BillsFanForever19

Alright, so now we have the same roster with the only exception being I have Shavers and you have Forrest. My feeling is Shavers can also be used on Special Teams. When he was initially brought on board as a UDFA, it was in large part bc they felt he could be a core ST'er. I recall McDermott saying recently something along the lines of "we know what he brings as a WR, we need to see what he brings on Teams" - which I thought was odd bc again, I remember them hyping up his Teams potential when they gave him guaranteed money as a UDFA. So I guess we'll see how he performs and is evaluated there throughout the Pre-Season. We agree that last spot needs to play ST's. I just feel that if it's close, it should go to Shavers given his performance this off-season.

We have the exact same roster. Except you have Darrick Forrest and I have Landon Jackson. Who I'm assuming you just forgot? I mean, I know he didn't look great in Pre-Season Game 1 - but cutting the 72nd Pick in the Draft after Rookie Training Camp is bold 😀

I don't think Hairston lands on PUP. From all accounts, he should be ready to roll Week 1. Maybe they sit him for the opener, but he's too important to put on the shelf for the first 4 weeks. Someone like SVPG, given that it's said he probably won't be ready by Week 1 and that he's essentially 3rd string Center/Interior - that makes more sense to me. Which is why I stuck him there. Honestly, with him on PUP and with the roster exempts for Hoecht/Ogunjobi, I was able to fit pretty much everyone who should be on this roster on to it with relative ease. So I don't think there's really a need to put anyone else there. And to your point on Lundt and Thompson, if not them, it would be someone else at those positions. As 5 at LB and 9 at OL is the minimum they'll carry at each. Ja'Marcus Ingram and Edefuan Olofoshio were the only guys that I felt were sort of tough cuts. But with Ingram, I have a hard time seeing us keeping 7 CB's (even with Codrington being a Returner). Olofoshio they may not want to give up on so quickly, so maybe someone is surprise IR'ed to return to place him. Or maybe they cut Thompson instead. Curtis Samuel... idk. I think he should stick. I see names like Samuel, Epenesa, etc. pop up as Trade candidates and I'm just sort of like "why?". Depth is a good thing. He showed up at the end of the year when he was healthy and I think he can be good for us. It's not like we're game busters at WR even with him. Why make us worse? And as I said before, I was able to fit everyone who should stick at WR, with him still on the roster. Do we really want to move a talent like Samuel so we can keep an Olofoshio or an Ingram? Or move him to keep another WR like Wilkerson or Shenault? Nah, I say keep the guy. Unless he's part of a trade for a more talented WR, which is very unlikely to happen.

Spector has already been released.

I think there's merit in wondering if Shenault offers more than Codrington. But it doesn't change the fact that Codrington has been above Shenault and was the main return man in the last game. Until we see that changing in the Pre-Season, I don't think it's going to happen.

The answer is simple - you cross that bridge when you come to it. By Week 8 (the 6 Week suspension followed by a Week 7 Bye), it's entirely possible (if not likely) that we'll have 2 injuries that will require PUP or IR and they can be seamlessly slid on to the 53. Injuries may even come along the DL. If we're lucky enough that there were no injuries, then difficult decisions will have to be made. But again, that's not something Beane has to worry about until the time comes. One thing you absolutely don't do is make room for them before they're available. Say you trade Epenesa for example. Well now you're down to Bosa, Rousseau, Jackson, and Solomon. And if there's a single injury before Week 8 - whoo boy. You're in rough shape. Especially with how much we rotate along the DL, the injury history of Bosa, and Jackson looking like he needs time to get his sea legs under him - that would be a terrible decision. Maybe that's something you think about Week 8 if all of the DE's were to stay healthy. But absolutely not before then.

I disagree with a number of things about your 45. I think there's people on this list that aren't likely to make it and people off of it who are somewhere between a lock or very close to it: - I don't think Mike White is anything close to locked in as QB2. I've said this before, there's no guaranteed money with White and there is with Trubisky. So for White to win, he has to so clearly be the better option that they're willing to pay about 2m in Dead Money for Trubisky and the 1.3m that isn't guaranteed for White on top of it. I think if it's even remotely close (which it is), they're going to go with Trubisky bc that's the cheaper option. I also think that him being friends with Josh also plays a role. - I don't think Elijah Moore is a lock either. I know we all got enamored with his off-season videos and his speed. But reportedly, he hasn't been very impressive in Camp. Meanwhile, Tyrell Shavers has been undeniable. I think on my list I'll be keeping both. But if I were locking in 5 like your list, it would be Shavers in and Moore out. - Forrest... Forrest to me is everyone's "I don't want Damar Hamlin here and Forrest is the competition, so he's in". I haven't heard anything about him impressing and he's not running above Hamlin in practice or the games. He's really shown or done nothing to say he should be on the 53 besides he isn't Damar Hamlin. I've said it once, I'll say it a million times, I don't think there's a bigger disconnect in player evaluation than with Hamlin. To the fans, he's terrible and he shouldn't be here. To the brass, he's a guy that they keep bringing him back and putting him in big roles. I'll honestly believe it when I see it that they feel like he can't even be a Backup for this team given his role last year. - And obviously, Deone Walker is making this team. I'm assuming you just brain farted leaving him off the list. We've never outright cut even a 5th Rounder the same year we Drafted them - let alone a 4th Rounder like Walker. All that said, here's my feeling on the roster as of today: QB: Josh Allen #17 Mitch Trubusky #11 RB: James Cook III #4 Ray Davis #22 Ty Johnson #26 - Reggie Gilliam #41 WR: Khalil Shakir #10 Joshua Palmer #5 Keon Coleman #0 Curtis Samuel #1 Elijah Moore #18 Tyrell Shavers #80 TE: Dalton Kincaid #86 Dawson Knox #88 Jackson Hawes #85 OL: Dion Dawkins #73 David Edwards #76 Connor McGovern #66 O'Cyrus Torrence #64 Spencer Brown #79 - Tylan Grable #68 Ryan Van Demark #74 Alec Anderson #70 Chase Lundt #77 DE: Joey Bosa #97 Greg Rousseau #50 AJ Epenesa #57 Landon Jackson #94 Javon Solomon #56 DT: Ed Oliver #91 Daquan Jones #92 T.J. Sanders #98 Dewayne Carter #90 Deone Walker #96 LB: Matt Milano #58 Terrel Bernard #8 Dorian Williams #42 Shaq Thompson #45 Joe Andreessen #44 CB: Christian Benford #47 Maxwell Hairston #31 Taron Johnson #7 (Nickel) Tre'Davious White #27 Dorian Strong #43 Brandon Codrington #29 (KR/PR) S: Taylor Rapp #9 Cole Bishop #24 Damar Hamlin #3 Jordan Hancock #37 (Nickel/Safety) Cam Lewis #39 (Nickel/Safety) ST: Tyler Bass #2 Reid Ferguson #69 Brad Robbins #40 Roster Exempt: DE Michael Hoecht #55 (Suspended) DT Larry Ogunjobi #99 (Suspended) C Sedrick Van Pran-Granger #62 (PUP)

You're both cutting Deone Walker? 😮

Thank you. I couldn't recall if we went without McGovern last season and who started for the last game. I suppose your scenario could work. It'd be a lot on the plate of Alec Anderson and Tylan Grable. Anderson 6th OL on the field in certain packages, 1st guy up at all 3 interior spots. Tylan Grable being the first guy up at Tackle and having to also play Guard if two go down on the Interior. I must have missed SVPG being on PUP with all the injuries announced. Last update being McDermott saying it's unlikely he'll make the Pre-Season finale. If that's the case, i'd expect them to keep him on PUP or maybe even IR him. But I don't think they're going to outright cut him. Spending a Top 7 Pick in Round 5 on him last season is no minor investment, like a Late 6th or 7th. I don't think they wash their hands on his development after his Rookie year and an injured off-season.

Who's the Backup at Center then? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm not seeing any Center experience for David Edwards, O'Cyrus Torrence, Alec Anderson, Tylan Grable, Ryan Van Demark, or Chase Lundt. It is possible they keep a 10th OL. But like I said, the problem I see there is there's a myriad of positions where an argument is being made to keep an extra from last season. And you can't do it all. WR with Moore and Shavers, OL with Lundt, LB with Thompson, Olofoshio, and Joe, CB with Strong and Ingram (or Jackson), S with Hamlin, Hancock, and Lewis. There's going to be some difficult cuts with how deep we are.

I still maintain he'd have to unseat Van Demark. I suppose there's a chance they could keep an extra OL over what they had last year. But that also seems to be something discussed for a lot of different positions this season.

It's not only not highly unlikely he makes the roster - it's highly unlikely he *doesn't* make the roster. Dorian Strong isn't like most 6th Round Picks that we take at the bottom of the Round or as a Supplemental Pick. He was the 1st Pick overall in Round 6. For example, Dorian Strong was taken with the 177th Pick in the Draft. Our 6th Round Pick last year, Daequan Hardy, was taken with the 219th Pick in the Draft. Technically, the same Round. But they were effectively taken almost a full Round and a Half from each other. Jordan Hancock (Pick 170), Jackson Hawes (Pick 173), and Dorian Strong (Pick 177) were all taken within 7 Picks of each other. It cracks me up when posters look at Hancock and Hawes as almost locks and Strong as a longshot bc he was taken in Round 6. Especially considering Strong was considered a steal where he was taken. Even if Hairston didn't get hurt, I still would have liked Strong's chances. Hancock is a Nickel/Safety Hybrid who isn't competing for the same roster spot. We'll keep 4 Boundary CB's. Benford, Hairston, and Tre are givens. The last spot comes down to Strong, Ja'Marcus Ingram, or Dane Jackson (who almost certainly will be cut for the Practice Squad). With Hairston hurt, they may choose to keep a 5th Boundary guy. And with Strong looking great in Camp in his stead - I would be very surprised if he didn't make it. We'd much easier get back Dane Jackson or Ja'Marcus Ingram on the Practice Squad than we would Dorian Strong.

But what he doesn't have is the accolades of All-Pro that McDuffie and Gonzalez have. Or the long term fame of Jalen Ramsey. Or the kind of attention that Pick 6'ing Mahomes in a Super Bowl victory brought Cooper DeJean. This isn't a PFF strictly performance based list. This is a player voted Top 100 of 1,696 players (53 man roster x 32 teams) popularity contest. We know Benford's great. But you'd be hard pressed to find anyone outside of Bills fans and analytics nerds (and again, this isn't that kind of list) that would put Benford in the Top 100. It also doesn't help that he went down with Concussions on the biggest stages for us last year. Maybe if that didn't happen and he made big time plays then, things would have been different for both the team and his chances to make the list.

Benford isn't flashy enough to make this kind of list. He's a Zone Corner that doesn't get many picks. Great cover guy, but being a great cover guy isn't going to make a list like this. This is a part performance based, part big plays, part popularity list. We know as Bills fans Benford is great at what he does. But he just doesn't get enough attention for what he does because he doesn't get picks, pick 6's, and doesn't play man to man. The second that both 2nd Team All Pro CB's in Trent McDuffie and Christian Gonzalez came in at #81 and #84 respectively - I knew there was no way Benford was going to show up on the list above them. Agent 47 will continue to be an under the radar, unsung hero until he strings together flash highlights. And honestly, I kind of like that he flies under the radar.

For Practice Squad, sure. Maybe an outside chance that Lundt unseats Van Demark as the 4th OT. But RVD is very well liked by the brass and the guys in the locker room, so I'd be surprised. And there's no shot he beats out Grable with his performance this off-season. We didn't lose anyone on the OL from last season to this year. So it's unlikely that anyone from last season is cut to make room. Especially at IOL, in Bayer's case. He'd have to take one of SVPG or Alec Anderson's spots and I really don't see either being released.

I'll give you the Practice Squad. But it's not every year that a UDFA makes the 53 like Buffalo Joe. It tends to only happen when we're not particularly deep at a position (like we were at LB last season). This year, we're much deeper pretty much across the board than we were last season. So I don't see any UDFA or camp invite making the 53. I think the closest you'll see to this is there's a good chance that after 2 seasons of being cut and then put on the Practice Squad, Tyrell Shavers has a really good shot at making the 53 this year.

What veteran? The Free Agent RB market has been completely picked through. There's nothing of value left: Jamaal Williams (30) Zack Moss (28) Gus Edwards (30) Jeff Wilson (30) Ameer Abdullah (32) Chase Edmonds (29) JaMychal Hasty (29) D'Onta Foreman (29) Mike Boone (30) Josh Kelly (29) Chris Evans (28) Owen Wright (26) Let Cook do what he wants. He isn't going to hold out games or not be at camp and take the fines that would cost six figures per. He "likes his money" too much for that. Let him throw a hissy fit for a bit. If he wants a team to pay him, he's going to have to produce. He knows it. The team knows it. Davis and Johnson are nice roleplayers. Davis for tough yardage and change of pace. Johnson for blocking and receiving. But to rely on them on 1st and 2nd down to move the chains, or any from that murderers row list above, would be a massive downgrade to our offense this season. And if they don't want to pay 15m per for Cook, I question whether they want to pay around 30m per for 29 year old McLaurin. I know WR is a different animal than RB. But it's still a much larger ticket.

You speak as if we're already winning the "salary cap award of the year". As it is, we're having to budget shop. You want a DK Metcalf or Terry McLaurin? Best we can do is Joshua Palmer and Elijah Moore. You want us to swing for the fences on a DE that's on the market? Best we can do is Joey Bosa. Want to go get a stud CB? Best we can do is Tre White, Dane Jackson, and Draft Picks. Think DaQuan Jones is toast? All good, we'll get a 1T in Round 4. And through all of that and the economy moves to mid-tier moves, we're dead last in the league in Salary Cap - sitting at -750k. Next year, we sit at -2.93 million with at least 17 players who will make this roster needing to be re-signed or replaced. Including 4 of our to be rostered Offensive Lineman, 2 of which starters. We aren't remotely close to winning in the salary cap game right now. Haven't been in a good many years. We're in rough, rough shape. I don't believe the kind of contract that Micah Parsons will demand is feasible. And if it is, the amount of players in the coming years we'd have no choice to let walk would be staggering. Everyone likes to point to the Rams. It's no guarantee that going "all in" like the Rams did will guarantee the same result. And if you do that and not get to the promised land, we're putting Josh in even more hell for years to come and wasting more of his years.

So 2 1st's, a 3rd, Cook, Epenesa, and the new highest contract for an Edge Rusher - which would severely hamstring our cap even more going forward?

Yeah, I get what you're saying. I went last year and Josh did the same amount of work. I think it's like you said, if it wasn't a big event at the stadium with lots of fans, maybe he doesn't do anything beyond some throwing drills against air. But you gotta give the fans something.

Thanks for the jinx equilibrium. I'm honestly not all that superstitious. But I wince every time I see a post like OP's.

That logic tracks. But maybe they didn't want to give up picks this year given all they had to do and roster spots they had to fill. Especially a high pick this year. I tend to agree with you. But maybe adding a player like McLaurin while still being able to get Sanders and Jackson and pay for him with picks next year (and/or player(s)) might be more intriguing.

He didn't skip any mandatory OTA's, didn't skip any of Training Camp - no holdout period. He's talked about wanting to stay here. It baffles me that people still talk about something like this or hold ill will towards him bc of a couple tweets that simply said "I want to be paid".

Could be another reason they're doing it. They could be trying to coach those instincts out of him.

One thing I've noticed between going to camp and reading the reports - it seems to me that they're trying to force Keon Coleman to be more physical and deal with physicality better. When I was there and reading what people have been saying for all of the practices I haven't, the DB's seem to be WAY more physical with Keon than anyone else. To the point where it would draw a flag (on Monday for example, Josh made the flag motion on a route drill throw to him). Then the next set of WR's would come up and it would be standard coverage. Then Keon would come up again and again, hands all over him. I don't think this is coincidental. I think the coaches put an edict to make things difficult on him to toughen him up.