A Few Thoughts About The Game

[Bill from NYC]

1) Stevie Jonson continues to impress. Possession receivers need to hold the football (duh) and he seems to be concentrating.

 

2) Fred Jackson is a good football player, but something was wrong. He was having a tough time getting started imo. It almost looked as if he had the wrong shoes on. He was fine as always when he picked up a head of steam. Not sure what was happening back there.

 

3) Parrish gave us another good performance.

 

4) Kelsay was so bad out there I didn't know who to feel sorry for, him or Bills fans. Forget about getting juked by Cassell, he was absolutely chrushed by a tight end on a running play to the left side. You can see wide open gaps as he is taken out of play after play. His new contract will just never add up.

 

5) I am not into stats so much, but I am guessing that the Bills have a decent record in games where Poz is on the field and plays well. Lori? He looked like a professional football player out there, and this is a rare sight wrt the Bills linebackers.

 

6) Bell didn't play as well as he did against the Ravens, but he wasn't the problem. These guys on the OL are young, and imo more running plays would build their confidence, as well as keep the defense off the field.

 

7) Whitner had a nice tackle, but he once again was not a factor in the game. Btw, I thought I saw him playing on special teams. Did anyone else see this or was I hallucenating?

 

8) Fitz is a gamer, and really a good fit for this type of team. I wish he would take off on running plays just a second sooner. It seems that he hesitates just a little too much, and this prevents larger gains. One thing about Fitz, he DOES belong in this league, which is big praise for a Bills QB.

 

9) Spiller looked ok in his very limited action. It isn't his fault that the Bills drafted a part time player at #9. What I fail to understand is why they don't line him up more at RB and simply hand him the football. His total yards per game rushing and receiving are simply unacceptable. Prediction: Soon he will break a couple. This will make his stats look better and fans will think that he wasn't a bad pick.

 

10) The DL looked better than usual. Kyle Williams really is a workhorse. I do not believe for one second that he weighs 305, or whatever it is they claim. He is very small to play nose, and there is just so little behind him. Still, the guy makes plays.....somehow. Stroud looked good too on some plays.

 

11) The misery continues, but at least thay are out there trying to win. They do owe us this much.

 

12) GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BuffaloWings]

1000% agree with you on Steve Johnson and Kelsay, but not close on Spiller.

 

Yes, I do think they're not using him enough yet, but while he didn't show it too much yesterday, he's still a dynamic player. I think it's only a matter of time before he gets the first team reps.

[akm0404]

Yes, I do think they're not using him enough yet, but while he didn't show it too much yesterday, he's still a dynamic player. I think it's only a matter of time before he gets the first team reps.

 

This seems to be a common attitude among fans, and it gets brought up time after time when someone says that Spiller is a bust, or a situational 10-touch a game gimmick back.

 

Why do you think it will only be a matter of time before he gets first team reps? I've heard every excuse in the book for why the team won't let him touch the ball. A liability in blitz pickups, saving wear on his slight frame, etc.

 

What is going to change in the next couple weeks in that regard? Who's fault is it that our single-digit first round pick can't sniff the field? If it is certain that he will start getting more reps, why now? The whole thing is insanely confusing and frustrating, especially in light of the very limited window that Spiller's type of shifty, explosive back has in the NFL.

[JohnC]

 

 

11) The misery continues, but at least thay are out there trying to win. They do owe us this much.

 

12) GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

The general analysis is that the team lacks talent. Where it is glaringly evident is along the lines. We simply are too weak on both sides of the ball. We need OTs and the DL and LBing group have to be reconstituted. Unless a team has a franchise qb it will never be a serious team. We don't have a franchise qb on the roster. Fitz is an excellent backup, nothing more.

 

The baron owner has made many mistakes during his tenure. The two biggest mistakes were the firing of Polian (historically bad) and the hiring of Levy (odd decision) as a GM. The three years under Levy/Brandon set this franchise back by years. The Nix regime is desperately trying to clean out the mess of the last regime. It is going to take years to rework this very flawed roster.

[akm0404]

The Nix regime is desperately trying to clean out the mess of the last regime. It is going to take years to rework this very flawed roster.

 

Step one was apparently to lock up your stud OLB Chris Kelsay long-term.

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Good stuff Bill as usual.

 

Spiller's stat line would've looked much more impressive if fitz hadn't overthrown him on a wide open look.

 

Chris Johnson is a similarly built back and remember he split carries with Lendale his rookie year.

[akm0404]

Chris Johnson is a similarly built back and remember he split carries with Lendale his rookie year.

 

LOL @comparing Spiller to Chris Johnson.

 

In Johnson's rookie year (splitting carries), he rushed 251 times for 1,228 yards with a 4.9 yard per carry average and 9 rushing touchdowns.

 

In Spiller's rookie year, he has rushed 32 times for 130 yards with a 4.1 yard per carry average and 0 rushing touchdowns.

 

Projecting to a full season, that'd put Spiller at 72 carries for 296 yards and 0 touchdowns.

 

Great comparison between Spiller and Johnson

Edited November 1, 2010 by akm0404

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Only comparing their frames not their production kid pump your breaks and take a breath. White did get carries and a majority of the goalline work.

[akm0404]

Only comparing their frames not their production kid pump your breaks and take a breath. White did get carries and a majority of the goalline work.

 

Their "frames" are about the only thing that C.J. Spiller and Chris Johnson have in common. The numbers don't lie.

[jonramz]

Fitz is an average NFL QB, which is good enough for us this season.... Kelsey is a disaster... and Kyle Williams is a stud, but he is a 4-3 DT or 3-4 DE, not a 3-4 DT

 

I would love to see Edwards-Troupe-Williams as the 3 man line... unfortunately it really doesn't matter b/c our LB's are that terrible

[Bill from NYC]

1000% agree with you on Steve Johnson and Kelsay, but not close on Spiller.

 

Yes, I do think they're not using him enough yet, but while he didn't show it too much yesterday, he's still a dynamic player. I think it's only a matter of time before he gets the first team reps.

 

When the Bills spent a #9 on Spiller, many compared him to Barry Sanders. I have no problem with this; comparisons are a fun thing on message boards.

That said I saw a lot of Sanders. He was often held to small gains and even thrown for losses before he broke a big one. My point is that Spiller needs more carries for him to produce what he was supposedly drated to do. That was to score touchdowns and "make our line better," right? Mr. Wilson was happy about the "excitement" he would add.

 

It's early, but none of the above is happening.

[JohnC]

Step one was apparently to lock up your stud OLB Chris Kelsay long-term.

 

A lot of people are getting stressed over the Kelsay signing. The way contracts are structured the deal is not going to be much of a cap factor. The Bills are years away from being a serious team. You can't let everyone go, all at once, who you don't have in your long term plans.

 

Edwards, Lynch, Hardy, Mitchell were all let go. There is little doubt that Maybin and McCargo will be dispatched. The roster will be dramatically overhauled over the next few years. Keeping a respected but limited player on the roster for the immediate future does not inhibit the rebuilding process.

[Zulu Cthulhu]

Their "frames" are about the only thing that C.J. Spiller and Chris Johnson have in common. The numbers don't lie.

 

I agree it's an extreme example given that all tennessee did in 08 was run the ball. The bills obviously throw the ball much more than the titans did that year.

 

You're also right that the numbers do not lie. White had 200 carries himself. I would call that spitting carries.

 

Not sure why the word frames required quotation marks.

[Mr. WEO]

1) Stevie Jonson continues to impress. Possession receivers need to hold the football (duh) and he seems to be concentrating.

 

2) Fred Jackson is a good football player, but something was wrong. He was having a tough time getting started imo. It almost looked as if he had the wrong shoes on. He was fine as always when he picked up a head of steam. Not sure what was happening back there.

 

3) Parrish gave us another good performance.

 

4) Kelsay was so bad out there I didn't know who to feel sorry for, him or Bills fans. Forget about getting juked by Cassell, he was absolutely chrushed by a tight end on a running play to the left side. You can see wide open gaps as he is taken out of play after play. His new contract will just never add up.

 

5) I am not into stats so much, but I am guessing that the Bills have a decent record in games where Poz is on the field and plays well. Lori? He looked like a professional football player out there, and this is a rare sight wrt the Bills linebackers.

 

6) Bell didn't play as well as he did against the Ravens, but he wasn't the problem. These guys on the OL are young, and imo more running plays would build their confidence, as well as keep the defense off the field.

 

7) Whitner had a nice tackle, but he once again was not a factor in the game. Btw, I thought I saw him playing on special teams. Did anyone else see this or was I hallucenating?

 

8) Fitz is a gamer, and really a good fit for this type of team. I wish he would take off on running plays just a second sooner. It seems that he hesitates just a little too much, and this prevents larger gains. One thing about Fitz, he DOES belong in this league, which is big praise for a Bills QB.

 

9) Spiller looked ok in his very limited action. It isn't his fault that the Bills drafted a part time player at #9. What I fail to understand is why they don't line him up more at RB and simply hand him the football. His total yards per game rushing and receiving are simply unacceptable. Prediction: Soon he will break a couple. This will make his stats look better and fans will think that he wasn't a bad pick.

 

10) The DL looked better than usual. Kyle Williams really is a workhorse. I do not believe for one second that he weighs 305, or whatever it is they claim. He is very small to play nose, and there is just so little behind him. Still, the guy makes plays.....somehow. Stroud looked good too on some plays.

 

11) The misery continues, but at least thay are out there trying to win. They do owe us this much.

 

12) GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Bills are 18-30 with pos starting. 4-15 in the past 2 seasons (thus far).

 

Johnson looks great.

 

Spiller didn't look like he was at full speed on that TD miss by Fitz. Those aren't routes for this kid to be running.

 

Kelsay's extension was a boneheaded move. Where are the guys who said it "made sense"?

 

Fitz had one bad throw, but I believe we got the ball back, marched downfield and our kicker nailed a 53 yarder. He couldn't do it twice in a row, though.

[1billsfan]

1) Stevie Jonson continues to impress. Possession receivers need to hold the football (duh) and he seems to be concentrating.

 

2) Fred Jackson is a good football player, but something was wrong. He was having a tough time getting started imo. It almost looked as if he had the wrong shoes on. He was fine as always when he picked up a head of steam. Not sure what was happening back there.

 

3) Parrish gave us another good performance.

 

4) Kelsay was so bad out there I didn't know who to feel sorry for, him or Bills fans. Forget about getting juked by Cassell, he was absolutely chrushed by a tight end on a running play to the left side. You can see wide open gaps as he is taken out of play after play. His new contract will just never add up.

 

5) I am not into stats so much, but I am guessing that the Bills have a decent record in games where Poz is on the field and plays well. Lori? He looked like a professional football player out there, and this is a rare sight wrt the Bills linebackers.

 

6) Bell didn't play as well as he did against the Ravens, but he wasn't the problem. These guys on the OL are young, and imo more running plays would build their confidence, as well as keep the defense off the field.

 

7) Whitner had a nice tackle, but he once again was not a factor in the game. Btw, I thought I saw him playing on special teams. Did anyone else see this or was I hallucenating?

 

8) Fitz is a gamer, and really a good fit for this type of team. I wish he would take off on running plays just a second sooner. It seems that he hesitates just a little too much, and this prevents larger gains. One thing about Fitz, he DOES belong in this league, which is big praise for a Bills QB.

 

9) Spiller looked ok in his very limited action. It isn't his fault that the Bills drafted a part time player at #9. What I fail to understand is why they don't line him up more at RB and simply hand him the football. His total yards per game rushing and receiving are simply unacceptable. Prediction: Soon he will break a couple. This will make his stats look better and fans will think that he wasn't a bad pick.

 

10) The DL looked better than usual. Kyle Williams really is a workhorse. I do not believe for one second that he weighs 305, or whatever it is they claim. He is very small to play nose, and there is just so little behind him. Still, the guy makes plays.....somehow. Stroud looked good too on some plays.

 

11) The misery continues, but at least thay are out there trying to win. They do owe us this much.

 

12) GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

This is not about you but these are my thoughts...

 

I think Fred Jackson sucked yesterday. For the season he has a 4 YPC average which is close to the bottom for starting runningbacks. I'm tired of reading the dumb fans here dumping on Fitzpatrick when he was the entire offense on the road at one of the toughest places to play in the NFL. Was he great? No. Was he good enough to get the win at KC? The answer is obviously yes were it not for the second FG miss. The running game sucked (see Fred Jackson) which is why Gailey decided not to call runs at the end. Fitzpatrick deserves way better than he's getting here today.

[akm0404]

I agree it's an extreme example given that all tennessee did in 08 was run the ball. The bills obviously throw the ball much more than the titans did that year.

 

You're also right that the numbers do not lie. White had 200 carries himself. I would call that spitting carries.

 

Not sure why the word frames required quotation marks.

 

I'm not even sure what you are arguing - you used Chris Johnson's rookie season to compare with C.J. Spiller's rookie season in order to defend Spiller. My rookie NFL rushing performance is much closer to C.J. Spiller's than Spiller's is close to Johnson's.

 

But I guess if they have the same "frame", he'll end up being as good?

[Zulu Cthulhu]

I'm not even sure what you are arguing - you used Chris Johnson's rookie season to compare with C.J. Spiller's rookie season in order to defend Spiller. My rookie NFL rushing performance is much closer to C.J. Spiller's than Spiller's is close to Johnson's.

 

But I guess if they have the same "frame", he'll end up being as good?

 

Bill was wondering in the OP why Spiller is being used basically as a part-time player despite his being such a high draft pick. I was just replying to that, giving CJ / White splitting time as an example - never said anything about performance. You just assumed that. CJ (and White, for that matter) obviously were both better statistically than spiller and/or jackson could hope to be this year. And that's to be expected since the titans never threw the ball and ther backs were running behind a beast offensive line.

[Beerball]

The Bills are 18-30 with pos starting. 4-15 in the past 2 seasons (thus far).

He isn't an impact player and he never will be one. I don't think I've ever seen a MLB sack a QB with more gentleness that what Cassel received yesterday.

 

Kelsay's extension was a boneheaded move. Where are the guys who said it "made sense"?

They are now saying that it doesn't have any negative impact on the team, cap hit yadda yadda yadda. He sucks and he shouldn't have a place on this or any team.

Edited November 1, 2010 by Beerball

[Dan]

When the Bills spent a #9 on Spiller, many compared him to Barry Sanders. I have no problem with this; comparisons are a fun thing on message boards.

That said I saw a lot of Sanders. He was often held to small gains and even thrown for losses before he broke a big one. My point is that Spiller needs more carries for him to produce what he was supposedly drated to do. That was to score touchdowns and "make our line better," right? Mr. Wilson was happy about the "excitement" he would add.

 

It's early, but none of the above is happening.

I agree and think ou could put Jackson in that same boat. The one thing I don't get about Gailey is his insistence on this spread 'em out passing attack. We have a young OL; they're still very much learning their positions; we have a relatively inexperienced QB running around behind that OL; what do you do? You go empty back field, telling the entire defense that it's a pass, and put the pressure of the entire game on one of your weakest units?

 

Gailey needs to run the ball more. That's just all there is too it. I'm not saying run all the time, just more. Then use some play action off the run. Without looking it up, it seems we're averaging about 2:1 pass to run. IMO, that ratio should be turned around or at the very least evened out.

 

I know he talks about his packages. He talks about playing from behind. He wants to get his match ups. But, those are all just excuses. He's just too quick to abandon the run. Again, I'm not saying run all the time, but he's got to even out the play calling. And for Heaven's sake... when it's under a minute to go in a tie game and you're looking at a 53 yard FG; run the ball a couple of times to get an extra 5 or 6 yards; then try the 3rd down pass.

[1billsfan]

I agree and think ou could put Jackson in that same boat. The one thing I don't get about Gailey is his insistence on this spread 'em out passing attack. We have a young OL; they're still very much learning their positions; we have a relatively inexperienced QB running around behind that OL; what do you do? You go empty back field, telling the entire defense that it's a pass, and put the pressure of the entire game on one of your weakest units?

 

Gailey needs to run the ball more. That's just all there is too it. I'm not saying run all the time, just more. Then use some play action off the run. Without looking it up, it seems we're averaging about 2:1 pass to run. IMO, that ratio should be turned around or at the very least evened out.

 

I know he talks about his packages. He talks about playing from behind. He wants to get his match ups. But, those are all just excuses. He's just too quick to abandon the run. Again, I'm not saying run all the time, but he's got to even out the play calling. And for Heaven's sake... when it's under a minute to go in a tie game and you're looking at a 53 yard FG; run the ball a couple of times to get an extra 5 or 6 yards; then try the 3rd down pass.

 

 

Fred Jackson sucked yesterday. He got the ball 20 times and only managed 64 yards. That sucks. It amazes me that Jackson is heralded as this great performer around here when his average rush per carry is towards the bottom of the league. It's like I watched a different game than everyone else. Gailey had the win were it not for that second FG miss. Let's start blaming the guys that should be blamed. Jackson's inability to gain any significant yardage led to Gailey trusting Fitzpatrick and the passing game more than the guy ramming himself into the line.