FireChan Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 To put us up 12-3. First touchdown by... #30 Don Smith- a one yard plunge if I recall correctly. Then Stephen Baker Touchdown Maker made it 12-10 before the half, which was a huge momentum swinger. Not sure why I care to relive this. OK that's an argument. I didn't understand what you were saying was wrong. And BTMV was the one who laid out nice and neatly what the discussion here was so I was going off of his comment. Do you disagree with my contention that a higher percentage of black analysts are referred to as "articulate" when they are vs. white ones? Yeah, I added that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) Because people keep putting folks like Shannon Sharpe on television. Ha good point. I have always maintained that you would never see a white guy on TV as inarticulate as Shannon Sharpe. Does anyone remember when Tim Hardaway was on ESPN for a while? Yeah, I added that. I guess what I would say is this. Let's say you went to a gym and played basketball with a bunch of black guys one night. You weren't any better or worse than most of them but you held your own. Let's say after the game you went your own way and they went and got beers together. And over beers, a few of them said, "man, you know who can actually play? That white dude." Now if you heard this, you probably wouldn't be offended but you might think to yourself- 'of course I can actually play, I've been playing basketball since I was 5.' Not a big deal. But now that you are in those shoes, imagine being black and having white people talk about your brain that way. End discussion. Edited November 19, 2015 by metzelaars_lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) Ha good point. I have always maintained that you would never see a white guy on TV as inarticulate as Shannon Sharpe. Does anyone remember when Tim Hardaway was on ESPN for a while? I guess what I would say is this. Let's say you went to a gym and played basketball with a bunch of black guys one night. You weren't any better or worse than most of them but you held your own. Let's say after the game you went your own way and they went and got beers together. And over beers, a few of them said, "man, you know who can actually play? That white dude." Now if you heard this, you probably wouldn't be offended but you might think to yourself- 'of course I can actually play, I've been playing basketball since I was 5.' Not a big deal. But now that you are in those shoes, imagine being black and having white people talk about your brain that way. End thread. Yeah, because white people aren't generally as good at basketball as black people. It's an understandable comment. I wouldn't care in the slightest. To pretend the world isn't the way it is and that assumptions aren't going to be made based on the majority is sticking your head in the sand. Edited November 19, 2015 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) Yeah, because white people aren't generally as good at basketball as black people. It's an understandable comment. I wouldn't care in the slightest. To pretend the world isn't the way it is and that assumptions aren't going to be made based on the majority is sticking your head in the sand. But at this stage, there have been enough good white basketball players that it shouldn't surprise anyone to see a good one at their gym. Similarly, there have been enough good black analysts that it shouldn't be noteworthy when one of them speaks well on TV. Again though, I don't think this is a huge deal but I think you are sticking your head in the sand a bit if you can't fathom how a black person could be offended by this- even in the slightest. And please (not you but someone else)- do not chime in with the big, bad Fox News, tough guy, "wussification of America" take. I am not really offended myself, I am trying to have an intelligent discussion and I think we are. Edited November 19, 2015 by metzelaars_lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 But at this stage, there have been enough good white basketball players that it shouldn't surprise anyone to see a good one at their gym. Similarly, there have been enough good black analysts that it shouldn't be noteworthy when one of them speaks well on TV. Again though, I don't think this is a huge deal but I think you are sticking your head in the sand a bit if you can't fathom how a black person could be offended by this- even in the slightest. That's fine but play the odds, like we all do. There's a much greater chance I can play hockey than basketball. It's not a surprise, it just goes against what you'd immediately expect. You're comparing the articulate comment to black analysts, but that's not fair. That's a population that's selected for being articulate. Why don't you compare it to the rest of the players in the NFL? I could see how they'd be offended, but I'd disagree with their offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) Yeah, because white people aren't generally as good at basketball as black people. It's an understandable comment. I wouldn't care in the slightest. To pretend the world isn't the way it is and that assumptions aren't going to be made based on the majority is sticking your head in the sand. Yeah, because white people aren't generally as good at basketball as black people. It's an understandable comment. I wouldn't care in the slightest. To pretend the world isn't the way it is and that assumptions aren't going to be made based on the majority is sticking your head in the sand. Speak for yourself. This white guy has a sweet jumpshot and plays some solid defense. Edited November 19, 2015 by Ryan L Billz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Speak for yourself. This white guy has a sweet jumpshot and plays some solid defense. You're a spot-up guy Ryan. We all know you just sit in the corner waiting for the kick out pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) That's fine but play the odds, like we all do. There's a much greater chance I can play hockey than basketball. It's not a surprise, it just goes against what you'd immediately expect. You're comparing the articulate comment to black analysts, but that's not fair. That's a population that's selected for being articulate. Why don't you compare it to the rest of the players in the NFL? I could see how they'd be offended, but I'd disagree with their offense. If you want to contend that the average white guy in the US in 2015 is more articulate than the average black guy, then sure, it would be difficult to argue with that. But I think a) we've seen enough articulate black analysts through the years that it should no longer catch anyone off guard when they hear one and b) I would disagree with your contention that a regular, college-educated black guy sitting at home should somehow not get offended when they hear comments like this and should be able to say, "well enough of us are inarticulate so I guess I can see how someone would be surprised to hear an articulate one." Anyone who would still points out a black guy on TV as being "articulate" just reeks of someone who has never ventured outside of the suburbs and it just sounds naïve more than anything. Edited November 19, 2015 by metzelaars_lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 If you want to contend that the average white guy in the US in 2015 is more articulate than the average black guy, then sure, it would be difficult to argue with that. But I think a) we've seen enough articulate black analysts through the years that it should no longer catch anyone off guard when they hear one and b) I would disagree with your contention that a regular, college-educated black guy sitting at home should somehow not get offended when they hear comments like this and should be able to say, "well enough of us are inarticulate so I guess I can see how someone would be surprised to hear an articulate one." Anyone who would still points out a black guy on TV as being "articulate" just reeks of someone who has never ventured outside of the suburbs and it just sounds naïve more than anything. I don't see the logical connection between "surprised" and "pointing it out." Especially in this specific example, which was my other bone to pick. The commenter said "Very articulate man. Never understood why he never got into broadcasting." That's completely different from "woah, that black guy can speak!" "I never understood why Bruce didn't get into broadcasting [because it's not like he's not articulate]" is how I took the comment. Now you're comparing the averages of the entire US? Why not compare them to the population of the NFL? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDD Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Very articulate man. Never understood why he never got into broadcasting. GREAT PLAYER Great player? He was a player that comes along once a generation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 I don't see the logical connection between "surprised" and "pointing it out." Especially in this specific example, which was my other bone to pick. The commenter said "Very articulate man. Never understood why he never got into broadcasting." That's completely different from "woah, that black guy can speak!" "I never understood why Bruce didn't get into broadcasting [because it's not like he's not articulate]" is how I took the comment. Now you're comparing the averages of the entire US? Why not compare them to the population of the NFL? I think that's exactly what a lot of people think when they see/hear a comment like this. I don't know, it doesn't really matter. This is one of these where you got the easily offended PC types on one side and then you got the "I don't care if Michael Sam is purple, green or yellow, can he play football?" guys on the other side who act like they're the ones above the prejudice when it's so blatantly obvious that they are the ones who it's eating up inside- not that that's you- on the other side. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Jack Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 [This is an automated response] The thread is no longer contributing positively to the community and therefore the discussion has been closed. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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