Kelly the Dog Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Well done, sir. But if Hogan continues at this pace of getting better he will have 164 receptions this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 True, you never know I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 All he has done there is show that if you post Hogan's stats from last year into that list he ranks as the third best depth receiver the Bills have had in 14 years. I'd suggest that indicates he is worth keeping, especially on the vet minimum wouldn't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 All he has done there is show that if you post Hogan's stats from last year into that list he ranks as the third best depth receiver the Bills have had in 14 years. I'd suggest that indicates he is worth keeping, especially on the vet minimum wouldn't you? Not when you factor in how little talent was actually on those rosters. This is a new team with an NFL roster finally. The same could not be said of the past 15 year's worth of rosters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Not when you factor in how little talent was actually on those rosters. This is a new team with an NFL roster finally. The same could not be said of the past 15 year's worth of rosters. So in which case if we are not comparing rosters like for like what is the point of the comparison. You are now saying the comparison has no merit. A minute a go you were applauding it? Which is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Landing Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Not when you factor in how little talent was actually on those rosters. This is a new team with an NFL roster finally. The same could not be said of the past 15 year's worth of rosters. Well, if you really want to compare rosters, you should look at the specific elements of those rosters. Last season, we had a dreadful O-line, numerous good receivers, (including Watkins, Woods, Goodwin, Chandler, Freddy, Spiller, and even Gragg has some good productive catches), and, Orton. I would think that the combination of poor O-line, depth at receiver, and mediocrity ay QB would hamper a depth receiver's production? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 (edited) So in which case if we are not comparing rosters like for like what is the point of the comparison. You are now saying the comparison has no merit. A minute a go you were applauding it? Which is it? I interpreted it as he stacks up favorably to the 3rd receivers of the last decade plus (except Bobby Shaw) but does not stack up favorably to the 3rd WR today (Harvin). To make a different argument Charles Clay is already, arguably, the best TE that the Bills have ever had. That sounds crazy but he is actually right there. That is more of an indictment on the previous people that held the position than it is a compliment to Clay. Well, if you really want to compare rosters, you should look at the specific elements of those rosters. Last season, we had a dreadful O-line, numerous good receivers, (including Watkins, Woods, Goodwin, Chandler, Freddy, Spiller, and even Gragg has some good productive catches), and, Orton. I would think that the combination of poor O-line, depth at receiver, and mediocrity ay QB would hamper a depth receiver's production? That's a tough argument to make because I would bet on a per game basis Orton stacked up wih pretty much the best of the QB play since the last playoff game. You had a good half year from Bledsoe, the same goes for Fitz. They had their moments but in general they were in the Orton range. There were plenty of other guys that were worse. Edited August 26, 2015 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 So in which case if we are not comparing rosters like for like what is the point of the comparison. You are now saying the comparison has no merit. A minute a go you were applauding it? Which is it? The point of the list was even on those Bills' teams of old, the ones with hardly any legit NFL talent at the WR position, Hogan has produced far less than many of the guys we've all forgotten about -- guys who otherwise wouldn't have been on active game day rosters. Well, if you really want to compare rosters, you should look at the specific elements of those rosters. Last season, we had a dreadful O-line, numerous good receivers, (including Watkins, Woods, Goodwin, Chandler, Freddy, Spiller, and even Gragg has some good productive catches), and, Orton. I would think that the combination of poor O-line, depth at receiver, and mediocrity ay QB would hamper a depth receiver's production? Certainly it would. And yet last year's team was 9-7, a lot better than many of the teams on the previously mentioned list. Despite this, those WRs still produced more than Hogan despite playing on worse teams. It's not a clean apples to apples comparison, but it helps put Hogan's production in context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 I interpreted it as he stacks up favorably to the 3rd receivers of the last decade plus (except bobby Shaw) but does not stack up favorably to the 3rd WR today (Harvin). To make a different argument Charles Clay is already, arguably, the best TE that the Bills have ever had. That sounds crazy but he is actually right there. That is more of an indictment on the previous people that held the position than it is a compliment to Clay. People keep trying to make this Harvin vs Hogan. I will say again - that is irrelevant. Harvin is making this roster, he should make this roster it is right that he makes this roster. He is a lock. I wouldn't have signed him if it were up to me but once he arrived he was on the team. The only reason that I mention Harvin in this thread is that for me he isn't a complete receiver able to play the three positions. He is a gadget guy and a guy who you can do things close to the line of scrimmage with from the slot. For that reason I feel the team needs Hogan's security blanket versatility if one of the top 2 goes down. They are the only way in which the two are linked. You will not find me anywhere arguing Hogan is a better player than Harvin despite others trying to accuse me of making that argument on several occasions. The point of the list was even on those Bills' teams of old, the ones with hardly any legit NFL talent at the WR position, Hogan has produced far less than many of the guys we've all forgotten about -- guys who otherwise wouldn't have been on active game day rosters. Certainly it would. And yet last year's team was 9-7, a lot better than many of the teams on the previously mentioned list. Despite this, those WRs still produced more than Hogan despite playing on worse teams. It's not a clean apples to apples comparison, but it helps put Hogan's production in context. They didn't though did they? Hogan's first season seeing anything like serious action on offense he posted the third best numbers in that list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 People keep trying to make this Harvin vs Hogan. I will say again - that is irrelevant. Harvin is making this roster, he should make this roster it is right that he makes this roster. He is a lock. I wouldn't have signed him if it were up to me but once he arrived he was on the team. The only reason that I mention Harvin in this thread is that for me he isn't a complete receiver able to play the three positions. He is a gadget guy and a guy who you can do things close to the line of scrimmage with from the slot. For that reason I feel the team needs Hogan's security blanket versatility if one of the top 2 goes down. They are the only way in which the two are linked. You will not find me anywhere arguing Hogan is a better player than Harvin despite others trying to accuse me of making that argument on several occasions. They didn't though did they? Hogan's first season seeing anything like serious action on offense he posted the third best numbers in that list. But this is where you're wrong. Harvin can play all the WR positions -- as can Woods and Watkins. We've got three guys that can play anywhere on the field, that's enough redundancy. Hogan doesn't do anything as well as either of those three guys do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 But this is where you're wrong. Harvin can play all the WR positions -- as can Woods and Watkins. We've got three guys that can play anywhere on the field, that's enough redundancy. Hogan doesn't do anything as well as either of those three guys do. If I am wrong about Harvin (and I very firmly believe I will be proven correct) then the need for Hogan on this roster is less stark. NoSaint and I agreed that point about 5 pages back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Landing Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 The point of the list was even on those Bills' teams of old, the ones with hardly any legit NFL talent at the WR position, Hogan has produced far less than many of the guys we've all forgotten about -- guys who otherwise wouldn't have been on active game day rosters. Certainly it would. And yet last year's team was 9-7, a lot better than many of the teams on the previously mentioned list. Despite this, those WRs still produced more than Hogan despite playing on worse teams. It's not a clean apples to apples comparison, but it helps put Hogan's production in context. Largely on the defense's shoulders, no? Also, as I read those stats, Hogan 2014 is a close second in production to '03 Bobby Shaw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Just as an aside isn't it a nice change to be debating which NFL quality players will not be able to make the roster? It is a welcome change from the depth chart that included guys like Justin Jenkins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Just as an aside isn't it a nice change to be debating which NFL quality players will not be able to make the roster? It is a welcome change from the depth chart that included guys like Justin Jenkins. Amen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Just as an aside isn't it a nice change to be debating which NFL quality players will not be able to make the roster? It is a welcome change from the depth chart that included guys like Justin Jenkins. 100% agree... and as I said before if Hogan is cut I will be bummed out for a couple of days because I think we will look back and regret it but it is not going to be a catastrophic mistake by any means because at least he will be cut for a talented player.... Goodwin, Thompson and Davis can all play, even if they don't have the level of in game NFL production that Hogan does to this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Landing Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Just as an aside isn't it a nice change to be debating which NFL quality players will not be able to make the roster? It is a welcome change from the depth chart that included guys like Justin Jenkins. Or watching Scott Chandler lead the team in reception yardage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Well, if you really want to compare rosters, you should look at the specific elements of those rosters. Last season, we had a dreadful O-line, numerous good receivers, (including Watkins, Woods, Goodwin, Chandler, Freddy, Spiller, and even Gragg has some good productive catches), and, Orton. I would think that the combination of poor O-line, depth at receiver, and mediocrity ay QB would hamper a depth receiver's production? Not when a doofus coach runs Sammy as a decoy in an effort to have his game plan run through Hogan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rstencel Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 (edited) But this is where you're wrong. Harvin can play all the WR positions -- as can Woods and Watkins. We've got three guys that can play anywhere on the field, that's enough redundancy. Hogan doesn't do anything as well as either of those three guys do. Now that I cant agree with. He can play the slot, and in a pinch possession receiver roles, but cant see him manning the flanker role or primary receiver role with any team having a shot at a winning season at all. Which is why have a hard time comparing the receivers head to head on who should make the team. Goodwin is more of a flanker, as is Thompson IMO. While Harvin is more of a Split end or Slot receiver, not sure about Davis. So some of decision will be based more on depth needs than who is better receiver if is close. Edited August 26, 2015 by rstencel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dulles Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 The report from Chris Brown on bb.com says that Hogan wants to play against Detroit. To me, that indicates his uneasiness about his spot on the roster. At TC on Tuesday, he was working like a madman on the sideline. Seriously, I think he did as much work as the rest of the guys combined. He had an obvious limp, but he also was hanging out around the QB's and WR's when he could safely stand around. In between action, he'd play catch with the QBs. I really like his work ethic and the story. It'd be great if he could hang on, but obviously we need the best 53. It's nice to have some real depth at these positions. Looking at the historical stats was quite a depressing experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 @TyDunne New at the BN Blitz Blog: #Bills WR Chris Hogan not worried about his roster spot ... http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/08/27/wr-chris-hogan-isnt-worried-about-his-roster-spot/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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