NoSaint Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Just change the PI rule..Should not be a spot foul. Its by far the biggest game changer in sports. Also basically every defensive foul is a 1st down, change that. 5 yard illegal contact should not be an automatic 1st down.Another Devils advocate - but are you ok with more duke Williams shoves? Or more grabbing when beat by a fake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manther Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12352779/martin-mayhew-detroit-lions-proposes-penalties-fall-instant-replay-stipulations This just seems to make too much sense to not pass IMO. Even Fisher's argument against it is terrible: Jeff Fisher, who is the co-chairman of the competition committtee, was asked Friday at the scouting combine if there was a way to review some penalties and not others. "Right now everything is reviewable, except penalties," Fisher said. "It will be discussed, but there's -- something that's flagged, you have two standards and, to me, that's the biggest concern with it, is you have an on-the-field, full speed, bang-bang call made by the official -- we'll just say pass interference -- and now you're going to go to replay and you're going to go frame by frame by frame to determine whether it is or not. "I'm not sure we want to go [there] with our game right now." I mean what? The goal is to get it right. You go frame by frame to see if a guy crossed the goal line. Why wouldn't you go frame by frame to see if it was PI or not??? Hopefully this rule will be passed. They should be reviewable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Just change the PI rule..Should not be a spot foul. Its by far the biggest game changer in sports. Also basically every defensive foul is a 1st down, change that. 5 yard illegal contact should not be an automatic 1st down. Totally agree. Nothing worse than a 3rd-and-forever getting an automatic conversion because a ref thought he saw someone on the backside of the play grab a jersey briefly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsForever Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 Jeff Fisher just went full herp derp! With that said I would be happy with just being able to challenge pass interference and illegal contact in the secondary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 Another Devils advocate - but are you ok with more duke Williams shoves? Or more grabbing when beat by a fake? It wont happenn. No DB is thinking interference when the ball is near. Grabbing when beat bad wont change. They hhave years of college football data to review. Im trying to think of when and why a DB would use the rule to grab a WR. Only situation that makes sense is early in the route as the WR makes a move. Duke Williams was in position to make an INT. He wasnt beat. Totally agree. Nothing worse than a 3rd-and-forever getting an automatic conversion because a ref thought he saw someone on the backside of the play grab a jersey briefly. Its crazy. D holding is 5 yards also isnt it? So stupid. 3rd and 10, Ref says holding 33 defense, 5 yards and an automatic 1st down. Last thing I want is reviewed penalties though. I want to vomit just thinking of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 The game isn't slowed down enough already with all the challenges and reviews? This would be a horrible idea and would backfire on the NFL. I don't totally disagree, but this presumably wouldn't slow down the game any more than it currently is, since there would still only be 3 reviews per team. The only difference might be if the refs are allowed to review them in the last 2 minutes of each half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDIGGZ Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 Why not just have robot refs that never get the call wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 The NFL is making the refs job incredibly difficult with all these new rules put in over the past few years to produce more offense that its almost impossible for the refs to get it right. The NFL doesn't want this. So on 3rd and 10 say if a defender is beat 40 yards down the field he is simply going to drag the guy down purposely and take a 5 yard or 10 yard PI penalty(whatever you suggest the penalty be for PI) EVERY TIME. It won't work. Same goes for your illegal contact point. On a 3rd and 15 defenders will hold most of the time to see if they can get away with it because it won't be an automatic first down. The NFL wants offense. These rules would do the opposite. This parade of horribles didnt happen in college football when they had PI be a 10-yard penalty. I would also prefer this than what we have now--which is some inconsequential illegal contact nowhere near the play resulting in an automatic 1st down on 3rd and 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 (edited) Reviewing penalty's is a formula for disaster. The game would slow down significantly and they will likely still !@#$ up the call. They need to be more consistent on what an actual penalty is. There is too much inconsistency from crew to crew thanks to the complications of the 1000's of rules the league has. The NFL is making the refs job incredibly difficult with all these new rules put in over the past few years to produce more offense that its almost impossible for the refs to get it right. The NFL doesn't want this. So on 3rd and 10 say if a defender is beat 40 yards down the field he is simply going to drag the guy down purposely and take a 5 yard or 10 yard PI penalty(whatever you suggest the penalty be for PI) EVERY TIME. It won't work. Same goes for your illegal contact point. On a 3rd and 15 defenders will hold most of the time to see if they can get away with it because it won't be an automatic first down. The NFL wants offense. These rules would do the opposite. No they wouldn't. You know how hard it is to do this? For one thing you have to be close to grab someone. If you are really worried about it you could add a spot foul for that type of interference, which would be obvious. Because the dB would have to be super man and fly to grab the WR. The only time a dB would grab is early in the route as the WR just undresses the dB with a move and he knows he is beat. The foul would be 15 yards or less like in college. The type of grabbing you talk about rarely happens. The game is way too fast. You could compare it to offensive holding. An OL occasionally will intentionally grab a pass rusher to prevent a sack when they know they are beat. It's obvious, but rarely happens. Edited February 21, 2015 by TheTruthHurts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D521646 Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 I think in the final two minutes of the first and second half, we could test it in preseason. Tim- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 I think in the final two minutes of the first and second half, we could test it in preseason. Tim- But at those times, challenges are only allowed from the booth, not from the coaches. So that kind of eliminates a big part of the potential solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOKIE Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 id throw the flag to challenge a missed hold on every touchdown play scored. 100% of them. which is part of the trouble with this. You can only challenge so many calls, and you are risking losing a timeout.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beef Jerky Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 id throw the flag to challenge a missed hold on every touchdown play scored. 100% of them. which is part of the trouble with this. So you lose both challenges and two timeouts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overseas Bills Fan Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 But what will happen to all those phantom holds and the roughing-the-brady penalties that are called that always help the Patriots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 What are you talking about? You still have the same number of challenges... You don't really think they would add penalty review without increasing the number of challenges do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 You don't really think they would add penalty review without increasing the number of challenges do you? I do. The NFL is already keenly aware of how challenges slow the game down, and that the games are already longer than they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harv shitz Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 Just change the PI rule..Should not be a spot foul. Its by far the biggest game changer in sports. Also basically every defensive foul is a 1st down, change that. 5 yard illegal contact should not be an automatic 1st down. I have had a problem with this being an automatic first down for a long time. It's 3rd and 22, and a 5 yard penalty give them a 1st? This really needs addressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 (edited) This parade of horribles didnt happen in college football when they had PI be a 10-yard penalty. I would also prefer this than what we have now--which is some inconsequential illegal contact nowhere near the play resulting in an automatic 1st down on 3rd and 20. It's not inconsequential. Timing plays means that a second off due to a penalty leads to an incompletion, or not enough YAC. Even dump offs, anything can happen, see Ray Rice on 4th and 30. Any penalty that disrupts an offensive player should be an automatic first down. And while it's rare for someone to take a penalty on purpose, I think it's also rare that 3rd and 20s get converted because of a penalty. Sure, it happens, but it's not a plague on the game. Edited February 22, 2015 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 It's not inconsequential. Timing plays means that a second off due to a penalty leads to an incompletion, or not enough YAC. Even dump offs, anything can happen, see Ray Rice on 4th and 30. Any penalty that disrupts an offensive player should be an automatic first down. And while it's rare for someone to take a penalty on purpose, I think it's also rare that 3rd and 20s get converted because of a penalty. Sure, it happens, but it's not a plague on the game. We might have to agree to disagree on this one. what you said applies to a lot of penalties, and not all of them come with an automatic 1st down/loss of down. 5 yards and replay the down seems a lot more reasonable to me for illegal contact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 We might have to agree to disagree on this one. what you said applies to a lot of penalties, and not all of them come with an automatic 1st down/loss of down. 5 yards and replay the down seems a lot more reasonable to me for illegal contact. Are there any defensive penalties that have you repeat the down? Besides (before the play) offsides? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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