oldmanfan Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 You can take the vast majority of backup QBs in the league, put them in a room, then walk into the room blindfolded and just randomly pick one. And you'll get about the same outcome. Yates is here because he's performed to some extent in the league and because he's worked with the OC and knows his offense. Simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted July 27, 2017 Author Share Posted July 27, 2017 Yates is better right now than any of those guys that you mentioned, including Kaepernick, RGIII, Shaun HIll, Whitehurst and Ponder. He is an experienced veteran who will run the offense just fine if TT goes down. Peterman has never played a down in the NFL. It would be foolish to pencil him in as #2. Let him learn the game at the NFL level and develop. Then he is ready if and when you need him. What the Bills are doing makes perfect sense and what you are proposing does not. Simple as that. He's better than Kaepernick right now? I'm not going to go down that road because it's ridiculous. He's nowhere near as good as Kaep. If you said "we shouldn't take Kaep because of the attention" that's different. I will give you Whitehurst (maybe). If he is better than the others what is that based on? Yates: 58.1 completion %, 6 TDs, 8 INTs, 6.8 ypa, 72.8 rating Hill: 61.8 completion %, 49 TDs, 30 INTs, 6.8 ypa, 84.9 rating Ponder: 59.8 completion %, 38 TDs, 36 INTs, 5.5 ypa, 75.9 rating RG: 63.3 completion %, 42 TDs, 26 INTs, 7.4 ypa, 88.4 rating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 I think projecting Kaep in this offense is misguided. Kaep has no touch whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted July 27, 2017 Author Share Posted July 27, 2017 You can take the vast majority of backup QBs in the league, put them in a room, then walk into the room blindfolded and just randomly pick one. And you'll get about the same outcome. Yates is here because he's performed to some extent in the league and because he's worked with the OC and knows his offense. Simple.I think that's right. That goes to Gunner's point that if they all stink give me the guy that I know will play my system. I just question why they don't say "give me the guy that gets the best chance to win." We are seeing it some more with teams playing the young guys I guess. Maybe it is changing? I think projecting Kaep in this offense is misguided. Kaep has no touch whatsoever.He's still light years ahead of these other guys as a player (and he's not very good). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 I think that's right. That goes to Gunner's point that if they all stink give me the guy that I know will play my system. I just question why they don't say "give me the guy that gets the best chance to win." We are seeing it some more with teams playing the young guys I guess. Maybe it is changing? He's still light years ahead of these other guys as a player (and he's not very good). Our skill guys are fragile enough. They don't need broken hands too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 I think that's right. That goes to Gunner's point that if they all stink give me the guy that I know will play my system. I just question why they don't say "give me the guy that gets the best chance to win." We are seeing it some more with teams playing the young guys I guess. Maybe it is changing? He's still light years ahead of these other guys as a player (and he's not very good). The guy that knows the system best and that can operate the system gives them the best chance to win. You're being pigheaded for no reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted July 27, 2017 Author Share Posted July 27, 2017 The guy that knows the system best and that can operate the system gives them the best chance to win. You're being pigheaded for no reason.Because he played in a similar system in 2013 we just accept that gives them a better chance to win than someone that presumably has more talent?!? That's a lot of confidence in the system (and Yates). I'm not sure how I'm being "pigheaded." I'm asking a question because I don't believe that guys like him "give you the best chance to win" yet they all keep getting jobs. Dan Orlovsky signed a contract recently. Why does a team feel more comfortable with a guy that stinks, that they've seen stink, a better option than the unknown? We are starting to see teams turn to young guys earlier and earlier. It makes sense to do that. It was more meant to be a macro question and as I thought there really aren't good reasons for it. I was hoping for some football reasons, not because coaches are comfortable. That sounds more like a bad marriage than a good football situation. It was meant to be thought-provoking not to bash the guy. Why waste a roster spot on a guy that you can call tomorrow and add back to the roster? That's true at any position IMO. I've argued the point enough so I will leave the discussion. Thanks everyone for engaging!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Because he played in a similar system in 2013 we just accept that gives them a better chance to win than someone that presumably has more talent?!? That's a lot of confidence in the system (and Yates). I'm not sure how I'm being "pigheaded." I'm asking a question because I don't believe that guys like him "give you the best chance to win" yet they all keep getting jobs. Dan Orlovsky signed a contract recently. Why does a team feel more comfortable with a guy that stinks, that they've seen stink, a better option than the unknown? We are starting to see teams turn to young guys earlier and earlier. It makes sense to do that. It was more meant to be a macro question and as I thought there really aren't good reasons for it. I was hoping for some football reasons, not because coaches are comfortable. That sounds more like a bad marriage than a good football situation. It was meant to be thought-provoking not to bash the guy. Why waste a roster spot on a guy that you can call tomorrow and add back to the roster? That's true at any position IMO. I've argued the point enough so I will leave the discussion. Thanks everyone for engaging!! Kaepernick has seriously regressed in terms of his play. Again very simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 It is why I think Roman was in the Cassel camp in 2015. You're right but Cassel is Tom Brady compared to Yates. He was "2-0" as a starter completing 49% of his passes a few years ago. You win in spite of him. Hopefully, he is just a camp arm and helping learn the playbook. But I hate this philosophy of having the vet. Tyrod is the vet. And I'd rather take my chances with young guys I haven't seen suck than a vet who I know sucks. Again, I'm sure he's a great guy. Kaepernick has seriously regressed in terms of his play. Again very simple. And yet, he is far superior to Yates and had a 16 td to 4 int season on maybe the least talented offensive team in the NFL. If only he beat a woman or killed dogs instead of protesting quietly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Because he played in a similar system in 2013 we just accept that gives them a better chance to win than someone that presumably has more talent?!? That's a lot of confidence in the system (and Yates). I'm not sure how I'm being "pigheaded." I'm asking a question because I don't believe that guys like him "give you the best chance to win" yet they all keep getting jobs. Dan Orlovsky signed a contract recently. Why does a team feel more comfortable with a guy that stinks, that they've seen stink, a better option than the unknown? We are starting to see teams turn to young guys earlier and earlier. It makes sense to do that. It was more meant to be a macro question and as I thought there really aren't good reasons for it. I was hoping for some football reasons, not because coaches are comfortable. That sounds more like a bad marriage than a good football situation. It was meant to be thought-provoking not to bash the guy. Why waste a roster spot on a guy that you can call tomorrow and add back to the roster? That's true at any position IMO. I've argued the point enough so I will leave the discussion. Thanks everyone for engaging!! Why do you think Peterman has more talent? Both were 5th round picks, both were ACC QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted July 27, 2017 Author Share Posted July 27, 2017 (edited) Kaepernick has seriously regressed in terms of his play. Again very simple.He had a really nice year last year. He's somewhere between a starter and a backup (like a Hoyer). I can certainly see why a team would pass on him though with the attention that comes with it. A lot of teams don't want the spotlight for a guy that may not take a snap all year. Is he one of the best 64 QBs in the world though? Absolutely Why do you think Peterman has more talent? Both were 5th round picks, both were ACC QBs.I don't think that it's a big gap. It's more of the two of them having the same floor. If the worst case scenario for either them is the same (or even similar) I'd rather play the guy that's best case scenario is better. Yates on his best day isn't good enough. Peterman on his best day is a question mark (at this point). Edited July 27, 2017 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maynard Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Maybe Yates isn't being protected at all and he will battle it out with Peterman for the #2 job. I'm thinking the same or they just keep Yates through TC and then cut him loose. Of course if Peterman looks god awful then this won't be the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 You're right but Cassel is Tom Brady compared to Yates. He was "2-0" as a starter completing 49% of his passes a few years ago. You win in spite of him. Hopefully, he is just a camp arm and helping learn the playbook. But I hate this philosophy of having the vet. Tyrod is the vet. And I'd rather take my chances with young guys I haven't seen suck than a vet who I know sucks. Again, I'm sure he's a great guy. And yet, he is far superior to Yates and had a 16 td to 4 int season on maybe the least talented offensive team in the NFL. If only he beat a woman or killed dogs instead of protesting quietly. Well, he is not "far superior" to Yates or someone would have him on their roster by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 That seems to be the general consensus. I'm not trying to go all Mike Schopp on this but it makes no sense to me. Everyone assumes that he will get a job (and others like him around the league). The question is really why do teams do that? More importantly, Kirby, what are some good sites for hat shopping for me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Well, he is not "far superior" to Yates or someone would have him on their roster by now. Yeah, I'm sure there are no other factors involved. If you don't think CK is a better qb than Yates, you know nothing about football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 I hope McD knows what he is doing after passing on Mahomes and Watson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Yeah, I'm sure there are no other factors involved. If you don't think CK is a better qb than Yates, you know nothing about football. He used to be. But he has accuracy problems and he has trouble sticking to an offensive scheme. He has a lot more physical talent, but then again so did guys like Jamarcus Russell and JP Losman. Look how far their physical skills got him. His anthem stuff adds to the issues he has regarding actually running an NFL offense. And spare me the stuff about knowing football as if you're some kind of NFL guru. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 I don't think the right comparison is Yates versus RG3 or Ponder or whoever. They are all just "guys." I don't care whether it's Yates or another one of these "guys." And I don't think it really matters if one has better stats than the other. They all are the same. I think you need someone who is on the roster all year, knows the offense, and can manage for you for a quarter or a few games. Yates or another vet. Doesn't matter. But I think a roster spot for a vet no. 2 is imperative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 He used to be. But he has accuracy problems and he has trouble sticking to an offensive scheme. He has a lot more physical talent, but then again so did guys like Jamarcus Russell and JP Losman. Look how far their physical skills got him. His anthem stuff adds to the issues he has regarding actually running an NFL offense. And spare me the stuff about knowing football as if you're some kind of NFL guru. 1) Losman and Russell never had a 4 td to 1 int in a season like CK just had. Much less won multiple playoffs games and nearly a SB. 2) CK's accuracy regressed to 59% last year. Guess what? That's better than Yates' career average. So if you aren't putting your personal feelings into it and solely evaluating each qb on their abilities, CK is far superior to Yates. And if you believe otherwise, your knowledge of football is severely lacking. I don't think the right comparison is Yates versus RG3 or Ponder or whoever. They are all just "guys." I don't care whether it's Yates or another one of these "guys." And I don't think it really matters if one has better stats than the other. They all are the same. I think you need someone who is on the roster all year, knows the offense, and can manage for you for a quarter or a few games. Yates or another vet. Doesn't matter. But I think a roster spot for a vet no. 2 is imperative. I used to be in that camp of if your starter goes down, you're probably screwed. Well, if you are competing for a wildcard, those couple of games could make or break your season. You can do better than a guy who has worse career numbers than EJ Manuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted July 27, 2017 Author Share Posted July 27, 2017 More importantly, Kirby, what are some good sites for hat shopping for me? Lids is always an option. That's pretty boring as an answer but they have the selection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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