making it political who said the "evil" NYT was going inject all their "crap" into the Athletic. If you won't take my name out of your ham stuffed mouth then tag me in post. What is tag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted January 7, 2022 Author Share Posted January 7, 2022 2 minutes ago, HamSandwhich said: Lol it was? YES. Anthems are political statements by nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 4 minutes ago, Mark Vader said: That's more cultural than political. If a flyover had signs that said, "Vote for this candidate", then it would be political. Would you consider the Army-Navy Game or any other sport amongst the military academies to be political statements? I think it's pretty easy to argue that NFL military appreciation week is 'political' or politically affiliated. The league has no real reason to align themselves with the military, unlike the Army-Navy game which is played by actual military academies and personnel. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: The knife crime is an example of an uncontroversial political choice by a sports team. But it is still a political choice to take the opportunity of a nationally broadcast soccer game to back a prominent campaign. That is not partisan but it is political. The campaign has the support of both major political parties in the UK so it doesn't divide on party lines but it remains a small p political choice. But there were still military fly overs, right? Singing of the anthem? That is my point the stuff that grates on you is more prevalent in recent years the other stuff has always been there it is just stuff that doesn't bother you the same way. We all see it through our own prism. Bill, I think you’re one of the best posters on the board and there are many good ones here. I think many social issues are simply misidentified as political. I also think some people just don’t want to be burdened by social issues during what they perceive as an entertainment event. DJT inserting himself into the kneeling controversy…political. Kathy Hochul pimping for a Bills stadium in WNY…political. Lobbying by the NFL or NFLPA, tax status etc, political. Personally, I don’t see military flyovers, or military appreciation day as political. As for folks terminating a subscription to The Athletic because it’s owned by NYT, well, people vote with their checkbooks all day long. Sometimes those decisions are in conflict with other deeply held personal beliefs. People are complicated. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 Just now, GunnerBill said: It is only cultural now because it is embedded. It started as political. And something doesn't have to be partisan to be political. Doesn't have to be about red or blue. It is about the causes that the league chooses to support and promote. As for the military academies? No. There is a reason why there is a load of military at those games. There isn't a reason for them to be at NFL games beyond the league making a political statement about its support for the military. There is absolutely no doubt that they are political statements. You don't see them as such because they fit your view of what football should be, but they are overtly political. Ok, so we’ve gotten to the place I have stated we would, we will have to agree to disagree, but I suppose maybe you’ve achieved your end which was to maybe make me look like a racist or something? I don’t know, I won’t pretend to know what your motivations are. Agree to disagree, your explanations and others on here are not pursusive to me. They are simply window dressing and smoke and mirrors to my ears. 1 minute ago, GoBills808 said: I think it's pretty easy to argue that NFL military appreciation week is 'political' or politically affiliated. The league has no real reason to align themselves with the military, unlike the Army-Navy game which is played by actual military academies and personnel. Pride in our country? Is that not a good reason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 minute ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Bill, I think you’re one of the best posters on the board and there are many good ones here. I think many social issues are simply misidentified as political. I also think some people just don’t want to be burdened by social issues during what they perceive as an entertainment event. DJT inserting himself into the kneeling controversy…political. Kathy Hochul pimping for a Bills stadium in WNY…political. Lobbying by the NFL or NFLPA, tax status etc, political. Personally, I don’t see military flyovers, or military appreciation day as political. As for folks terminating a subscription to The Athletic because it’s owned by NYT, well, people vote with their checkbooks all day long. Sometimes those decisions are in conflict with other deeply held personal beliefs. People are complicated. Agreed on all counts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said: Pride in our country? Is that not a good reason? It would be if the military and our country were interchangeable. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 6 minutes ago, Jauronimo said: No, you lumped them together. My satire was 100% aimed at the people making it political who said the "evil" NYT was going inject all their "crap" into the Athletic. If you won't take my name out of your ham stuffed mouth then tag me in post. Be more clear who you’re directing it to then. You painted a broad brush. Just now, GoBills808 said: It would be if the military and our country were interchangeable. We wouldn’t have a country without our military. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said: We wouldn’t have a country without our military. Completely beside the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted January 7, 2022 Author Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said: Ok, so we’ve gotten to the place I have stated we would, we will have to agree to disagree, but I suppose maybe you’ve achieved your end which was to maybe make me look like a racist or something? I don’t know, I won’t pretend to know what your motivations are. Agree to disagree, your explanations and others on here are not pursusive to me. They are simply window dressing and smoke and mirrors to my ears. Pride in our country? Is that not a good reason? What? Where have I tried to make you look like a racist? I haven't claimed that singing an anthem is racist. It is, however, political. The whole concept of national pride is a political concept just as much as the concept of racial equality or gender equality or anything else. Just because something has been culturally embedded for longer doesn't stop it being political. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 2 minutes ago, HamSandwhich said: Be more clear who you’re directing it to then. You painted a broad brush. We wouldn’t have a country without our military. You mean: "We wouldn’t have a country without France 🇫🇷." 😆 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted January 7, 2022 Author Share Posted January 7, 2022 (edited) 7 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: Bill, I think you’re one of the best posters on the board and there are many good ones here. I think many social issues are simply misidentified as political. I also think some people just don’t want to be burdened by social issues during what they perceive as an entertainment event. DJT inserting himself into the kneeling controversy…political. Kathy Hochul pimping for a Bills stadium in WNY…political. Lobbying by the NFL or NFLPA, tax status etc, political. Personally, I don’t see military flyovers, or military appreciation day as political. As for folks terminating a subscription to The Athletic because it’s owned by NYT, well, people vote with their checkbooks all day long. Sometimes those decisions are in conflict with other deeply held personal beliefs. People are complicated. I am sorry but you are wrong. The reason you don't see military flyovers or salute to service as political is because it fits with your perception of conventional. It is only when things shake that perception that people see the politics. Edited January 7, 2022 by GunnerBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 9 minutes ago, HamSandwhich said: What is tag? Its using the @' symbol to notify a poster that you are referencing them. Example: Wow, @HamSandwhich has been talking ***** about me all day. Tagging a person notifies them so its no surprise when you open a new thread and see pages of disparaging comments about yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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