Bills officially sign QB Kevin Kolb

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I agree - the Nix bashing is just an overreaction. Yes, he did fail to draft a legitimate QB since his arrival, but how much of that was due to Gailey and or Ralph? I don't know the answer to that, but I would guess Nix trusted Gailey to either say, "I've got my guy", or, "I need some talent for competition". I actually have a feeling Gailey DIDN'T want any competition for Fitz, in case said competition made Gailey look like a stubborn fool - and once that contract was signed, forget it!

 

Nix has this draft to really change the perception that he's failed. If he comes away from this draft with a promising young QB, and answers at WR, ILB, G, and TE - he might just look like the GM that turned this franchise around.

 

The thing is, a GM should not take the Head Coach's word for it that "we're all set at QB with Fitz."

 

I agree that they should work together and be on the same page but to be talked out of a QB by the (now deposed) Head Coach is just Nix abdicating his responsibility.

 

As Gailey's boss, it's his job to say, "No, we're not set at QB with Fitz. We need to strengthen the position."

 

So I reject this particular defense of Nix.

[Sisyphean Bills]

The thing is, a GM should not take the Head Coach's word for it that "we're all set at QB with Fitz."

 

I agree that they should work together and be on the same page but to be talked out of a QB by the (now deposed) Head Coach is just Nix abdicating his responsibility.

 

As Gailey's boss, it's his job to say, "No, we're not set at QB with Fitz. We need to strengthen the position."

 

So I reject this particular defense of Nix.

 

A leader that lets other people do his thinking for him is called a follower.

[Beerball]

Can you back up this opinion with any facts? A link perhaps?

Care to back up your opinion with any facts? A link perhaps?

 

You have your OPINION, others have theirs.

[Storm Front]

Kolb looked pretty effective when he played in Philly's West Coast offense. I think Bills fans are going to be pleasantly surprised to see the great player that Arizona hoped they were getting.

[Thurmal34]

Care to back up your opinion with any facts? A link perhaps?

 

You have your OPINION, others have theirs.

 

Please point to where I stated anything as a fact.

 

WEO stated that no other GMs believed Nix's alleged "smokescreen" that Glenn was a guard. Sounds like he's certain of this. If so, I'm simply asking for proof of how he knows this information.

 

Now, if he had said "he doubts" other GMs believed Nix's smokescreen, there would have been no need to ask for any factual data to back up his OPINION.

 

See the difference?

Edited April 12, 2013 by Thurmal34

[Beerball]

Please point to where I stated anything as a fact.

 

WEO stated that no other GMs believed Nix's alleged "smokescreen" that Glenn was a guard. Sounds like he's certain of this. If so, I'm simply asking for proof of how he knows this information.

 

Now, if he had said "he doubts" other GMs believed Nix's smokescreen, there would have been no need to ask for any factual data to back up his OPINION.

 

See the difference?

Actually, no. Someone stated their belief that Glenn was available in round two because Nix called him a guard. That's someone's opinion.

 

Someone responded that they didn't think that Nix saying Glenn was a guard had diddly to do with him being available in the second. That's someone's opinion.

 

You asked for links to back up those facts that you also called opinions.

 

I asked if you wanted to back up your opinion with facts. (in other words I asked you to do what you asked someone else to do)

 

opinions are like opinions, everybody has lots of them.

[Thurmal34]

Actually, no. Someone stated their belief that Glenn was available in round two because Nix called him a guard. That's someone's opinion.

 

Someone responded that they didn't think that Nix saying Glenn was a guard had diddly to do with him being available in the second. That's someone's opinion.

 

Incorrect.

 

I'll save you the trouble of looking and post WEO's quote verbatim for you:

 

If you think that no other GM took Glenn as an LT simply because the great Buddy Nix called him a guard, you're nuts. It's delusional.

 

This comment sure sounds like he knows, for a fact, that no other GM took Glenn as an LT due to Nix's alleged smokescreen.

Edited April 12, 2013 by Thurmal34

[billsrcursed]

Incorrect.

 

I'll save you the trouble of looking and post WEO's quote verbatim for you:

 

If you think that no other GM took Glenn as an LT simply because the great Buddy Nix called him a guard, you're nuts. It's delusional.

 

This comment sure sounds like he knows, for a fact, that no other GM took Glenn as an LT due to Nix's alleged smokescreen.

 

"sounds like" and "is" are two different things.

 

One's an opinion.

[Cash]

So this is the point of the offseason where personnel discussion turns into word definition discussion, eh? Count me in! "Opinion" was fun, but I think it's time to move on to a new word. I suggest "salubrious".

 

In more Kolb-related discussion, is anyone else noticing the preponderance of Kolb-related pieces circulating since he signed? Here's a few:

 

Kevin Kolb dismisses idea he's a QB who gets sacked too much

Cards color man: “Kolb is a leader”

If Kevin Kolb tells you about new offense, he might have to kill you

Talk of up tempo style appeals to Kolb

Kolb has performed when given the chance

 

That last one, in particular, is a little disturbing. Why choose to build a blog post around Ron Wolfley's insane idea that Kolb is good -- but only when he has no competition for the job? Yikes. I don't think the Bills will abstain from drafting a QB, nor that they'll hand the job to Kolb scot-free, but it's still disturbing to see ideas like that on the Bills' website. And if you contrast the Kolb coverage with the Tavaris Jackson coverage, it's night and day. The official party line is that these 2 will fight it out for the starting QB position, and if a rookie QB is drafted, that guy will fight it out as well. But this strikes me as similar to the "3-way QB competition" that JP Losman won in 2006 over Kelly Holcomb and Craig Nall, or the one in 2010 that Trent Edwards won over Fitz and Brian Brohm.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

 

 

The thing is, a GM should not take the Head Coach's word for it that "we're all set at QB with Fitz."

 

I agree that they should work together and be on the same page but to be talked out of a QB by the (now deposed) Head Coach is just Nix abdicating his responsibility.

 

As Gailey's boss, it's his job to say, "No, we're not set at QB with Fitz. We need to strengthen the position."

 

So I reject this particular defense of Nix.

 

Thank you. I was getting tired of typing out this very obvious point.

[ajzepp]

That last one, in particular, is a little disturbing. Why choose to build a blog post around Ron Wolfley's insane idea that Kolb is good -- but only when he has no competition for the job? Yikes.

 

[transient]

 

 

Incorrect.

 

I'll save you the trouble of looking and post WEO's quote verbatim for you:

 

If you think that no other GM took Glenn as an LT simply because the great Buddy Nix called him a guard, you're nuts. It's delusional.

 

This comment sure sounds like he knows, for a fact, that no other GM took Glenn as an LT due to Nix's alleged smokescreen.

 

Here is my entrant into this blind man's coloring contest. There is nothing in this statement that proclaims it is fact. There is, however, the assertion that if the person who is being responded to doesn't see things in the same way as the poster, because in the opinion of the poster the point is so clear as to be self evident, then the person being responded to is delusional. Not so much statement of fact as blind courage of conviction.

 

Move along folks. Nothing to see here. Just some blind guys and a box of crayonz.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Here is my entrant into this blind man's coloring contest. There is nothing in this statement that proclaims it is fact. There is, however, the assertion that if the person who is being responded to doesn't see things in the same way as the poster, because in the opinion of the poster the point is so clear as to be self evident, then the person being responded to is delusional. Not so much statement of fact as blind courage of conviction.

 

Move along folks. Nothing to see here. Just some blind guys and a box of crayonz.

Agreed. It is a strongly dismissive statement of opinion. The opinion being that anybody that thinks all 31 other NFL GMs were duped by some statements made by Buddy Nix must be a fool. Since I find Buddy Nix rather transparent, I'd be inclined to agree with this deduction.

[yungmack]

Has Alzheimers hit TSW? Last year, Buddy repeatededly said the Bills saw Glenn as a left tackle. It was the usual collection of "draft experts" who fixated on "Glenn is a guard." I mean, Buddy was adamant about this; he said it over and over.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

The thing is, a GM should not take the Head Coach's word for it that "we're all set at QB with Fitz."

 

I agree that they should work together and be on the same page but to be talked out of a QB by the (now deposed) Head Coach is just Nix abdicating his responsibility.

 

As Gailey's boss, it's his job to say, "No, we're not set at QB with Fitz. We need to strengthen the position."

 

So I reject this particular defense of Nix.

 

Yep, germain points. Nix himself was quoted as saying "if you wait to get a QB until you need a QB, then you've waited too long and you've got a problem" or something of the sort. He failed to live up to his own maxim there.

 

I don't think Nix thought we were set at QB with Fitz. I do think he got out-foxed in the draft by other teams taking QB above where he'd valued them, and one can perhaps critique the QB evaluations. I think he tried to make up for it by bringing in VY and TJax, but the former was a forlorn hope (a Merriman type gesture) and the latter too little, too late.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Yep, germain points. Nix himself was quoted as saying "if you wait to get a QB until you need a QB, then you've waited too long and you've got a problem" or something of the sort. He failed to live up to his own maxim there.

 

I don't think Nix thought we were set at QB with Fitz. I do think he got out-foxed in the draft by other teams taking QB above where he'd valued them, and one can perhaps critique the QB evaluations. I think he tried to make up for it by bringing in VY and TJax, but the former was a forlorn hope (a Merriman type gesture) and the latter too little, too late.

 

Fair points.

 

But for whatever the reasons, taking Aaron Williams one pick ahead of Dalton and two picks ahead of Kaepernick AND trading up to take TJ Graham when many were expecting him to take Russell Wilson are the defining moments of Nix's tenure here.

 

It's almost like he was afraid to pull the trigger when the QB was right in his sights.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

So this is the point of the offseason where personnel discussion turns into word definition discussion, eh? Count me in! "Opinion" was fun, but I think it's time to move on to a new word. I suggest "salubrious".

 

"The Bills OTAs will be inspired by Marrone's salubrious addition of banners celebrating the glories of teams past and the goal of a Lombardi trophy"

 

In more Kolb-related discussion, is anyone else noticing the preponderance of Kolb-related pieces circulating since he signed? Here's a few:

 

Kevin Kolb dismisses idea he's a QB who gets sacked too much

Cards color man: “Kolb is a leader”

If Kevin Kolb tells you about new offense, he might have to kill you

Talk of up tempo style appeals to Kolb

 

 

Kolb has performed when given the chance

That last one, in particular, is a little disturbing. Why choose to build a blog post around Ron Wolfley's insane idea that Kolb is good -- but only when he has no competition for the job? Yikes. I don't think the Bills will abstain from drafting a QB, nor that they'll hand the job to Kolb scot-free, but it's still disturbing to see ideas like that on the Bills' website. And if you contrast the Kolb coverage with the Tavaris Jackson coverage, it's night and day. The official party line is that these 2 will fight it out for the starting QB position, and if a rookie QB is drafted, that guy will fight it out as well. But this strikes me as similar to the "3-way QB competition" that JP Losman won in 2006 over Kelly Holcomb and Craig Nall, or the one in 2010 that Trent Edwards won over Fitz and Brian Brohm.

 

That last link is not a salubrius theme for Bills fandom. "inability to compete at a high level when challenged for playing time"? The ability to step it up under pressure of all kinds is integral to the success of any professional athlete.

 

When has Kolb ever NOT had competition for the QB position such that "when he's had the opportunity to play, he's performed" was observed? He was clearly the favorite incumbant in AZ, and the writer describes him as "frying pan in the face" bad.

 

I'll go with the opinions of people like Greg Cosell, who appears to see some specific issues that have little or nothing to do with "challenge for playing time"

Linky one (Kolb with Iggles)

Linky two (Kolb after Cards)

Key extracts of Cosell's assessment of Kolb back with the Iggles:

(...)Overall, you see the same strengths and the same flaws in each game (...) what you see is a quarterback, that when he can play within the rhythm of the offense, and where he can plant and throw, he can be a very efficient player.

When his first read is there, given the route combination and the defense, he’s very, very good. But when that first read is not quite there and he’s forced to reset and look elsewhere, I think he struggles and I think he starts to play a little too fast. He starts to lose his pocket composure. He starts to lose his footwork and I think he starts to lose his downfield focus. You can tell in these types of situations that he’s not getting a clear picture when he has to reset. So, I think, overall, that’s Kolb at this point (in his career)

Key extracts of Cosell's assessment of Kolb after the Bills signing:

One, I think he has limited arm strength. He does not have a poor arm, but I think that he does not have a big arm. And two, I think he’s always struggled in a muddied pocket. He has a very difficult time when there are bodies around him, which was GREATLY exacerbated in Arizona, and which might not be as big an issue in Buffalo. Now, he does have that problem — and there will always be plays in which that’s an issue. But hopefully in Buffalo they can control that better, and it won’t become the kind of problem that prevents him from playing.

 

OK, Sports Fans. I don't read anything there about competition being a problem for Kolb or about him playing really well without it. I read that his level of play depends upon taking 3 to 5 step drops and having time to plant and throw, with questions about his ability to reset and progress through his reads if he has to, and questions about his pocket composure and "field awareness".

 

If you read the game by game analysis in the first link, a consistent theme is "mechanics break down under pressure" and "moved away from the pocket even with no apparent reason..moved even though there were no defenders or bodies around him" "too concerned with pass protection and losing his downfield focus". This is with the Iggles, folks, not the Arizona Turnstyle Line. And it's from two guys with access to coach's tape, not a fan opining from televised coverage.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Fair points.

But for whatever the reasons, taking Aaron Williams one pick ahead of Dalton and two picks ahead of Kaepernick AND trading up to take TJ Graham when many were expecting him to take Russell Wilson are the defining moments of Nix's tenure here.

It's almost like he was afraid to pull the trigger when the QB was right in his sights.

 

Agree on the "defining moments of Nix's tenure here". What I meant by "one can critique the QB evaluations" is, I don't think it was fear; I think it was a disconnect between the Bill's QB valuation and the overall valuation of the position in the league at this time.

 

My unsupported by inside info thoughts:

2010: don't think the Bills liked anyone available after Bradford

2011: I think the Bills liked Dalton and Kaepernick, but had 3rd round grades on them

2012: I think the Bills liked Wilson and Cousins, but had 4th round grades on them. I think they intended to draft Cousins after Wilson went off the board in the 3rd, and were taken aback when WAS picked him 3 picks ahead of them.

 

I base the overall picture on comments in Fall 2012 by Nix to the effect that if there's a guy you like in the 3rd, you better take him in the 2nd, if there's a guy that you like in the 2nd you better take him in the 1st. It had the heartfelt sound of a guy who's been skunked in that fashion. The identity of the specific QB the Bills may have favored is based on pre-draft comments, which could of course be smokescreen.

 

I base the comments about criticizing the evaluation on Williams > Dalton and Graham > Wilson, just as you say.

 

The real question is whether and how Nix will learn from experience - will he over-react or will this draft be more of the same-ol?

[Sisyphean Bills]

...

If you read the game by game analysis in the first link, a consistent theme is "mechanics break down under pressure" and "moved away from the pocket even with no apparent reason..moved even though there were no defenders or bodies around him" "too concerned with pass protection and losing his downfield focus". This is with the Iggles, folks, not the Arizona Turnstyle Line. And it's from two guys with access to coach's tape, not a fan opining from televised coverage.

 

Sounds like they are saying he looks like a guy that came up in a single-read college spread offense. Which is precisely the case and where he had his greatest levels of sustained success.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Sounds like they are saying he looks like a guy that came up in a single-read college spread offense. Which is precisely the case and where he had his greatest levels of sustained success.

 

Take a look at the linkys and judge for yourself. Overall, Cosell and Caplan seemed to be saying his mental grasp of the game and understanding of the offense was very good, but he was gun-shy under pressure, worried about where the bodies were coming from instead of looking downfield. I'm not a big college football fan, is that characteristic of spread offense guys?