leh-nerd skin-erd

“Mesa” candidates? 🌵🤔

Frankish is knuckles deep into a conspiracy here. Apparently, the guy responsible for steering the federal government through the development of vaccines secretly aligns with the liberal d anti-vax crowd by being the president….who steered the federal government through the development of the vaccine they are “anti” about. The genius of the plan really shows when he took the vaccine and the follow up booster, employing the “dog whistle” technique wherein getting the jab really sends the message that you’re against it. To be fair to @The Frankish Reich here, if one is determined to buy into another Trump conspiracy ploy, this one is good as urine and Russian hookers was already taken.

You must be into the egg nogg early today, Frankish. As of 12/24/21 at 1:11pm, we have a number of vaccines to treat COVID available. Citizens are free to be vaccinated or not, unless of course you work in a super-spreader environment currently defined by your boi Joe as "working for a big company or in some cases, government.". Donald Trump was vaccinated in January, and was President when the vaccine was being developed. He spoke about it frequently, in fact, did so as your Biden/Harris team spread misinformation to their supporters about the trustworthiness of the vaccine. He held many press conferences to keep the public informed on the progress. Interestingly, if polls are to be believed, a large portion of the anti-vax folks you mentioned historically voted democrat , and the message point delivered likely caused massive delays in seeking out the virus for those only vax-hesitant. So, it seems quite logical that anti-vaxxers you've described would have jumped off the Trump train long, long ago when his admin worked with the pharmaceutical industry to develop the vax to begin with. Given that he was previously vaccinated, it seems not at all unusual that he would seek out the booster shot. Interestingly, one of the major problems seems to be that a majority of people previously vaccinated aren't rushing out to get boosted quite yet: https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucejapsen/2021/12/02/poll-significant-uptake-in-booster-shots-in-us-as-omicron-looms/?sh=40a9a913e692 Now, the cool part is that with DJT continuing in the pro-vax/pro-booster camp, the mixed messaging delivered by team Biden can be marginalized. You should be happy about this. And holy crap, look at this article. On the watch of the Biden admin, turns out the books may have been cooked and we really cannot trust the number of people who got only one of the required two shot cocktail: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-12-18/vaccine-data-gaps-point-to-millions-more-in-u-s-who-lack-shots I really think if folks followed DJT's lead, we really would be in a much, much better place. Instead, we've got some people actually supporting the spread of disinformation by current leadership by referring to it as good old 'political gamesmanship", in spite of the spiking numbers of infected and dying during a pandemic. Some people, huh? However, when a solution is delivered table ready to a team lead by a person in the full throes of a steep cognitive decline, things are likely to get off track quickly. You probably should have known that. Anyway--you never responded on what you meant by suggesting that the protests last summer "in and of themselves" weren't problematic with respect to COVID. I feel like you got cold feet when asked to explain.

If the health and safety of the payers was the primary issue, the NFL would suspend or cancel the season. It's hard to imagine a more fruitful cocktail for spreading the virus than an NFL game with fans in attendance. Since that doesn't seem likely to occur, the league will field criticism regardless of what direction it goes in.

I figured, but where’s the fun in that?

Just went to Greenville for a long weekend in September, shot down to Clemson for a game as my niece and nephew go there. Greenville is cool for sure—lots to do. My understanding is it’s one of the fastest growing cities of some category in the country. Very nice town.

Have a Huppy Muppy Christmas, Mup! I’m a simple man. The first album I bought was by LS, around the time of the plane crash. The band has always held a special place in my heart as a result (music,friends, spending the Courier Express delivery money I had saved on the album), and I always liked the “pronounced leh-nerd skin-erd” on the album cover. To be completely honest by the time I realized that whiskey bottles, a handful of ludes, and a blow for my nose were not in my future, I was already in! Btw, I had to laugh at your first post here. Your friend Luppy, I’ve been filling in a number of four letter words to replace the asterisks, and any way I slice it she had a tough slug. 🤔

I’m confused, possibly because I have three children and am also aged 60. Are you saying it’s a Yes…you’re going to help? You sound conflicted.

Interesting, and spot on. When Biden came up with 100+ employer group jamborama plan, it was obvious he was avoiding any potential issues with folks dependent on the govt having to vaccinate. It’s yet another reason people are distrustful of leadership and see a disconnect about what is said v what is actually done. It’s like his management team looked at every crappy product roll out from The Edsel to New Coke and followed that exact plan for his Pandemic Brand Management platform.

Credit to @ALF and others here. They were predicting and advocating for the marginalization of certain members of society a few months back.

Oh damn. That pesky led v lead thing again. Perfection is elusive, and I'll learn from this. Disclaimer: I struggle to consistently spell separate and satellite correctly, bureaucrat always trips me up, and I frequently spell kayak backwards. What did you mean by "...in and of themselves" as it related to the protests last year?

That is exactly what I have said repeatedly. When did you first come to this country? Your command of the language is quite good.

Dude, seriously, they always say "If you can only help one child....". All I ask is it be mine. Thank you in advance.

Friend, my original post dealt with trust--nothing more, noting less. From there, you painted me as a conspiracy theorist (false), used the term "Big Pharma" then thanked me for not using it (what's that all about again?), and--apparently in your zeal to keep politics out of it, took a shot at DJT for kinda maybe getting COVID at the ACB event which you've insisted wasn't about ACB. You jump to a lot of conclusions, and so far you've not hit on one. If my contention was that we were told 'erroneously', I would have used that very word. The way I see it is really pretty simple: We were told that certain behaviors would result in the deaths of millions, and that failure to comply with lawful guidelines and recommended practices could/would result in your arrest and marked you as a malcontent in the eyes of society. However, when people violated said protocols in massive numbers, they were encouraged to continue doing so and in many cases, political leaders marched with them. Even Dr Fauci, he of "Don't have dinner with grandma and two of your three siblings!" offered a very tepid and impotent message to those folks, in those groups, who violated guidelines and protocols said to ensure the survival of the people; So, when I look consider the two bullet points above, I can only come up with three logical scenarios to address the disconnect: Fauci and/or our political leadership was totally incompetent and thus, should not be trusted without question in the future; Fauci and/or our political leadership was not being truthful, nor transparent, and as a result, were willing to let things play out however they played out, and thus should not be trusted without question in the future; Fauci and/or our political leadership knew the risk associated with these mass gatherings, knew the virus would be transmitted amongst and beyond attendees, and simply let it happen, and thus should not be trusted without question in the future. I noticed you wordsmithed again, btw. This was the throwaway line you included this time: The outdoor protests, it turned out, weren't superspreader events in and of themselves. Putting aside for a second that the prevailing scientific wisdom at the time directly contradicted this and there was no political or scientific appeal to the protestors to just hold off until COVID was under control I'm interested in what you meant by "in and of themselves"? Here's a Frankish style spoiler--I'll tell you what I think you meant. I think what you meant was in retrospect, people outside and socially distanced and masked in a purely outdoor setting posed relatively low risk of infection transmission, and you simply don't want to address that virtually every other action leading up to actually appearing at the event posed a very high risk and likely lead to untold numbers of infected and dying. I completely agree on the Sturgis Bike Rally, though I would point out that we know how folks arrive at Bike Week and generally speaking it's completely different than arriving at a protest in the middle of the Boston. I'd also point out that the Sturgis Bike rally crowd likely feels quite differently than you do on transmission, and simply said "Ah screw it, they're full of ***". Of course, that brings me back full circle to the reasons many folks are distrustful of the messaging points. I'm not sure why I have to be the sane voice in the room that points out "...mass gatherings do not happen 'in and of themselves', ever.".

Typhoid B-Man, out infecting us all without a care in the world.

It wasn't just "a terrible idea at the time', Frank. It flies in direct contrast to the 'trust the science and dutifully listen to your leaders' mantra of the day. The behavior was guaranteed to cause the spread, to infect others, to pump up the curve and result in death to thousands. And, of course, in spite of curve flattening, we actually lost hundreds of thousands of people as gathering after gathering took place. That, of course, assumes one only looks at the gatherings. The fact is--even as you thread yet another needle similar to 'political gamesmanship when a VP candidate tells her constituents to be distrustful of the new vaccine---25,000 people do not spontaneously appear at a protest in Detroit. Those folks all come from somewhere--by car, by rail, by bus, subway. They dine at restaurants, eat at fast food places, stop at rest areas, shop at the local 7/11, all while interacting with multitudes of other folks who have interacted with multitudes of other folks. They stay at hotels, crash at the house of a friend, or the friend of a friend, and do the things that people tend to do when getting together in large numbers. Oh--and when they were all done, they dispersed back to home, to towns and communities across the country to see friends, families and of course, transmit the virus. You're free to contend none of that mattered or matters, but it's complete fiction. But yeah, feel free to hyper-fixate on the political gathering as the real problem with COVID in 2020. So, back to the original point, which was to point out reasons people would be distrustful of the advice and guidance of politicians, scientists and folks on the internet suggest trusting in the official narrative is the only path to total enlightenment.

I feel the same way, you’re pretty closed minded and I question your willingness to engage in good faith. Why are you unwilling to discuss protestors, transmission, the spread, death and dying in the context of “flattening the curve”? What are you afraid of? It’s fascinating to me. I did a quick google search of “infections from ACB nomination”. One article referenced 11 individuals who attended the event later tested positive for COVID. Since is a hot button issue for you, I’ll round up and say 20 tested positive. The event organizers should have been more diligent at enforcing social distancing and mask wearing. Now, what was the impact of tens of thousands of people congregating on the streets, week after week, month after month, interacting with one another, close contact, animated conversation as it relates to COVID spread and your flattening of the curve? It’s like the old adage where you step over a $100 bill to pick up a penny.

Please, illuminate me. What is my grand conclusion? Be sure to read the words I wrote, not what you think they mean. Frank, Boobala, I’m not trying to convince you of anything. You seem a devotee of the fixed mindset here, and I assume that offers you some sense of safety and reassurance. I want to be clear here: It’s ok for you to feel the way you do. I simply feel differently. On the subject of lockdowns and shuttering in, well, the truth is…that never actually happened. We most certainly did have many, many citizens shuttering in and locking it down. Some did so willingly, some not so much. On the other hand, throughout the lockdown of the compliant, hundreds of thousands of citizens refused to lock down at all. In fact, the numbers likely ran into the millions. What do you suppose, Frankish, the impact of those people interacting, intermingling, demonstrating was in COVID transmissions and the death count? How many infections, how many sick, and how many dead would you say? 5? 50? 200? 10,000? 100,000? Believe it or not, I wish we had a nationwide commitment to the lockdown, and that dem leaders and our scientists has committed to it. It would likely have resulted less in the flattening of the curve and more like COVID infections/death dropping off a cliff. But, politicians politic, right Frank? Back to the subject, it is inevitable that compliant folks—Democrats, Republicans, Independents and non-voters would ultimately question the credibility of “leaders” who demanded they lock down, but who supported activities that were in direct contrast to everything the complaint were told under threat of law was absolutely vital to flattening the curve. You lost me here, Frank, and I feel like it’s because somewhere along the way you became enchanted with the sound of your own voice in your head . I did not suggest a massive conspiracy was in play, did not claim to have evidence of the robber barons of the pharmaceutical industry preying on the innocent, or use the word nefarious to describe anyone’s actions (I like that word, but I’ll have to assume in this case it’s your rebuttal to my use of “cabal”). I assure you, I would have no hesitation in sharing evidence of such things if I did even at the risk of you dropping some cheesey overused internet insult on me again. You didn’t ask, but I’ll offer the following: I have sought out the flu vaccine for about the last 15 years, long before friends and family of a similar age did so. My first Pfizer vax was in April this year. I encouraged my then 21 year old child to get the J&J vaccine in spite of his hesitancy, in spite of the fact that he had previously had COVID (his experience was consistent with those of the average healthy 21 year old male battling COVID, which is to say, uneventful). I have yet to get the booster shot, not because I am skeptical but December is a busy month for me and I really don’t want to deal with 3 or 4 days feeling crappy. I own stock in AstraZeneca, Pfizer and J&J, never use the term Big Pharma because I think it’s sorta silly, and don’t think they implanted nano-bots into my body during vax. I do think it’s perfectly fine and absolutely necessary to discuss the origins of the virus, the unwillingness of the Chinese to cooperate, the failure of our government to insist on a thorough investigation, transparency on the role of the US govt in the research that precipitated to virus, and the evolution of his guidance over the past two years. I’m not sure why that’s so controversial unless Tony Faucci is your uncle and you are in his will. I can’t help you here, I’m not sure what your fixation is with ACB but if it’ll help us move on I’ll gladly meet you in the middle and say “Huh, yeah, Amy Coney B. Right??” in an exasperated tone. The bottom line is, and was, people are distrustful of the current leadership and guidance from Fauci, China and pharmaceutical companies. You want to argue that point, great, but it changes nothing.

I appreciate the polite reply and the opinions you shared within your post. Let's get to it: It's quite reasonable to assume that the virus was created and the original infection started at the lab; YES We agree here. It's reasonable to question whether or not the 'escape' was accidental or intentional; NO. There is no reason to believe that China or Chinese lab workers intentionally released the virus INTO WUHAN Your faith in the Chinese government is noted. https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2021/07/22/1019244601/china-who-coronavirus-lab-leak-theory https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/07/22/china-covid-who-wuhan/ https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/will-world-ever-solve-mystery-covid-19s-origin Common sense suggests that absent a complete and thorough international investigation, the cause of the 'escape' remains unknown. In addition, given the impact on the entire world this pandemic caused, it's hard to imagine the Chinese government refusing to assist the scientific community with a through investigation to ensure it never happens again. Personally, I would be surprised to learn that any professional investigation would start with "Hey, any suggestion someone did this intentionally is off the table". I guess you see it differently. The lab itself is in China, a country known for brutality and a complete disregard for human rights; Largely TRUE, but irrelevant. "Largely"? Uh, sure. The lab and/or experiments performed therein have the fingerprints of the scientific community of the US all over it; NO. We have seen (not surprisingly) that the network of researchers is interconnected globally, but the rest of the statement ("fingerprints of the scientific community all over it") is unsupported. It seems silly to argue whether our government was involved in the research that went on in Wuhan, but if you feel better threading the needle with phrases like "network of researchers interconnected globally" to acknowledge our government was involved, that's fine. Interestingly, a "network of researchers interconnected globally" to determine the cause of the escape would go a long way toward figuring out what happened. Still, the Chinese government has declined the opportunity to do so--or as you might say they have been "Largely uncooperative". The face of the US response to COVID has ties to the research, and obviously would benefit greatly from the any messaging pointing away from his/his organizations involvement in development or subsequent infection; Largely TRUE as a general point (if an entity fears being implicated in a disaster it is a natural reaction for that entity to try to minimize its involvement), but also largely unsupported. I'll take this as a YES. The face of the US response to COVID is on record as having taken multiple conflicting positions on the what the US response to COVID must look like; NO. The US response has been, surprisingly, largely consistent from the time Trump admitted we have a problem (that is, after his "soon we'll have no cases" type responses) until the present: (1) our longer-term response would be in developing/distributing effective vaccines, and to a lesser extent therapeutics; (2) until such vaccines bring the number of serious cases into an acceptable range, to rely on social mechanisms (distancing, shutdowns, masks, and unfortunately to a much lesser extent (because it is probably more effective) ventilation). You may be the last person in America who believes that Faucci has consistently delivered the same message. You've pointed out here the significant profit motive for key players in this game, each and every one a member of the 'leadership' cabal we're asked to trust without question; NO. Now we've plummeted from a rational discussion of how labs, industries, bureaucracies and governments respond to incentives into irrational, conspiratorial nonsense; the use of the term "cabal" proves that. This one made me laugh. You bend over backwards to defend the Chinese government's handling of the pandemic, defend Biden/Harris speaking out against trust in the science of the vaccine, claim Dr Faucci has been largely consistent from mask wearing, to stopping the spread in 14 days and the like, but THE line in the sand here is I used a word you didn't like? That's hysterical! The same folks who told us in 2020 not to trust a vaccine developed under one administration now ask us to trust them without question; NO. There was some early political gamesmanship in the United States as there always is, but that was on the order of "Trump is rushing through vaccine approval to help him win reelection." There was no general idea among the future members of the Biden Administration that vaccines are suspect, and, of course, the career people who have remained through both administrations have been resolutely pro-vaccine, and resolutely focused on letting the normal processes go forward, even when expediting vaccine approval even more would probably have been a better policy decision. "Political gamesmanship" as hundreds of thousands were dying and vaccines were being developed to save the world? Jesus, you are a true believer in the people in charge. We were lead to believe that shuttering in and locking down was the answer to successful pandemic management, and while most complied, we were also lead to believe the virus hovered over mass gatherings, a presidential inauguration, and virtually every private party or gathering attended by political operatives urging or demanding compliance; INCOHERENT. "Shuttering in and locking down" was effective - remarkably effective! - in allowing us to avoid the nightmare scenario that was developing in NYC and many other locations in the United States. The second part - "we were lead to believe the virus hovered over mass gatherings" - is simply ridiculous. The virus DID spread rapidly in certain mass gatherings. The Trump Amy Coney Barrett nomination event was, of course, Exhibit A. I don't even know what the rest of this is supposed to mean as it has the character of the infamous "old man shakes fist at cloud" meme. If you struggle to follow the paragraph, Frankish, blame your teachers! I get it--the easy out of a disagreement is to suggest that I'm out on my front lawn raging at the weather, and if that's your kink, have at it. It's reveals a certain weakness in you, in my opinion, but that doesn't make you wrong. All I can tell you is that in a time when our political leadership was locking down just about every aspect of American life, some in political leadership encouraged massive amounts of people to gather, assemble, demonstrate in massive numbers and return home to their communities thereafter. There's a disconnect there, Frank, and all the anger I've directed at the stratocumulus formation floating above my head doesn't change the fact that people can smell b*llsh*t a mile away. Imagine how many lives could have been saved had one brave leader, one brave democrat, or one brave scientist stood up and said "Your cause is just, your feelings understandable, but you're contributing to the spread of COVID and worse yet, are taking it home to your communities and to those most vulnerable". Then again, death was good for the dems in 2020. But, sure, AMY COMEY BARRETT! It's really a wonder anyone chooses to vaccinate. It's really not a wonder that some people refuse to vaccinate when their logic falls apart in this manner. I have kindly pointed this out above. The last couple lines here sound like you're playing White Goodman from Dodgeball.

Poverty in general is very sad, but however well-intentioned, you shouldn't misrepresent the numbers and should expect to be mocked when you do. One thing about the little red-headed orphan girl is she always tells the truth. Oh, and I don't own any guns yet. I do have a machete that I keep in my office, but it's not very sharp these days. It has been described as Tiberian.

I saw on Huff Post that of the millions, it was mostly orphans that would suffer. There was even one orphan that appealed directly to Manchin. She's a sweet kid with sassy personality, fire red curly hair, freckles and a can-do attitude. She sang him a song, and while he didn't change his position, he recognized and appreciated her moxie. He was so impressed that while on his way to a $10,000 per plate "Biden Builds Back Better" fundraiser at a local 5 star hotel, he had his driver drop her off at a local soup kitchen.

This is an interesting post, and points to the reason people are hesitant to jump in and trust blindly. It's quite reasonable to assume that the virus was created and the original infection started at the lab; It's reasonable to question whether or not the 'escape' was accidental or intentional; The lab itself is in China, a country known for brutality and a complete disregard for human rights; The lab and/or experiments performed therein have the fingerprints of the scientific community of the US all over it; The face of the US response to COVID has ties to the research, and obviously would benefit greatly from the any messaging pointing away from his/his organizations involvement in development or subsequent infection; The face of the US response to COVID is on record as having taken multiple conflicting positions on the what the US response to COVID must look like; You've pointed out here the significant profit motive for key players in this game, each and every one a member of the 'leadership' cabal we're asked to trust without question; The same folks who told us in 2020 not to trust a vaccine developed under one administration now ask us to trust them without question; We were lead to believe that shuttering in and locking down was the answer to successful pandemic management, and while most complied, we were also lead to believe the virus hovered over mass gatherings, a presidential inauguration, and virtually every private party or gathering attended by political operatives urging or demanding compliance; It's really a wonder anyone chooses to vaccinate.

I’m sort of sick of this story. 2022 is less than 2 weeks away and this investigation just drags along. Clinton will be Biden-like by the time this gets anywhere.

I think you’re doing mental gymnastics to support Brady here. It’s your contention that a heroic TB12 was dodging men with fists the size of Thor’s Hammer in the video link you sent? He was trotting like an overzealous dad at his daughter’s field hockey game after she caught one of those candy cane clubs across the kisser. I have no issues with TB generally, and certainly none from the clip you shared. He’s the greatest Qb of all time, but we don’t need to create a separate narrative on this thing. The coach was happy. TB was unhappy. TB lost his cool. That’s all. It happens to…well, it actually happens to the best of ‘em. It’s not a big deal either way. I agree with you on what my response might be with JA in a similar situation, but there’s a reason for that. It’s because I’m emotionally vested in the Bills. I’m irrational to a fault there. Rumor has it I called for a meteor strike on the clown car carrying the officials home from the Bills-Bucs game, though I don’t recall because of the spiking blood pressure and pain radiating down my left arm.

Is it still a process of natural selection when it’s quite probable that this whole thing started when some of Faucci’s buddies left the window open at the Junior Science Fair ab in Wuhan? It’s seems like it’s not natural, not natural at all.