Royale with Cheese Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 On BBMB....this was a hot topic. Anyone else still following it? Well Brendan Dassey the low IQ has had his murder over turned now for the 2nd time. It was overturned several months ago but that was blocked by a state judge. It was appealed for federal court and Dassey won. The state of Wisconsin again has 90 days to appeal this latest event. https://www.usatoday.com/story/life/tv/2017/06/23/conviction-making-murderer-defendant-brendan-dassey-overturned/103132758/ Kathleen Zellner who has the most overturned wrongful convictions of any Lawyer in the US is working on behalf of Steve Avery. She's very public on twitter about how all the evidence is pointing to Avery being set up. http://www.inquisitr.com/4301682/making-a-murderer-fire-expert-teresa-halbach-not-burned-in-steven-averys-fire-pit/ Dr. John DeHaan, who has almost 50 years’ experience working with fires and bombs, said several pieces of evidence tell him Halbach was burned elsewhere, and her bones were planted behind Avery’s garage. If you're interested, Zellner has several affidavits from homicide experts that investigation was botched and evidence was planted. https://twitter.com/ZellnerLaw?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 We're doing this one again?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 We're doing this one again?! Oh yeah....we're about to see an explosion. The bullet that supposedly went through Teresa Halbach's skull didn't have any bone fragments on it? The planted evidence keeps popping up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackFergy Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) He'll be out in time for Wrestlemania 397 Edited June 23, 2017 by BringBackFergy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockpile233 Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 I don't know if I'm ready to jump back in... I was reading something out of Avery's attorney about the DNA on the key being planted via toothbrush. There...I dipped a toe in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Christ Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Avery is guilty period. Probably for a lot more stuff that we don't know about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 Avery is guilty period. Probably for a lot more stuff that we don't know about. Guilty of other stuff....maybe. Guilty of this murder....starting to sound more and more he's not. I don't know if I'm ready to jump back in... I was reading something out of Avery's attorney about the DNA on the key being planted via toothbrush. There...I dipped a toe in. Put your whole foot in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Avery is guilty period. Probably for a lot more stuff that we don't know about.but it might be like Eric O'Bannon in Bloodline (for whoever else watches that) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheElectricCompany Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) Conspiracy theories are usually quite grand...the secret bunker under DIA, JFK, 9/11, chemtrails. I just don't buy that the county would go through this much trouble to frame some backwoods country hick. The series is less about Avery being guilty or not, but some harsh realities of the justice systems, specifically in how they conduct themselves. Edited June 23, 2017 by TheElectricCompany Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 Conspiracy theories are usually quite grand...the secret bunker under DIA, JFK, 9/11, chemtrails. I just don't buy that the county would go through this much trouble to frame some backwoods country hick. They put him away for a rape he didn't commit...served 18 years. There were several pieces of evidence that was ignored in that case....specifically that he was 30 miles at the time of the incident. He was suing MC for $36 million. I do think there was motives to plant evidence against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheElectricCompany Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) They put him away for a rape he didn't commit...served 18 years. There were several pieces of evidence that was ignored in that case....specifically that he was 30 miles at the time of the incident. He was suing MC for $36 million. I do think there was motives to plant evidence against him. I think you are giving people to much credit. An unsettled lawsuit against a rural backwoods county isn't enough to get multiple attorneys (on both sides of the courtroom), DA, LEOs from two police departments and some random people in between enough reason to conspire to murder and frame, all while escaping any prosecution of their own. You watched the show...I don't think Ken, Len, Andrew and Company are the sharpest tools in the shed. No way they could pull it off, even if they wanted to. Edited June 23, 2017 by TheElectricCompany Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) I think you are giving people to much credit. An unsettled lawsuit against a rural backwoods county isn't enough to get multiple public defenders, judges, LEOs and a few people in between enough reason to conspire to murder and frame, all while escaping any prosecution of their own. You watched the show...I don't think Ken, Len, Andrew and Company are the sharpest tools in the shed. No way they could pull it off, even if they wanted to. Well the evidence does look sloppy so yes....I think it's possible. I mean you did to Len's email with the Investigator about the Avery family right? "This is truly where the devil resides in comfort. I can find no good in any member. These people are pure evil. A friend of mine suggested "this is a one branch family tree. Cut this tree down. We need to end the gene pool". Does this not indicate they were after them? This was an email exchange by Bredan Dassey's lawyer and the investigator he brought on! There's a reason why the Judge removed him from the case. He wasn't representing Brendan, he was just trying to get him into a confession. I don't think the judge, Len or Ken conspired. The Judge just didn't do a good job handling the case. Len didn't want to represent Brendan and just wanted him gone. Ken just sleazed his way through the case. The county was already embarrassed by the last wrongful prosecution years ago. Now Avery wants money. If the lawsuit continues, I believe Manitowac County could have been held liable if there is enough evidence they framed Avery....which is why they wanted to plant evidence against him and put him behind bars. I mean one of the Deputy's received a call from another CO that one of the inmates admitted to the rape Avery was in jail for. He did nothing....it would have gotten Avery out of prison 11 years earlier. Does that not speak of the level of hatred towards him? We all know the evidence ie. key mysteriously appeared, no blood in the mobile home, no hair, no DNA in the bedroom, story changed from Dassey etc.... Now a ballistics expert in an affidavit stated there wasn't bone fragments on the bullet that went through TH's skull and killed her? How does a bullet go through a skull and not have bone fragments. The bullet hit wood? How does a bullet that hit wood end up with TH's blood/DNA on it but not her bone fragments? Forensic splatter expert said blood was planted in Rav4. Another Forensic expert states body not burned in the pit and the bones were moved. DNA Expert stated the evidence of the DNA on the key doesn't add up. These are just the latest evidence....they are in the affidavits. Kathleen Zellner has them in a PDF on her twitter. Edited June 23, 2017 by Teeflebees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Jack Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 On BBMB....this was a hot topic. Anyone else still following it? This was the thread from last year, in the archives now... http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/184208-making-a-murderer/?hl=murderer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 This was the thread from last year, in the archives now... http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/184208-making-a-murderer/?hl=murderer Let's rebirth this topic and get it going. Dassey is about to get released....I think the ball is rolling and Avery will be next. I'm not saying Avery should just have his murder overturned, I'm sure the Prosecution has their side too. I think he at least deserves another trial with the new evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 If you post a picture of the guy I'll be able to tell you if he did it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheElectricCompany Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) Well the evidence does look sloppy so yes....I think it's possible. I mean you did to Len's email with the Investigator about the Avery family right? "This is truly where the devil resides in comfort. I can find no good in any member. These people are pure evil. A friend of mine suggested "this is a one branch family tree. Cut this tree down. We need to end the gene pool". Does this not indicate they were after them? This was an email exchange by Bredan Dassey's lawyer and the investigator he brought on! There's a reason why the Judge removed him from the case. He wasn't representing Brendan, he was just trying to get him into a confession. I don't think the judge, Len or Ken conspired. The Judge just didn't do a good job handling the case. Len didn't want to represent Brendan and just wanted him gone. Ken just sleazed his way through the case. The county was already embarrassed by the last wrongful prosecution years ago. Now Avery wants money. If the lawsuit continues, I believe Manitowac County could have been held liable if there is enough evidence they framed Avery....which is why they wanted to plant evidence against him and put him behind bars. I mean one of the Deputy's received a call from another CO that one of the inmates admitted to the rape Avery was in jail for. He did nothing....it would have gotten Avery out of prison 11 years earlier. Does that not speak of the level of hatred towards him? We all know the evidence ie. key mysteriously appeared, no blood in the mobile home, no hair, no DNA in the bedroom, story changed from Dassey etc.... Now a ballistics expert in an affidavit stated there wasn't bone fragments on the bullet that went through TH's skull and killed her? How does a bullet go through a skull and not have bone fragments. The bullet hit wood? How does a bullet that hit wood end up with TH's blood/DNA on it but not her bone fragments? Forensic splatter expert said blood was planted in Rav4. Another Forensic expert states body not burned in the pit and the bones were moved. DNA Expert stated the evidence of the DNA on the key doesn't add up. These are just the latest evidence....they are in the affidavits. Kathleen Zellner has them in a PDF on her twitter. There is much to dislike about MC & many of the characters involved. It was clear that Len was not serving in his client's interest from the start, and regardless of the crime and their role, that is the not purpose of a defense attorney. It was also clear that MC was far from "fair and unbiased" in their approach and likely hoped from the start that Avery was guilty. It was also clear that the methods the police department took with the case, especially with Dassey, serve as a cautionary tale that one should "shut up and lawyer up" pretty damn quick! All of this is true, but that doesn't take away from the evidence that did point to him committing the crime. How easily we gloss over the body parts, blood, bullets and DNA that convicted him. I don't know enough about the lawsuit in particular, but what happens if MC is found guilty? Bankruptcy? It's the county coffers at stake, not Ken and Len's personal assets. Life would go on. I don't think your employers bank account getting pillaged is enough motivation to push everyone that would have to be involved to to conspire, murder and frame. Edited June 23, 2017 by TheElectricCompany Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) There is much to dislike about MC & many of the characters involved. It was clear that Len was not serving in his client's interest from the start, and regardless of the crime and their role, that is the not purpose of a defense attorney. It was also clear that MC was far from "fair and unbiased" in their approach and likely hoped from the start that Avery was guilty. It was also clear that the methods the police department took with the case, especially with Dassey, serve as a cautionary tale that one should "shut up and lawyer up" pretty damn quick! All of this is true, but that doesn't take away from the evidence that did point to him committing the crime. How easily we gloss over the body parts, blood, bullets and DNA that convicted him. I don't know enough about the lawsuit in particular, but what happens if MC is found guilty? Bankruptcy? It's the county coffers at stake, not Ken and Len's personal assets. Life would go on. I don't think your employers bank account getting pillaged is enough motivation to push everyone that would have to be involved to to conspire, murder and frame. Yep which is why I think he needs another trial and not just have his murder overturned like Dassey. Let's see if the evidence that put him away is actually legit or not. It MC is found guilty, I think, not 100% sure but think the key contributors can serve prison time. They also wouldn't pay out $36 million. There would be an agreed upon number. Lawyers always shoot very high and then come down. I don't think Hulk Hogan got the $250,000,000 for the exposed sex tape. Edited June 23, 2017 by Teeflebees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 If you post a picture of the guy I'll be able to tell you if he did it or not. I'll take let him swing for $20 and 'Bees inevitable explosion, Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted June 23, 2017 Author Share Posted June 23, 2017 I'll take let him swing for $20 and 'Bees inevitable explosion, Alex I'll take "Magic bullet and magic key" for $500 Alex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheElectricCompany Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Yep which is why I think he needs another trial and not just have his murder overturned like Dassey. Let's see if the evidence that put him away is actually legit or not. It MC is found guilty, I think, not 100% sure but think the key contributors can serve prison time. They also wouldn't pay out $36 million. There would be an agreed upon number. Lawyers always shoot very high and then come down. I don't think Hulk Hogan got the $250,000,000 for the exposed sex tape. Yes, was just going to say that, here is a link with lots of info on that: https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/46ihaa/the_36_million_lawsuit_fiscal_impact_on_manitowoc/#bottom-comments $1-18 punitive + $1-18 compensatory. $100 million in county assets, $80 million in operating budget, doesn't add up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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