Dumb Carucci column...assessing QB position

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Honestly ask the other members

 

Had anyone ever mentioned TJ Yates as a Buffalo Bill when talking about backups or starters?

 

I don't recall him being mentioned. (here or BBMB the thought process wrt QB has been very similar)

[C.Biscuit97]

I don't think Jones makes it past the first cut.

 

It's McD's team now and any unproven leftover has a slim to no chance.

I don't doubt you but Yates literally offers you nothing because knowing the playbook. I would not feel better about trying to win a game with him than Peterman or Jones.

 

NFL coaches are such kitty cats. It's one thing if you have a Fitz or Matt Moore type backup. Yates provides nothing and you should go with the young guys unless they can't even the snap exchange.

[GunnerBill]

I don't think Jones makes it past the first cut.

 

It's McD's team now and any unproven leftover has a slim to no chance.

There is no first cut now. Just a single cut down day.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

There is no first cut now. Just a single cut down day.

isn't it still technically the first cut?

 

thanks for the clarification.

[John from Riverside]

This Carucci gem is on the front page this morning. Come on, Vic.

 

First, he says that Tyrod could be "negatively impacted" because he took a pay cut. Umm, ok.

 

He also says the Bills got "slightly worse" at the QB position. What? Tyrod has an another year of experience and an OC with whom he is familiar -- he got worse? The Bills dumped EJ and added Yates and Peterman to battle for the backup job -- they got worse?

 

You don't have to be a Taylor fan or believe he's a franchise QB to understand that this is simply a pretty poor assessment of the Bills' QBs.

 

Vic is a shell of his former self.

I dont understand how we got slightly worse at QB

 

When you look at the QB group as a whole they are either the same or got slightly better

 

Taking a pay cut might actually put a chip on TT's shoulder like it did that first year when he had to come in and beat out 2 other QBs for the starting spot......

[JM2009]

I dont understand how we got slightly worse at QB

 

When you look at the QB group as a whole they are either the same or got slightly better

 

Taking a pay cut might actually put a chip on TT's shoulder like it did that first year when he had to come in and beat out 2 other QBs for the starting spot......

They are a bit better. More experience for TT and the fact that EJ isn't on the roster. Yates is an upgrade at backup.

[C.Biscuit97]

So where I think Vic is right - the pay cut and contract slashing tells you all you all you need to know about how the Bills actually view Tyrod - the best option for now but not a viable long term option.

 

Where I think he is massively reaching - that the pay cut is likely to have any effect on Tyrod's mental state when the season begins. Tyrod just never comes across as that type to me. He is a guy that has never done anything the easy way as a QB his whole career. He has always been fighting the odds. To even be where he is is a fantastic underdog story of a competitor who takes knock backs as challenges. I expect Tyrod to be the same Tyrod we have seen through two years. He will be conservative with the football but will lead his guys and make some plays. Same ceiling, same flaws but the same competitor he has always been.

 

What has been mentioned in this thread that I do question a bit is the idea this offense is a perfect fit for him. I think people look at the boots and the rollouts and presume that.... but this offense also relies a lot on timing routes and really accentuates short range accuracy. They are areas I think Tyrod still has questions to answer.

Really good post. I think people might be surprised at how good Roman's offense was for Tyrod. People in SF started blaming Roman & Harbaugh for Kaepernick's regression as a qb. Well, they left and CK struggled even more.

 

But I'd love to be surprised to see Tyrod's strengths are as a qb are quick timing routes. I don't see that but who knows.

They are a bit better. More experience for TT and the fact that EJ isn't on the roster. Yates is an upgrade at backup.

Yeah, this isn't based on facts at all.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/ManuEJ00.htm

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/Y/YateT.00.htm

 

Oh, and EJ's looking good in OTAs. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.silverandblackpride.com/platform/amp/2017/6/14/15804564/raiders-minicamp-day-two-notes-gareon-conley-sidelined-ej-manuel-jumps-connor-cook-depth-chart

[John from Riverside]

Really good post. I think people might be surprised at how good Roman's offense was for Tyrod. People in SF started blaming Roman & Harbaugh for Kaepernick's regression as a qb. Well, they left and CK struggled even more.

 

But I'd love to be surprised to see Tyrod's strengths are as a qb are quick timing routes. I don't see that but who knows.

 

Yeah, this isn't based on facts at all.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/ManuEJ00.htm

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/Y/YateT.00.htm

 

Oh, and EJ's looking good in OTAs. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.silverandblackpride.com/platform/amp/2017/6/14/15804564/raiders-minicamp-day-two-notes-gareon-conley-sidelined-ej-manuel-jumps-connor-cook-depth-chart

I just think that if the guys around him make plays.....everyone will say that Tyrod improved...when in fact it is the same guy he just got some help.

[C.Biscuit97]

I just think that if the guys around him make plays.....everyone will say that Tyrod improved...when in fact it is the same guy he just got some help.

I promise I'm not trying to bash Tyrod here. . I think people love to scapegoat coaches. Roman had his faults but he did really good work with CK and Tyrod. They aren't "normal" qbs. They aren't at their best throwing 30 times from the pocket. They are given very simple progressions and rely on their athletic abilities.

 

I'm hard on TT in terms of him being a franchise level qb. I also salute him because he has completely maximized his ability to become a starting NFL caliber qb. But he was an under 60% passer in college. To expect him to suddenly become a quick, precision passer is setting him up to fail imo.

 

This offense seems more made for Peterman (not saying he will start but he was drafted to fit it).

[JM2009]

Really good post. I think people might be surprised at how good Roman's offense was for Tyrod. People in SF started blaming Roman & Harbaugh for Kaepernick's regression as a qb. Well, they left and CK struggled even more.

 

But I'd love to be surprised to see Tyrod's strengths are as a qb are quick timing routes. I don't see that but who knows.

 

Yeah, this isn't based on facts at all.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/ManuEJ00.htm

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/Y/YateT.00.htm

 

Oh, and EJ's looking good in OTAs. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.silverandblackpride.com/platform/amp/2017/6/14/15804564/raiders-minicamp-day-two-notes-gareon-conley-sidelined-ej-manuel-jumps-connor-cook-depth-chart

EJ has looked good in practice before. Since 2014, he has been pretty terrible in the regular season when called on. He's a first round bust-never should have been picked in the first.

[John from Riverside]

I promise I'm not trying to bash Tyrod here. . I think people love to scapegoat coaches. Roman had his faults but he did really good work with CK and Tyrod. They aren't "normal" qbs. They aren't at their best throwing 30 times from the pocket. They are given very simple progressions and rely on their athletic abilities.

 

I'm hard on TT in terms of him being a franchise level qb. I also salute him because he has completely maximized his ability to become a starting NFL caliber qb. But he was an under 60% passer in college. To expect him to suddenly become a quick, precision passer is setting him up to fail imo.

 

This offense seems more made for Peterman (not saying he will start but he was drafted to fit it).

I dont want to scape goat anyone either....i think the complaints of not working the middle of the field are legit.....I just think that players

 

Dropping balls that hit them in the hands

Giving no run after catch (i realize that TT throws a lot to stationary targets but i STILL see opportunities for RAC and a player just cant break a tackle

 

One of the things that Clay really drove me nuts about is he would catch a ball.....then would not fall forward.....or break a first tackle to maximize the play

 

I really just want to see what TT looks like in Dennison's offense before passing a final judgement

[C.Biscuit97]

I dont want to scape goat anyone either....i think the complaints of not working the middle of the field are legit.....I just think that players

 

Dropping balls that hit them in the hands

Giving no run after catch (i realize that TT throws a lot to stationary targets but i STILL see opportunities for RAC and a player just cant break a tackle

 

One of the things that Clay really drove me nuts about is he would catch a ball.....then would not fall forward.....or break a first tackle to maximize the play

 

I really just want to see what TT looks like in Dennison's offense before passing a final judgement

Good post overall. I think the YAC is more on Tyrod than you realize. Clay was great after the catch in Miami. Hogan had more YAC this year than Sammy has had in his last 2 years. That's terrible.

 

Personally, I would feel better about Tyrod in Roman's offense. But he is our starter and nothing would make me happier than to be wrong.

[Alphadawg7]

Is that Negativity or Reality?

 

Some truth, some click bait.

 

Truth (imo) If Bills were convinced Taylor was their long-term franchise QB, there would be a much firmer contractual commitment than the one they have that leaves them an easy out after this season.

 

Truth (imo) Sure, Taylor has plenty of incentive to have the best season of his career. Whether it's from the Bills or another team, he wants to prove that he deserves to get paid.

 

Truth (imo) But there's reason to wonder what his frame of mind will be after being forced to take a pay cut. Taylor also is well aware that, with the use of a fifth-round draft pick on a quarterback (Peterman) and the acquisition of a first-round choice in 2018, the Bills are positioned to replace him if he doesn't make dramatic strides.

 

Truth (imo) Although his fleet feet remain vital to the Bills’ strong rushing production, Taylor remains too quick to run and does a poor job of looking for targets in the middle of the field. Except for the final practice of mandatory minicamp, he had generally mediocre to poor showings through offseason workouts open to the media.

 

Truth (imo) The fact Taylor will be transitioning to yet another new offense is another potential stumbling block.

 

The rest is conjecture.

 

LMAO...the irony of labeling something "Truth" followed by immediately discrediting that and stating its not "truth" by putting (imo) right after it is classic TSW

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

 

LMAO...the irony of labeling something "Truth" followed by immediately discrediting that and stating its not "truth" by putting (imo) right after it is classic TSW

see above WTR the same critique.

 

Maybe I'll edit to simplify the post for those having trouble.

[JohnC]

And if Rex's defense makes two key stops last season the Bills are 10-6 and in the playoffs. Magically Taylor becomes a franchise QB. Funny how that works.

 

You can "what if" yourself until you are exhausted. Last year's erratic defense had little bearing on how he played. He is not a franchise qb and will never be. He could have put himself on the market this offseason. He didn't. Instead he took a pay cut and restructured his contract because no other team was interested in him as a starter.

[JM2009]

You can "what if" yourself until you are exhausted. Last year's erratic defense had little bearing on how he played. He is not a franchise qb and will never be. He could have put himself on the market this offseason. He didn't. Instead he took a pay cut and restructured his contract because no other team was interested in him as a starter.

Who is at fault in the second Miami game?Erratic-the defense was bad against the better teams. period.The offense did enough for a WC berth.

Edited June 27, 2017 by JM2009

[C.Biscuit97]

Who is at fault in the second Miami game?

Who's fault was the Baltimore game?

 

We had a 7 win team. Offense, defense, & STs all played a big role. They all feed off each other.

[HappyDays]

I wonder if Tyrod knows Vic Carucci's name

[JM2009]

Who's fault was the Baltimore game?

 

We had a 7 win team. Offense, defense, & STs all played a big role. They all feed off each other.

Always come back with the one really poor game by the offense. Bengals was probably next. Of course Watkins playing hurt and not playing at all means nothing, I know.The rest of the season the offense put up enough points to make a WC. The defense was the main problem. The fact that the few who will not blame the defense for the second Miami game, and ST, is very telling. 7 win-if TT played that last game the Bills would have won. The team quit. That's 8 wins again. If the defense and ST makes one stop in that Miami game, there is 9 wins. Last years team was a bit better than 7 wins.

[eball]

You can "what if" yourself until you are exhausted. Last year's erratic defense had little bearing on how he played. He is not a franchise qb and will never be. He could have put himself on the market this offseason. He didn't. Instead he took a pay cut and restructured his contract because no other team was interested in him as a starter.

 

John, surely you realize this isn't even close to being 100% fact. I'm willing to bet at least a handful of teams would be interested in Taylor as a starter, right now, for the same contract the Bills are paying. The question still up for debate is whether Taylor is a long-term option. You've made your decision; many others have not. I don't even care whether Taylor is the long-term option, because that's not what drew my ire regarding Vic's dumb column.