BillnutinHouston Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 I actually don't see Marrone starting EJ......for 1 reason........ If EJ goes out there and actually does play very well and the the Bills win (long shot, I know), everyone will be on Marrone for not playing him sooner, especially with just how terrible Orton has been over the last couple of months for the most part. The decision about who to start at QB in week 17 should NOT be a coach's decision, it should be the GM's decision. This week is not about winning vs. losing, but rather about managing personnel for next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garranimal Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 'Flaccid' threw 4 picks -including the game-decider by Kiko in the waning moments of a very close game. But don't let real facts get in the way of your EJ man-crush.. Manuel just standing on a gridiron is criminal. What is so incredible to me about this debate is neither EJ nor Orton has done anything that should surprise/excite/disappoint anyone. Both guys continue to be exactly who they have always been. EJ was never above average in college (what is his statement game?) was always the same exact guy he is now. Orton has always been a guy who starts out with a flash of "wow' (ie, better than you thought he would be) and then regresses below the mean to the point where Tebow is a significant upgrade on the same team. The Buffalo Bills have two very lousy QBs and despite all of the shouting and fantacizing about "higher ceiling", "potential" and "physical tools"....EJ is (and has always been) a pipe dream....and Orton is the guy who will always break your heart. Both suck....and as hard as it is to say.....we need to keep looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 I'm not suggesting EJ is "inept" but he's just not a productive QB. Our offense was fairly mediocre or below with Orton, the running game was downright miserable. But here's what the 2 guys have given you as Buffalo Bills Starters. Orton - 11 starts 300+ yard games = 3 250+ yard games = 3 **in those 6 games he had 10 TDs and 7 INTs EJ - 15 starts 300+ yard games = 0 250+ yard games = 1 ** in that 1 games he had 1 TD and 1 INT This is what Marrone is seeing folks. HE's going to play the QB that is more productive, period...end of story. Were they probably being more conservative coaching EJ in year 1? yes. Did they expect him to make a jump in year 2 and start being more productive? yes. Orton is not the answer here but I'm telling you, he plays much more like an NFL QB than EJ does. That being said, i see no harm in giving EJ the final start and seeing if he can let er rip and complete some balls downfield... or at least give the WRs a chance to fight for passes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 The crusade 'Flaccid' threw 4 picks -including the game-decider by Kiko in the waning moments of a very close game. But don't let real facts get in the way of your EJ man-crush.. Manuel just standing on a gridiron is criminal. Aaaaaaand the crusade is back even though the kid hasn't played a down. I'm not suggesting EJ is "inept" but he's just not a productive QB. Our offense was fairly mediocre or below with Orton, the running game was downright miserable. But here's what the 2 guys have given you as Buffalo Bills Starters. Orton - 11 starts 300+ yard games = 3 250+ yard games = 3 **in those 6 games he had 10 TDs and 7 INTs EJ - 15 starts 300+ yard games = 0 250+ yard games = 1 ** in that 1 games he had 1 TD and 1 INT Yet the running game is far better with Manuel in the mix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealityCheck Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 The crusade Aaaaaaand the crusade is back even though the kid hasn't played a down. Yet the running game is far better with Manuel in the mix. Why is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 What a waste of the season. As bad as EJ's 2 games were, Orton's last month was worse given his experience. We wasted a year to develop Kyle freakin' Orton. Even the Raiders develop Qbs better than us. I'm not suggesting EJ is "inept" but he's just not a productive QB. Our offense was fairly mediocre or below with Orton, the running game was downright miserable. But here's what the 2 guys have given you as Buffalo Bills Starters. Orton - 11 starts 300+ yard games = 3 250+ yard games = 3 **in those 6 games he had 10 TDs and 7 INTs EJ - 15 starts 300+ yard games = 0 250+ yard games = 1 ** in that 1 games he had 1 TD and 1 INT This is what Marrone is seeing folks. HE's going to play the QB that is more productive, period...end of story. Were they probably being more conservative coaching EJ in year 1? yes. Did they expect him to make a jump in year 2 and start being more productive? yes. Orton is not the answer here but I'm telling you, he plays much more like an NFL QB than EJ does. That being said, i see no harm in giving EJ the final start and seeing if he can let er rip and complete some balls downfield... or at least give the WRs a chance to fight for passes. Passing yards. The last crutch Orton supporters have. No one has more meaningless passing yards than Kyle Orton. It is painful to watch him try to lead an offense to 17 points. But at least he's young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 What a waste of the season. As bad as EJ's 2 games were, Orton's last month was worse given his experience. We wasted a year to develop Kyle freakin' Orton. Even the Raiders develop Qbs better than us. Passing yards. The last crutch Orton supporters have. No one has more meaningless passing yards than Kyle Orton. It is painful to watch him try to lead an offense to 17 points. But at least he's young. I don't disagree with you. I'm not touting Orton as the future here. On the flip side, even in garbage time EJ can't put up ANY numbers. I would take Carr in a heartbeat over either of those guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 I don't disagree with you. I'm not touting Orton as the future here. On the flip side, even in garbage time EJ can't put up ANY numbers. I would take Carr in a heartbeat over either of those guys. He had 296 against the #2 D in the NFL. He had 245 in a blowout against the Jets. Russell Wilson doesn't average a ton of passing yards a game. The marginal upgrade in passing yardage was not worth the benching of a young qb. Orton has never been an upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 He had 296 against the #2 D in the NFL. He had 245 in a blowout against the Jets. Russell Wilson doesn't average a ton of passing yards a game. The marginal upgrade in passing yardage was not worth the benching of a young qb. Orton has never been an upgrade. Totally irrelevant, but Wilson doesn't need to pass a lot because he has superior mental capacity to EJ. Yes, Orton has been a huge upgrade over EJ, and that should show you how bad EJ was that Orton is a huge upgrade. And no I don't think Orton has a future here, the QB of the immediate future isn't on the roster yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 He had 296 against the #2 D in the NFL. He had 245 in a blowout against the Jets. Russell Wilson doesn't average a ton of passing yards a game. The marginal upgrade in passing yardage was not worth the benching of a young qb. Orton has never been an upgrade. That Carolina win was nice, sure but well into the 4th EJ threw an INT and was also strip sacked. People conveniently forget that. Only our D and Ron Rivera's idiocy bailed em out. I'm sorry, i need a QB that can give the team more than what we've seen from EJ. Maybe EJ version 2.0 will be an upgrade. Who knows if he will get a chance here to prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Totally irrelevant, but Wilson doesn't need to pass a lot because he has superior mental capacity to EJ. Yes, Orton has been a huge upgrade over EJ, and that should show you how bad EJ was that Orton is a huge upgrade. And no I don't think Orton has a future here, the QB of the immediate future isn't on the roster yet. Translation: I called EJ a bust early so I need to be right. You're doing the Lord's work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Translation: I called EJ a bust early so I need to be right. You're doing the Lord's work. Not really, anybody with any kind of brain can see EJ is no good. There is no right or wrong about it, EJ is what he is and that is a bad QB. Just calling it like I see it. I'm not delusional like you and fabricate things to fit your argument. Sorry you are having a hard time accepting the fact that EJ has a whole ton of problems that are not easily corrected, maybe you can follow golf or tennis or something that takes a little less brain power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Why is that? EJ is at least a passable threat to run and to escape with his legs. Orton is a threat to look like deers in the headlights. EJ also is better at selling the play-action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellyto83TD Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 So if orton is a clown and EJ sucks way worse than orton and will never be better than orton...what does that make EJ... and assclown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Makes sense to play EJ. He is the future or he isn't and we aren't going to find out with him sitting on the sidelines. Made sense to keep Orton in while we were in the hunt but its evaluation time now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkAF43 Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 here's a question about Orton. next year his option is a players option to return. So if he returns, can the Bills cut him anyway? Or is there anything that prohibts that from being done? Not really, anybody with any kind of brain can see EJ is no good. There is no right or wrong about it, EJ is what he is and that is a bad QB. Just calling it like I see it. I'm not delusional like you and fabricate things to fit your argument. Sorry you are having a hard time accepting the fact that EJ has a whole ton of problems that are not easily corrected, maybe you can follow golf or tennis or something that takes a little less brain power. You know what? Every single time someone calls you out on your EJ bashing, you take a shot and change the subject, but when it's brought up that Orton isn't the answer you hurl an insult like a grade schooler and change the subject. The facts are there. Taking away the 2 Jets games and the garbage time yardage, there is little to no difference between the QB's. So IMO I go with the one with potential which is EJ. Orton is what he is, there's nothing new he's magically going to do to be better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Makes sense to play EJ. He is the future or he isn't and we aren't going to find out with him sitting on the sidelines. Made sense to keep Orton in while we were in the hunt but its evaluation time now. Isn't that what the 14 games he has started suggest? So in your eyes, one last game on the road vs New England is going to answer all the questions? Questions, IMO that have already been answered, if they weren't answered, why is Orton playing at all? Did you see Carr yesterday? What, 15 games into his 1st year, he looked the part, he appears to have "IT", you can't say that about EJ. He has yet to look like Carr, I don't think he will ever look like Carr. Oh by the way Carr's weapons are way inferior to what EJ has had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussellDopeland Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Isn't that what the 14 games he has started suggest? So in your eyes, one last game on the road vs New England is going to answer all the questions? Questions, IMO that have already been answered, if they weren't answered, why is Orton playing at all? Did you see Carr yesterday? What, 15 games into his 1st year, he looked the part, he appears to have "IT", you can't say that about EJ. He has yet to look like Carr, I don't think he will ever look like Carr. Oh by the way Carr's weapons are way inferior to what EJ has had. I love how you ignore EJ had a higher qbr as a rookie than Carr. But who need facts when you're crusading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 (edited) I love how you ignore EJ had a higher qbr as a rookie than Carr. But who need facts when you're crusading. I am certainly no QB evaluation expert. But I believe Carr managed to start all 15 games so far this season, got two quality wins plus beat the Bills who defensively at least are also a quality team, seemed to get better as the season went on, and was a 2nd round pick (meaning the Raiders got better value). Based on what I have seen so far, I would trade Manuel for Carr in a heartbeat. Edited December 22, 2014 by CodeMonkey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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