Why protect Yates?

[xsoldier54]

He's better than Kaepernick right now? I'm not going to go down that road because it's ridiculous. He's nowhere near as good as Kaep. If you said "we shouldn't take Kaep because of the attention" that's different. I will give you Whitehurst (maybe). If he is better than the others what is that based on?

 

Yates: 58.1 completion %, 6 TDs, 8 INTs, 6.8 ypa, 72.8 rating

 

Hill: 61.8 completion %, 49 TDs, 30 INTs, 6.8 ypa, 84.9 rating

 

Ponder: 59.8 completion %, 38 TDs, 36 INTs, 5.5 ypa, 75.9 rating

 

RG: 63.3 completion %, 42 TDs, 26 INTs, 7.4 ypa, 88.4 rating

You can throw all the numbers out there that you want. RGIII is done. Kaepernick sucks. Hill and Ponder played for different teams under different circumstances. If you're only going to judge a player by statistical analysis then have at it. I like Yates and believe he is and will be better than those other guys. You don't have to agree. You are entitled to your opinion. I just respectfully disagree with your analysis. Numbers are only a part of the equation. He's a good fit for our offensive system and I'll take him.

[mjt328]

Despite what some believe, the Bills are not tanking this year. They will try to make the playoffs.

Once you understand that, it's not hard to figure out why the staff likes TJ Yates.

 

If the starter (Tyrod Taylor) goes down, you want a veteran guy that can potentially win games in his absence.

Not an inexperienced developmental project like Cardale Jones or a rookie like Nathan Peterman.

 

And if your backup is forced into action, would you rather have a guy that has been working in the current system, who knows the playbook and has been practicing with his teammates.... or a guy that was signed off the street on Monday afternoon?

[Kirby Jackson]

You can throw all the numbers out there that you want. RGIII is done. Kaepernick sucks. Hill and Ponder played for different teams under different circumstances. If you're only going to judge a player by statistical analysis then have at it. I like Yates and believe he is and will be better than those other guys. You don't have to agree. You are entitled to your opinion. I just respectfully disagree with your analysis. Numbers are only a part of the equation. He's a good fit for our offensive system and I'll take him.

So he's better because you say he is? Got it

 

There isn't a person in the world that thinks that he's better than Kaep. Liking Yates is fine but thinking he's better than Kaep is just wrong.

[BringBackOrton]

So he's better because you say he is? Got it

 

There isn't a person in the world that thinks that he's better than Kaep. Liking Yates is fine but thinking he's better than Kaep is just wrong.

Wasn't there this whole thing about how Kubiak and Rico had seen TT as a backup in Baltimore and thus know what they're getting in signing him?

 

Why doesn't Yates also fit that argument as the backup in Houston?

[oldmanfan]

So he's better because you say he is? Got it

 

There isn't a person in the world that thinks that he's better than Kaep. Liking Yates is fine but thinking he's better than Kaep is just wrong.

You last statement is demonstrably false since the Bills have decided they want Yates and not Kaepernick.

 

Kaepernick is physically talented, yes. More so than Yates, yes. So are guys like Jamarcus Russell and JP Losman. But does he fit this offense? If he did he'd likely be here. But he's not. Likely because he doesn't.

 

And before we start with the blackballing thing, given that the Pegulas have taken on guys like Richie, I am pretty sure it's not a reluctance to sign him because of his politics. They simply see Yates as a better fit. Sorry you don't like that.

[Kirby Jackson]

You last statement is demonstrably false since the Bills have decided they want Yates and not Kaepernick.

 

Kaepernick is physically talented, yes. More so than Yates, yes. So are guys like Jamarcus Russell and JP Losman. But does he fit this offense? If he did he'd likely be here. But he's not. Likely because he doesn't.

 

And before we start with the blackballing thing, given that the Pegulas have taken on guys like Richie, I am pretty sure it's not a reluctance to sign him because of his politics. They simply see Yates as a better fit. Sorry you don't like that.

No, it's blackballing and we can go there. Please feel free to put them side-by-side and make the case. Before I hear "Yates won a playoff game," Kaep almost won a Super Bowl. He had 16 TDs and 4 INTs last year. Yates on a roster doesn't mean that people think that he's better than Kaep because there is something called a contract in the NFL. If Kaep would play for 1 year and $815k he'd be in the league probably (despite the fact that owners don't want him there).

 

I can't believe that this derailed into a Kaepernick conversation and I reallly can't believe that people actually think that TJ Yates is better than him!!

Edited July 27, 2017 by Kirby Jackson

[KDIGGZ]

Not sure why it would be hard to understand. Yates knows the playbook, can help teach it to Peterman, if Tyrod gets hurt you plug him in for a few plays or a game or two until healthy. Peterman is not ready to play until he proves otherwise. You don't go into the season with a rookie backup unless he proves he's ready in the preseason. We didn't have the preseason yet and so Yates is our backup. If all goes well, Yates will be among the final cuts and nobody will sign him so he will be sitting at home if for some reason we need to bring him back. Hopefully we don't need him and in the meantime he's just a measuring stick to see if Peterman is any good

[oldmanfan]

No, it's blackballing and we can go there. Please feel free to put them side-by-side and make the case. Before I hear "Yates won a playoff game," Kaep almost won a Super Bowl. He had 16 TDs and 4 INTs last year. Yates on a roster doesn't mean that people think that he's better than Kaep because there is something called a contract in the NFL. If Kaep would play for 1 year and &815K he'd be in the league probably (despite the fact that owners don't want him there).

 

I can't believe that this derailed into a Kaepernick conversation and I reallly can't believe that people actually think that TJ Yates is better than him!!

Coaches and owners in the league have said they'd have no problem signing Kaepernick. He could still be in SF if he had taken the contract offered. Maybe he thinks he's worth more that he is.

 

Meanwhile we have a bet that has worked with the OC before. A rookie to develop. And a starter.

[Kirby Jackson]

Not sure why it would be hard to understand. Yates knows the playbook, can help teach it to Peterman, if Tyrod gets hurt you plug him in for a few plays or a game or two until healthy. Peterman is not ready to play until he proves otherwise. You don't go into the season with a rookie backup unless he proves he's ready in the preseason. We didn't have the preseason yet and so Yates is our backup. If all goes well, Yates will be among the final cuts and nobody will sign him so he will be sitting at home if for some reason we need to bring him back. Hopefully we don't need him and in the meantime he's just a measuring stick to see if Peterman is any good

So Peterman doesn't know the playbook?

[KDIGGZ]

Kaepernick would rather everyone be talking about how nobody signed Kaepernick. He feels like he's on some kind of mission to change the world and that's bigger than football. So everyone asking why nobody is signing him helps his cause

So Peterman doesn't know the playbook?

As much as a rookie learning a new system could. Takes you about 2 years to really get it in a new system. You can learn the plays and know where everyone is supposed to be but it takes longer to really understand why they are doing what they do and what you can expect from the defense in this situations.

 

Like I said, best case scenario is we hear how much Peterman is outplaying Yates over the next few weeks and then the situation will take care of itself

[BringBackOrton]

Does anyone remember when we didn't need Cassel, then EJ singlehandedly cost us a playoff appearance?

[Kirby Jackson]

Coaches and owners in the league have said they'd have no problem signing Kaepernick. He could still be in SF if he had taken the contract offered. Maybe he thinks he's worth more that he is.

 

Meanwhile we have a bet that has worked with the OC before. A rookie to develop. And a starter.

Coaches and owners (especially owners) are certainly going to say "we would have no problem signing Kaepernick." If they said that they had a problem they'd get called to the carpet and asked "why do you have no problem employing a guy that has (insert actual crime here) but do have a problem employing a guy that protested?" They don't want to look like fools so they just pretend that they are cool with it.

 

I do agree that he'd probably be employed for an under market value contract. His play probably has him in like an $8M a year range (like a Hoyer). If Kaep would take $815k he would be employed.

[GunnerBill]

Does anyone remember when we didn't need Cassel, then EJ singlehandedly cost us a playoff appearance?

 

The same night Cassel also gifted away 14 points on turnovers for Dallas? Yea.... I remember. Keeping Cassel when someone was offering you a pick would have been crazy.

[Rochesterfan]

I've been preaching (maybe crusading) in other threads as to why you would waste a roster spot on Yates. Here are my reasons:

- If he is playing for an extended period you are losing anyways

- You miss the chance to get a look at Peterman

- You have one less pit to use elsewhere on the roster

- If cut you can probably call him on any given Monday and add him back

- Is he really better than Kaep, RG, Shaun Hill, Whitehurst, Or Ponder

We keep hearing that "the guy knows the offense." I guess that's a reason to bring him to camp but someone please convince me that he deserves a roster spot. Would the team be any worse with Peterman taking snaps than Yates? I'd rather win 3 games with the rookie than 3 games with a guy in his 30's. What am I missing (other than NFL teams like certain guys because they have played in games before)? Playing in games and being bad shouldn't be a prerequisite for a future job.

 

To me it is simple - look at Miami last year - they lost their starter with a couple of games to go - that is no time to decide if Peterman can do the job.

 

You want a Veteran leader that know the offense and understands how to watch and breakdown film to help these guys grow in the system. It gives the players someone to bounce questions off from and to share opinions - especially during the game.

 

There are lots of reasons to want a long time veteran that is familiar with an offense to be part of the team.

 

Long term he is nothing other than a support and help in certain cases. If TT goes down early or struggles - then I agree - you want to see what Peterman can do if we are losing, but I would take Yates over Peterman for finishing a game or a week or two with the playoffs on the line.

[C.Biscuit97]

So he's better because you say he is? Got it

 

There isn't a person in the world that thinks that he's better than Kaep. Liking Yates is fine but thinking he's better than Kaep is just wrong.

It's kinda of embarrassing that anyone that anyone would even suggest this.

 

People who are obviously superior Americans to CK are going to judge him forever for his stance. That's fine and it's their choice. But don't make up things like Yates is a better qb than him because that is simply not true.

I think projecting Kaep in this offense is misguided. Kaep has no touch whatsoever.

Is his touch that much worse than Taylor's? I think they are very similar players.

 

And CK is a flawed qb, no doubt. It if the Bills had to win a game, I'd feel a million times more comfortable with him than TJ.

[oldmanfan]

Coaches and owners (especially owners) are certainly going to say "we would have no problem signing Kaepernick." If they said that they had a problem they'd get called to the carpet and asked "why do you have no problem employing a guy that has (insert actual crime here) but do have a problem employing a guy that protested?" They don't want to look like fools so they just pretend that they are cool with it.

 

I do agree that he'd probably be employed for an under market value contract. His play probably has him in like an $8M a year range (like a Hoyer). If Kaep would take $815k he would be employed.

seems like people in the league have an idea what he's worth and he doesn't agree. He will eventually. Or not.

It's kinda of embarrassing that anyone that anyone would even suggest this.

 

People who are obviously superior Americans to CK are going to judge him forever for his stance. That's fine and it's their choice. But don't make up things like Yates is a better qb than him because that is simply not true.

 

Is his touch that much worse than Taylor's? I think they are very similar players.

 

And CK is a flawed qb, no doubt. It if the Bills had to win a game, I'd feel a million times more comfortable with him than TJ.

I support Kaepernick's stance and his freedom to protest as he wishes. I do not support him being so much better than our current backup.

[Rochesterfan]

I think that's right. That goes to Gunner's point that if they all stink give me the guy that I know will play my system. I just question why they don't say "give me the guy that gets the best chance to win."

We are seeing it some more with teams playing the young guys I guess. Maybe it is changing? He's still light years ahead of these other guys as a player (and he's not very good).

They feel that Yates gives them the better chance to win. There are limited reps for a back-up and if you can place a guy in the role that you already know what he can and can not do - you are going to get better success.

 

If the Bills signed Kaep and needed someone for 6 - 8 weeks then yes Kaep may be better, but if it is the second half of a game in December- every coach would want to put a guy in that understands the offense and can fit in for the week or two.

 

I honestly do not care - I think all of the guys you mentioned including Kaep are not good enough - so pick a guy that already knows what you are doing and go from there. Age should have nothing to do with it and neither should what some guy did in someone else's system - find someone the team is comfortable with and go from there.

[C.Biscuit97]

seems like people in the league have an idea what he's worth and he doesn't agree. He will eventually. Or not.

 

I support Kaepernick's stance and his freedom to protest as he wishes. I do not support him being so much better than our current backup.

Ok fair enough. I think CK is miles better than Yates and has actually been the reason his team has won, unlike Yates.

 

But I respect your opinion and I apologize if I came across rude early.

[oldmanfan]

Ok fair enough. I think CK is miles better than Yates and has actually been the reason his team has won, unlike Yates.

 

But I respect your opinion and I apologize if I came across rude early.

No problem. My impression is the league sees him as a backup but he wants starter $$

[Kirby Jackson]

seems like people in the league have an idea what he's worth and he doesn't agree. He will eventually. Or not.

 

I support Kaepernick's stance and his freedom to protest as he wishes. I do not support him being so much better than our current backup.

I don't think it's as much of a contract issue with Kaep as it is all that comes with it. Hoyer can earn between $6M-$9M this year (I think). That feels like a more than fair rate for Kaep. If you sign Kaep though, it's that money + the attention. For $2M someone would probably take on the attention. If he weren't such a polarizing figure he'd probably get that same range as Hoyer. It's a combination of all of it.