SoCal Deek Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 3 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: I enjoy the dialog we have on many occasions, but you must realize the post you have above is ridiculous, right? You honestly can't believe this is Biden's virus, right? You can't honestly believe that 2.5 weeks is enough time to completely turn things around, right? You can't honestly believe that science isn't the ultimate way to defeat this thing, right? You can't honestly believe they aren't taking steps to get more vaccines out to folks, right? Looking to get more funding to do so, right? Assuming I'm correct on the above, what is the purpose of your post? I have to tell you it makes you look silly. Oldman....I’ve enjoyed the dialogue as well. The point is obvious. You can’t or shouldn’t pin deaths on the President no matter what party he’s associated with. This is a GLOBAL health problem. (I’m watching a soccer match being played in London in front of no fans while typing this.) But, there are so very many on here who used this medical challenge to score a political victory. Now, however, when “their” guy is in the power seat it doesn’t sound so nice....does it? And now they claim it’s silly? 1 1
oldmanfan Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 Just now, SoCal Deek said: Oldman....I’ve enjoyed the dialogue as well. The point is obvious. You can’t or shouldn’t pin deaths on the President no matter what party he’s associated with. This is a GLOBAL health problem. (I’m watching a soccer match being played in London in front of no fans while typing this.) But, there are so very many on here who used this medical challenge to score a political victory. Now, however, when “their” guy is in the power seat it doesn’t sound so nice....does it? And now they claim it’s silly? What the chief executive has is the responsibility for the response to the virus. And the previous holder of the office did a terrible job, starting with withholding from the public the severity of the pandemic, as was heard on his interview tapes with Bob Woodward. One of my favorite presidents was Truman. He probably made more crucial decisions for the country than most any other president not named Lincoln. And he famously had a sign on his desk saying The Buck Stops Here. And what did Trump say about the pandemic response? I take no responsibility. 2
SoCal Deek Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 1 minute ago, oldmanfan said: What the chief executive has is the responsibility for the response to the virus. And the previous holder of the office did a terrible job, starting with withholding from the public the severity of the pandemic, as was heard on his interview tapes with Bob Woodward. One of my favorite presidents was Truman. He probably made more crucial decisions for the country than most any other president not named Lincoln. And he famously had a sign on his desk saying The Buck Stops Here. And what did Trump say about the pandemic response? I take no responsibility. Yet the vaccine you got was developed under Trump, not Biden. You seem to fret about his public statements while behind the scenes he mobilized the private sector to provide supplies and a vaccine in record time. It all comes down to a style debate. Biden is focused on producing policies. Trump was more focused on producing the products. It’s an old debate that stems from those trained in the public sector vs those who come from the private sector. It doesn’t make EITHER of them evil or stupid.
Doc Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Yet the vaccine you got was developed under Trump, not Biden. You seem to fret about his public statements while behind the scenes he mobilized the private sector to provide supplies and a vaccine in record time. It all comes down to a style debate. Biden is focused on producing policies. Trump was more focused on producing the products. It’s an old debate that stems from those trained in the public sector vs those who come from the private sector. It doesn’t make EITHER of them evil or stupid. Yeah the vaccines were developed under Trump and their efficacy was known well before the election, yet they kept it hidden until a few days afterwards. It would have swayed the election. 1 1
TBBills Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 (edited) 1 minute ago, Doc said: Yeah the vaccines were developed under Trump and their efficacy was known well before the election, yet they kept it hidden until a few days afterwards. It would have swayed the election. Wrong The vaccines were developed despite Trumps lack of belief in the virus to begin with. The companies didn't even use help b.c he never offered it until the companies we're almost done with the vaccine b.c he just wanted to pretend like he had anything to do with it. Edited February 7, 2021 by TBBills
SoCal Deek Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 Just now, Doc said: Yeah the vaccines were developed under Trump and their efficacy was known well before the election, yet they kept it hidden until a few days afterwards. It would have swayed the election. That’s interesting. I recall Ms Harris telling the nation that she would never take a vaccine developed under Trump...no? If anything, the vaccine was slow rolled by the FDA to help Biden. You believe differently? 1
Doc Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 Just now, TBBills said: Wrong "Wrong" what? That the result of their efficacies were known before the election or that it wouldn't have swayed it? They're both true. 2 1
Doc Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: That’s interesting. I recall Ms Harris telling the nation that she would never take a vaccine developed under Trump...no? If anything, the vaccine was slow rolled by the FDA to help Biden. You believe differently? I don't know what the FDA's role was exactly, but I know the results of the clinical trials were slow-rolled. They didn't just magically get them a week afterwards. Had the news been released prior to the election, Trump would have won. And I'm sure Kammy knew the vaccines were working but wanted to create doubt in case the news was released prior to the election. But there she was, getting hers... 1 1
oldmanfan Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 28 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Yet the vaccine you got was developed under Trump, not Biden. You seem to fret about his public statements while behind the scenes he mobilized the private sector to provide supplies and a vaccine in record time. It all comes down to a style debate. Biden is focused on producing policies. Trump was more focused on producing the products. It’s an old debate that stems from those trained in the public sector vs those who come from the private sector. It doesn’t make EITHER of them evil or stupid. I agree Warp Speed was a good thing. It did not affect either Moderna nor Pfizer as they did not take federal dollars. Biden’s administration will be judged on how effective they are in getting people vaccinated. 1
Doc Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: I agree Warp Speed was a good thing. It did not affect either Moderna nor Pfizer as they did not take federal dollars. Biden’s administration will be judged on how effective they are in getting people vaccinated. Wrong. 1
TBBills Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 (edited) 1 minute ago, Doc said: Wrong. Actually what he said is 100% true and proven true. What you cannot prove is it's wrong. Edited February 7, 2021 by TBBills
Doc Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, TBBills said: Actually what he said is 100% true and proven true. What you cannot prove is it's wrong. "The United States government provided $1 billion in support for the design and testing of the Moderna vaccine."
TBBills Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 Just now, Doc said: "The United States government provided $1 billion in support for the design and testing of the Moderna vaccine." Wrong Phizer never accepted the money's and was developing the vaccine before the democrats forced the republicans into doing project warp speed. 1
oldmanfan Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 20 minutes ago, Doc said: Wrong. Right. Quit being a partisan hack.
Doc Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: Right. Quit being a partisan hack. Can you read? And oh, the hypocrisy! I assume that's yet another talking point (lie) fed to you guys that you never bothered to fact-check. But when I give you a link to your gospel newspaper and you still refuse to listen... Edited February 7, 2021 by Doc 1
oldmanfan Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, Doc said: Can you read? And oh, the hypocrisy! I assume that's yet another talking point (lie) fed to you guys that you never bothered to fact-check. But when I give you a link to your gospel newspaper and you still refuse to listen... Modena did receive some federal dollars, you are correct there. My bad there. Pfizer did not. My response was directed towards my comment about the Biden administration being judged by vaccine distribution, which it surely will be.
Doc Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 (edited) 31 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: Modena did receive some federal dollars, you are correct there. My bad there. Pfizer did not. My response was directed towards my comment about the Biden administration being judged by vaccine distribution, which it surely will be. But I did just bold "Moderna" in your post. Edit: LOL @ TBBills fan and the 👎 Edited February 7, 2021 by Doc 1
Sundancer Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 On the Danish mask study. https://fooledbyrandomnessdotcom.wordpress.com/2020/11/25/hypothesis-testing-in-the-presence-of-false-positives-the-flaws-in-the-danish-mask-study/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
SoCal Deek Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 What is wrong with people? The longest part of developing any medication or vaccine is NOT the development itself. The longest part is the time trials. They typically want to see if the drug is harmful to lab animals, then they start limited human trials, then they wait YEARS to see if there are unexpected long term side effects. Those precautionary steps were sped up in Operation Warp Speed ...which is pretty much ALL that Trump (or Biden) can actually do. The President can try and get the government agencies out of the way. Which was done in this case so that the vaccines would be allowed to be injected into humans on a mass scale. We still have no idea whether everyone is going to grow a third eyeball in a year or two! Why? Because the vaccine trials simply haven’t run that long. The world decided they simply couldn’t wait for the results.
Big Blitz Posted February 7, 2021 Posted February 7, 2021 (edited) Covid-19 News: South Africa Halts Use of AstraZeneca Vaccine Scientists in South Africa said on Sunday that a similar problem held among people who had been infected by earlier versions of the coronavirus: the immunity they acquired naturally did not appear to protect them from mild or moderate cases when reinfected by the variant, known as B.1.351. The developments, coming nearly a week after a million doses of the AstraZeneca-Oxford vaccine arrived in South Africa, were an enormous setback for the country, where more than 46,000 people are known to have died from the virus. And they were another sign of the dangers posed by new mutations in the coronavirus. The B.1.351 variant has already spread to at least 32 countries, including the United States. It was not clear from the studies outlined by South African scientists on Sunday whether the AstraZeneca-Oxford vaccine protected against severe disease from the B.1.351 variant. The clinical trial participants who were evaluated were relatively young and unlikely to become severely ill, making it impossible for the scientists to determine if the variant interfered with the AstraZeneca-Oxford vaccine’s ability to protect against severe Covid-19, hospitalizations, or deaths. However, based on the immune responses detected in blood samples from people who were given the vaccine, the scientists said they believed that the vaccine could yet protect against more severe cases. If further studies show that it does, South African health officials said on Sunday that they would consider resuming use of the AstraZeneca-Oxford vaccine. Even so, the fact that it showed minimal efficacy in preventing mild and moderate cases of the new variant added to the mounting evidence that B.1.351 makes current vaccines less effective. These research findings have not been published in a scientific journal. Pfizer and Moderna have both said that preliminary laboratory studies indicate that their vaccines, while still protective, are less effective against B.1.351. Novavax and Johnson & Johnson have also sequenced test samples from their clinical trial participants in South Africa, where B.1.351 caused the vast majority of cases — and both reported lower efficacy there than in the United States. “These results are very much a reality check,” Shabir Madhi, a virologist at University of the Witwatersrand who ran the AstraZeneca-Oxford vaccine trial in South Africa, said of the findings released on Sunday. https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/02/07/world/covid-19-coronavirus/south-africa-says-astrazenecas-vaccine-is-not-very-effective-at-stopping-a-variant-from-causing-illness New Variants!!! New Fear!!!!! You will do what you're told no questions asked! And no justification needed! Because you're scared and don't care about fweeeeeedoms. Edited February 7, 2021 by Big Blitz
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