It looks like Bills Management thinks it is the RBs.

[DCofNC]

23 hours ago, OldTimer1960 said:

How many times did both RBs have to elude tacklers in the backfield?  Many times was my perception.  

 

The OL did not have a lot of continuity last year with Feliciano out for first half of season, Ford moving from T to G and then being injured, Williams taking over early from Ford and Morse missing time with injury as well.  That could have affected run blocking.

 

I agree, it would be great to have a super-fast back, but I don't think that would have changed many of the negative run plays last year as they would still have had to dodge defenders in the backfield.  Yes, maybe a bit quicker start with exceptional decisiveness might sneak through a few more small holes before they close, but I don't think Chris Johnson in his prime would have been very effective with the run blocking the BIlls had last year.  

Was it injuries/lack of continuity?  Was it scheme?  Was it the OL talent itself?  Was it the RBs?  I don't know, but I think both Bills backs can be decent NFL backs given some blocking.

 

I know where you are coming from on this, my disagreement comes in that a better back wouldn’t have stopped some negative plays.  A guy with size to shed a blocker at a stand still like Henry does (or even Josh Allen does for that matter) or a guy who has that crazy wiggle like Shady, Hill, etc can all be valuable in those situations, often turning negative yards to something slightly positive or just even.  That can be huge.  You can watch instances where Brady drops back and sees it coming, literally just falls down, Allen never does that (sometimes he should), and he USUALLY makes something of it, even if it’s just avoiding a 5-7 yard loss.  Shady used to be able to just flip his hips and the defender wound up on the ground, it was comical, other times he would do the dance and not go forward thing when there wasn’t a hole he liked, his weakness for sure.  So to my point, if you stuck a top 10 type back in the backfield, I think the negative plays would go away (look at Gore, nothing there, always got something), and the bigger plays could happen as the game drives on, Henry DOMINATES late in games and in situations where the rush is coming and breaking one or two tackles leads to giant runs.  Obviously, those guys are special, but the ones we have are not.

[NewEra]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Maybe the Chiefs will waive Damien Williams and then everyone here can get a Super Bowl champion quality RB.

 

Remember him.........4 years a turd in Miami.

 

I don't think much of Motor or Moss..........didn't like drafting either of them...........but backs good enough to win with are still a dime-a-dozen.

Yeah....I saw Williams break a 40 yard TD to win the game.  Maybe Moss or motor will do that too.  We need a back that can break the big one when the opposing D concentrates on the pass.  I don’t believe Singletary has that ability.  And his hands are questionable . Like I said, hopefully it’ll be more Moss than motor, because motor hasn’t shown us anything. 
 

I also saw the Bucs win the SB with 4th overall pick rb and 38th overall pick rb running receive 32 touches between them, both averaging over 5 ypc in the SB.  
 

Winning the SB can be done with or without great running backs.  The supporting cast matters.  Our supporting cast is terrible at run blocking and run game scheming.  With our limited RBs, not so good run blocking OL and bad run game scheme, it allows the D to not give a **** about our run game and take away the only thing we can do.  We need more from our run game and it looks as if the OL and OC will be the same.  Something needs to change if we want Moss or motor to be the next Damian Williams.

[KOKBILLS]

On 3/15/2021 at 12:47 PM, Albany,n.y. said:

Since the season ended the debate has been between those of us, myself included, who think the problem with the running game and the team's abandonment of it is because our RBs aren't very good and those who have blamed it on the O-line.  Well, so far based on the re-signing of Feliciano and Williams, it looks pretty obvious to me that Beane, who in his end of season PC indicated he wasn't pleased with the running game, doesn't think the O-line was the problem.  The starting 5 are basically locked in with the exception of LG, which will be either Ford or Boettger.  So IMO Beane knows our RBs suck and will be looking to upgrade at RB, not O-line, either in free agency or the draft.  

 

The lamest excuse I've seen for not upgrading the running back position is that Beane would have to admit he made a mistake drafting a RB in the 3rd round in each of the last 2 drafts.  Beane doesn't seem to be the type whose pride would cause him to keep the status quo at a position of need just because he drafted two 3rd round RBs.  If the Bills were so satisfied with Singletary & Moss as the top 2 RBs, they would have never tried to sign Bell in the middle of this past season.  

 

It is the RB's to a large extent...And the Bills do know it...They are just trying to be nice about it and not throw Singletary particularly under the bus because they like the kid...

 

But I have no doubt they want a feature back. And I also have no doubt they don't think either Moss or Singletary fit that role 100%...

 

They can get Javonte Williams in a slight trade down scenario from #30...IMHO that is a HUGE upgrade from Moss or Singletary...

[BADOLBILZ]

24 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Yeah....I saw Williams break a 40 yard TD to win the game.  Maybe Moss or motor will do that too.  We need a back that can break the big one when the opposing D concentrates on the pass.  I don’t believe Singletary has that ability.  And his hands are questionable . Like I said, hopefully it’ll be more Moss than motor, because motor hasn’t shown us anything. 
 

I also saw the Bucs win the SB with 4th overall pick rb and 38th overall pick rb running receive 32 touches between them, both averaging over 5 ypc in the SB.  
 

Winning the SB can be done with or without great running backs.  The supporting cast matters.  Our supporting cast is terrible at run blocking and run game scheming.  With our limited RBs, not so good run blocking OL and bad run game scheme, it allows the D to not give a **** about our run game and take away the only thing we can do.  We need more from our run game and it looks as if the OL and OC will be the same.  Something needs to change if we want Moss or motor to be the next Damian Williams.

 

 

 

Singletary had a 51 yard TD run this year.   

 

It's easy to cherry pick a small sample size or site a highlight we remember..........and sure Fournette had a nice run in the playoffs........but he ran for a woeful 3.8 ypc on the season and averages just a slightly less woeful 3.9 for his entire career.

 

I want to see them add some speed options in the backfield but they can literally do that late in the draft or in street free agency and find a dude who can average more than 3.8 ypc.

 

 

 

 

[NewEra]

5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

Singletary had a 51 yard TD run this year.   

 

It's easy to cherry pick a small sample size or site a highlight we remember..........and sure Fournette had a nice run in the playoffs........but he ran for a woeful 3.8 ypc on the season and averages just a slightly less woeful 3.9 for his entire career.

 

I want to see them add some speed options in the backfield but they can literally do that late in the draft or in street free agency and find a dude who can average more than 3.8 ypc.

 

 

 

 

Yeah....how many runs did he have against the chiefs when they played the entire game in dime?  How many catches?  2 catches 9 yards. 6 rushes 17 yards.

 

all I asked was if you thought we needed some speed and if we can win the SB with them.....which also comes with the same OL as last year and a (hopefully new) run scheme).  You replied that we could use some speed....and you also know that we won’t ever dress more than 2 RBs (STers not included), because McD has never done it in his 4 year career.  Without actually saying it.....you agree that Singletary and Moss aren’t enough, because we can use some speed and we don’t dress 3 RBs.  What good would that speed rb do for us sitting on the bench behind them?
 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

On 3/15/2021 at 9:54 AM, Mike in Horseheads said:

So people here think we have OJ Singletary and Thurman Moss on the roster.

Yes, there are alot of delusional Bills fans who like Singletary & Moss. Blah blah blah....its all the Oline's fault. We need a better RB. I don't care if they try to acquire Hunt or Carson. Or even draft Harris. We absolutely cannot allow teams to drop 7-8 in coverage like KC did.

[dave mcbride]

2 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

Singletary had a 51 yard TD run this year.   

 

It's easy to cherry pick a small sample size or site a highlight we remember..........and sure Fournette had a nice run in the playoffs........but he ran for a woeful 3.8 ypc on the season and averages just a slightly less woeful 3.9 for his entire career.

 

I want to see them add some speed options in the backfield but they can literally do that late in the draft or in street free agency and find a dude who can average more than 3.8 ypc.

 

 

 

 

And it came on a play with 1:40 left in a game that the Bills won 48-19!

[BADOLBILZ]

6 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

And it came on a play with 1:40 left in a game that the Bills won 48-19!

 

 

He had a 38 yarder the year before.........when did that happen?   And who cares?   He sucks.......every other teams free agent or trade bait RB is better and you can't win a SB without one that is THAT good..........even if the numbers say otherwise on both counts!

 

I want to add speed to the RB corps.   I'd like that guy to be able to catch the ball.   I also don't think it's something they should have to over-extend for.   That's what scouts and league minimum salaries are for.

[Da webster guy]

Singletary was awesome his rookie year.  Look at his ypc its elite.  His drop vs KC was a killer but he wasnt the reason we lost.  And even with Moss out he only got six carries, which was Daboll outthinking himself.

 

Go watch Moss highlights from this year, he was a rook with no real camp and zero preseason but he looks great all things considered.

 

Both our runners are good.  Beane isnt spending capital on a 3rd one with a nice prospect like Williams pushing for the 3rd spot.  

 

Aaaaaand just for fun go watch Christian Wade rugby highlights because they're awesome.

[dave mcbride]

3 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

He had a 38 yarder the year before.........when did that happen?   And who cares?   He sucks.......every other teams free agent or trade bait RB is better and you can't win a SB without one that is THAT good..........even if the numbers say otherwise on both counts!

 

I want to add speed to the RB corps.   I'd like that guy to be able to catch the ball.   I also don't think it's something they should have to over-extend for.   That's what scouts and league minimum salaries are for.

Um ... I think you may be missing my point. I am actually agreeing with you.

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

Um ... I think you may be missing my point. I am actually agreeing with you.

 

Ok I thought it was one of those cases where I was three responses into a discussion and the context was missed and you thought I was trying to sell Singletary more than just point out that we tend to see the grass as greener on the other side,  when in the case of these UFA and trade bait backs,  it really isn't.    They are available because they have been underwhelming where they are.

 

The funny thing is Damien Williams did get released.   He was on a cheap deal.   I wonder if some of these teams held a bit of a grudge against the opt outs.  There were so few(except in NE) that it wasn't a great look for those that did.

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Ok I thought it was one of those cases where I was three responses into a discussion and the context was missed and you thought I was trying to sell Singletary more than just point out that we tend to see the grass as greener on the other side,  when in the case of these UFA and trade bait backs,  it really isn't.    They are available because they have been underwhelming where they are.

 

The funny thing is Damien Williams did get released.   He was on a cheap deal.   I wonder if some of these teams held a bit of a grudge against the opt outs.  There were so few(except in NE) that it wasn't a great look for those that did.

Whenever I make reference to a garbage time td, I’m not talking a guy’s skills up. I know your position on him!

Edited March 16, 2021 by dave mcbride