FireChans

I’d like to win games and not have the passing game be bad. Do you think that’s possible or do you think we are always doomed to have Allen rushing 9 times a game in November/December while his passing numbers fall off a cliff? serious question. Because there were lots of folks upset with Daboll during his tenure, and were very much looking forward to seeing what Dorsey could do. Some folks don’t want Josh to be forced to run through linebackers for the last 7 weeks of the season. And Dorsey didn’t want Josh used that way starting week 1, (probably to protect him and it wouldn’t surprise me if that was a directive from the top). Brady probably didn’t care about running Josh because the season was lost if we lost another game AND he was in the drivers’ seat for the job the next year as the interim. Well, we are like 24 months removed from giving Diggs a top 5 WR contract so that’s quite a switch in philosophy. Maybe you’re right. I think much like the Chiefs getting rid of Hill, the Bills don’t think the juice is worth the squeeze. It’s less a philosophical switch as a pragmatic switch imo. FWIW, from a “floor is going to be pretty high,” an 85-86 passer rating is right around Justin Fields, Gardner Minshew and Will Levis. So I’m not sure that’s really that high. Josh’s legs are the reason he can be a one man offense. Which he has pretty much HAD to be since 2020. Which is the problem to me. You don’t see it as a problem. I guess this regime doesn’t see it as a problem as much as I do. We’ll see. I’m hoping we don’t see history repeat itself with Cam.

Are you sure that’s what they want or is that just what they are doing? There is a difference. Because the passing offense was bad when we did so.

It’s not rational? How so?

The biggest problem for most fans who won’t stop complaining about this is that in a super deep WR draft that was filled with need picks by the Bills, the Bills didn’t feel like they needed a 2nd WR over a 2nd RB or a safety or a 2nd 3T.

Adding a star WR? Yeah, it probably does make it more likely. Adding a second rookie with promise vs career JAGS and camp bodies? Maybe or maybe not. There’s been lots of young WR’s that have made major impacts as rookies. Of course, there’s lots who suck too. The thing about basically ignoring the WR position for 3 years is you don’t get to then retroactively justify a reset year with a low talent group relative to the rest of the league. That’s the real problem. It’s the exact same thing as not drafting a QB for years and then trotting out Fitzpatrick and telling the fans, “well what are we supposed to do?”

We can win a Super Bowl if Josh Allen gets hurt week 11 and another failed QB plays great like Nick Foles did 2017. That doesn’t make it a good plan. It doesn’t make it likely.

FWIW, @White Linen also accused me of swearing I would never come back to TBD if something happened. (Which I would never have done because who takes a message board that seriously lol) I think he has a faulty memory.

The dynasties skew everything. I’m old enough to remember when folks on TBD would swear up and down the Bills didn’t need to waste a first round pick on a QB because Brady was a sixth lol. it’s tunnel vision

there’s no consistent analysis here. The same folks that thought the Bills didn’t need an elite #1 in 2019 were super pumped about trading for the Diggs the next year. The same folks who thought the Bills had a great WR group last year and it was awesome now think WR group doesn’t matter when it’s hot garbage. It’s just, “did the Bills do it? Then it must be right.”

Hey now, we have the second best TE from the 2023 NFL draft class. He’s basically Tony Gonzalez 2.0 already, we just need him to be the next Gronk or Kelce. These are reasonable expectations by year 2.

We can talk about everything, that’s the beauty of the off-season! the Chiefs receiving group as a whole last year was kinda stinky. They led the league in drops. They contributed to one the worst statistical season of Mahomes’ career. This was because the Chiefs had whiffed on Toney, Moore, etc. Their only saving grace at WR was Rashee Rice. But Kelce was still great enough, particularly in the postseason and their defense was great, particularly in the postseason, and they had enough to win the title. I disagree with Brandon Beane’s investment of the WR position for a multitude of reasons. I don’t think his strategy is the way for the Bills to win a Super Bowl. I also think that copying the 2023 Chiefs model with an inferior version of good TE and crummy WR’s is not the way to win the Super Bowl. Having Kincaid try to be a worse version of the arguable greatest TE of all time does not work when you ignore the elite playoff defense the Chiefs proved to have last year and the Bills haven’t proved to have, well, ever. So yeah. Trying to be the 2023 Chiefs with less HoF players and a worse defense and a worse coaching staff and a worse QB sounds like WC champs again. Sue me. It’s not McBeane. It’s Beane. He doesn’t value WR’s. He values DL much much much higher. He wants his physical specimen QB to carry garbage WR’s to the promised land. It’s the Carolina way.

They had Kelce lol. And their receiver group still kinda sucked. Luckily, they had an elite defense that showed up in the regular season and the postseason. Good thing the Bills highly paid defenders have a history of carrying this team to victory in the postseason. Lmao. If you want, I can go point by point why the 2024 Bills are not the 2023 Chiefs, but you’ll just cry about how it’s not fair that the 3x SB championship team is better than the 3x reigning divisional round participant Bills.

You’re missing a step. 6. Josh Allen plays at or near the best level of his career in the postseason while the rest of his teammates no show, and we wonder why we can’t beat the Chiefs when we have Trent Sherfield alligator-arming passes.

Samuel was 33 in 2020. But yes Claypool was 31 and sneaks in. You are right. They aren’t proven yet is a very nice way of saying they’ve proven nothing so far. The Chiefs had a top 32 receiving target last year. They had Travis Kelce, who was 29th in 2023, 8th in 2022, 14th in 2021 etc etc. A no question first ballot HoF target. The Bills do not have this, right? Rice was unproven and ended up 32nd, which is better than anything any current Bills receiver has done except for Claypool 4 years and 3 teams ago. The year before that, they had JuJu in 2022 who was 24th (and of course had that top 5 season many years prior.) If you are a believer in the “hey Kincaid, I know it’s your second year in the league, but we need you to be a top 2 all-time HoF TE next year for our offense to work” plan, more power to you.

The object is to win, not compile stats. Now let me tell you all about Shakir’s efficiency stats being thrown to as WR3.

Who?

Correct. Do they have a guy on the roster who has ever been 32nd or better in receiving yards ever in their career? You believe in results, show me the results, not hopes and prayers. If the Bills trade for a good WR, I will obviously complain less about their WR’s being really bad. It hasn’t happened. And probably won’t happen.

I have said for months that the 2020-2023 Bills are going to remembered like the 2012-2015 Colts. a team that did not do enough to help their QB begging them to win a Super Bowl.

Buddy, they guys that have resulted in the most rings in your OP, Kelce and Gronk, have 7 SB’s between them. And they are not only HoF TE’s, they are arguably the 2 best TE’s in NFL history, playing with arguably the two best QB’s in NFL history. Ward and Graham are legitimate afterthoughts compared to those two. “All we need is a top 2 TE of all time combined with a top 2 QB of all time to offset our garbage WR’s” is not a really good plan lmao. And an even worse justification for a crappy plan. Talk about silly lol. The 2024 Buffalo football Bills.

If he’s a HoF TE, then I have much less concern about the Bills receiving group. Statistically, it’s not likely though.

How many teams win without a top 32 receiver?

Do you think he’s a HoF TE? I mean all this is well and good about “physical” WR’s but Aiyuk isn’t particularly physical IMO. Samuel you can make an argument I suppose but he plays much bigger than he is. And sure, the Niners lost, but imo it wasn’t because of their WR’s.

What does Hines Ward have to do with Jimmy Graham? Yes, two HoF TE paired with 2 HoF QB’s won a bunch of titles. Who is our HoF TE? Kincaid? Knox?

But that’s wrong and that won’t be what happens. Even with Waddles big money extension, he is going to cost $9M against the cap this season and $19M against the cap next season. Tua’s cap hit in 2024 is $23M. If they extend him after the season, his total dollars will be high, but he will probably have a SMALLER cap hit in 2025 compared to 2024. Picking and choosing when you use the big contract numbers or the cap hits is fallacious. I’m not sitting here saying this is a great move for Miami. If I was their GM, I would’ve probably drafted some cheap WR replacements for Waddle and either let him walk or traded him/Hill in 25.

They just kicked the cap hit can down the road. They were still highly paid.