Shaw66

I don’t recall what I was thinking as I left the stadium after the Bills lost Super Bowl XXV. The only thing I actually remember is that some guys outside the stadium were selling Giants Super Bowl Champions t-shirts for $25. There also were some guys selling Bills Super Bowl Champions t-shirts for $5. I thought about buying one. I wish I had. I do remember that as the first few years after that game went by, after three more Super Bowl losses and the beginning of the decline, I assured myself that the Bills had plenty of time in to win a Super Bowl in my lifetime. After all, I had been waiting since 1969, and sooner or later they’d put together a team and win it all. It’s been 30 years since wide right, and that Super Bowl win hasn’t rolled around yet. In fact, last season was the first time the Bills got close enough to sniff the game, let alone a win. I’ve gotten older. I no longer live in the comfortable assuredness that I will see the Bills hoist the Lombardi. I now understand how good teams have to be to make it to the Super Bowl, and how special they need to be to win it. Until 2020, there hadn’t been one season that began with the Bills having other than a Cinderella’s chance of winning a Super Bowl. Until 2020. Last season, suddenly and almost unexpectedly, the Bills began winning like a champion wins. I say “almost unexpectedly” because I did expect it; before the 2019 season began, I had written that these times were coming. Still, when it happened last season, I wasn’t prepared for it. I wasn’t prepared for the Bills to stand pat with their 2020 as roster they headed into 2021. Sean McDermott told us not to expect changes. Change has been a way of life for the Bills for 25 years; could 2021 possibly be different? Yes. Swap out one veteran wide for another, and that was about it. No big draft trades. Just work at getting better. I wasn’t prepared to see Bills highlights on broadcast network promos. I wasn’t prepared to hear talking heads describe the Bills as on of the early favorites to win the Super Bowl. I wasn’t prepared to behave like a fan of a good team. I don’t have to defend my team to anyone. I feel uncomfortable modestly agreeing when one of my friends mentions how good the Bills look. I don’t know how to prepare for the inevitable and unexpected events of the season. The injuries, the losses, the player disappointments, all of those things visited on every team every season. Now that I think my team could be a winner, I’m not prepared for those soul-crushing surprises. Can the Bills survive the ups and downs of the NFL season and win the Super Bowl? Yes, they are now in that discussion, legitimately in that discussion. Will they win it? Predictions are pointless. All I know is that now, finally, after 25 more or less hopeless years, after retirement, the birth of grandchildren and the inevitable arrival of old age, the Bills could make good on those assurances I gave myself after the Kelly Super Bowl era ended. I still want a Bills Super Bowl Champions t-shirt, but I want one after a Bills win.

Thanks. Can't watch that stuff now, but I'll look at it when I can. I'm interested in it. You missed my point about the goal line play. The point is that Edmunds' assignment on that play, like most plays, is NOT to slash. Klein made the play and Edmunds didn't precisely because the Bills don't ask Edmunds to do that - that's what Klein was in there for. It isn't Edmunds assignment, which is completely beside the point about whether he CAN do it. You and I may disagree about whether he can, but we don't disagree about how he's used. I'm not one of those who complains about Edmunds. I'm convinced that his value is in something that I can't see, which is how he disrupts the passing game. There was a thread several weeks that had quotes from GMs, scouts, and coaches, and someone said he's just a real problem in the passing game, because he covers more ground than the average MLB, he is taller than the average MLB, and he has longer arms than the average MLB. The combined result is that he takes away a much larger part of the middle of the field than pretty much all MLBs. That doesn't show up in any stats that the average fan looks at, but it's obvious how it helps the four DBs. It means the DBs have less of the field to cover, which allows them to stay closer to receivers and close on them more easily. And I think his assignment in the run game is not to get tackles for loss, but to help keep running plays at 3-7 yards when the ball carrier breaks through the front four. The Bills won't commit Edmunds or Milano to filling gaps, because they want them dropping in the passing game. So, their jobs are to limit the damage when the front four doesn't make the stop, not make a tackle for no gain. I think if you could interview Beane and McDermott and have them answer frankly, they would say they're getting exactly the value from Edmunds that they wanted. They'd say that since then there hasn't been another player to come into the league who can play the pass the way Edmunds does. And I'd guess they'd also say that he is going to continue to improve against both the pass and the run.

The intellectual dishonesty on display here is why people ignore you. You know perfectly well that the Bills never have brought in anyone to compete with Edmunds for the job. They brought in a parade of backups for, as you say, depth. Klein can't possibly do what Edmunds does in the passing game, and Matakevich came to be what he is, a special teams player. Just because they have LB after their names doesn't mean they were brought in to compete with Edmunds. That's like saying the Bills have Kumerow on the roster to compete with Diggs. Wallace plays because he's very good at what they want him to do. Edmunds plays for the same reason. That the fact their physical skills don't match your concept of what a player should do at his position is completely irrelevant to the conversation. McDermott took the Bills to the AFC championship game with those two woeful underperformers, and Beane and McDermott found no reason to replace them this season. McDermott and Beane do NOT leave guys in the lineup for three or four seasons waiting for them to develop. They do NOT.

Thurm - Thanks for doing the research, but what they describe is not what I see. And I think what you say - too tall and rangy, is correct and part of the problem. I don't see burst. I see good open field speed, but not great acceleration. I don't see him beating blockers to the gap, and I don't see him slipping blocks. He doesn't beat runners into the gap, and he doesn't burst through the line and appear in the QB's face on blitzes. Maybe you're correct - he isn't bad at that stuff, but I think in a different system, one that required him to be that kind of tackle-for-loss middle linebacker, he'd be average at best. He isn't a mauler, as you say. That's why so many people around here are down on him. They expected and they want Keuchly or someone. They wanted London Fletcher playing behind a nasty 1-tech or 0-tech guy, diving into holes and stuffing runs at the line of scrimmage. It's just so clear now that that is not what McDermott wants. People should look at the video of the fourth-and-1 stop at the goal line. That's vintage Edmunds. Klein is slashing into the gap, slipping a block, moving laterally behind the line of scrimmage to make the stop. Edmunds is up right, behind the line, just playing off his blocker and reading. Now, I know people will look at that and say it's terrible, Edmunds isn't attacking, he isn't shedding the blocker, there's instinctual play on display. Well, fine, that's all true. But to those people think that Frazier and McDermott don't look at the film? Do they think they don't see that? So, why don't they do something about it? After three seasons, it's clear - they don't do something about it because Edmunds is doing exactly what he's been coached to do. I mean, he isn't even trying to plug a gap. If diving into some gap was his job on that play, Edmunds would be mired so far down the bench, he'd be outside 716. So, whether you're correct about his ability to play the slashing, run-stuffing linebacker or I am, it's pretty much beside the point. He isn't asked to be that guy. Just like Star isn't asked to be a sackmeister and Knox isn't asked to be Lee Smith.

I think he isn't good at it. He isn't a physical hitter. He doesn't have great burst. But I don't think it matters. It isn't his job.

Finally, an ally! Nicely said. Thanks

Here's something no one can argue with, but of course you will. Beane and McDermott have high expectations of their players, and when a player isn't performing, they go out and get serious competition at that position. They try other options. They do not leave on the field players who are not getting the job done. We've seen it over and over. So, why is it that Beane has not drafted one young middle linebacker? Why hasn't he signed one veteran free agent middle linebacker? Why is it that McDermott unfailingly puts Edmunds back out there? There is only one answer: Edmunds is doing what the Bills want him to do. It may not be what you want him to do, but you don't get a vote. Edmunds is getting his job done. If he weren't, he'd have competition by now.

Well, who knows how statistically solid this is, but it's consistent with what I've been saying about the Bills' seeming lack of emphasis on stopping the run, and with what I've been saying about Edmunds in particular. The Bills seem to be designed to pass and stop the pass. Edmunds isn't shooting gaps and making tackles for loss. He isn't good at that, it's true, but I don't think that's the point. I think the point is that McDermott and Frazier aren't asking him to do that. They're asking him to be a pass defender. I wouldn't be surprised to discover that he's the best pass defending middle linebacker in the league, not because he has a lot of passes defended, but because he occupies so much space that QBs don't throw into the short middle.

Thanks.

Thanks. Good stuff. Beane doesn't like being on the sidelines. He wants to be on the field, making plays. So, I have trouble seeing him get through Tuesday without making a deal somewhere.

Gunner - Thanks for these reports. They're excellent. I never have been good at watching the line play, so I really appreciate those offensive line comments. A couple of reactions. First, Tommy Doyle. I wouldn't be so quick to give up him. Except for the guys taken in the first 30-40 spots in the draft, rookie linemen don't start. They come into the league woefully underprepared for what the NFL demands of them, and they need two or three years to develop. I think they took Doyle for his body without any serious expectation that he'd be NFL ready after a year, let alone after training camp. So, he may be struggling, but I'd guess the Bills will try hard to hold onto him. Ford. I hope you're wrong, but I doubt you are. I wanted his size and talent on the line, but Beane may simply have missed on this one. We'll see. Lewis. My thought as I watched him being undressed a couple of times was that above all else, McDermott demands that you execute to the extent of your physical ability EVERY PLAY. Consistent execution is essential. That's why, I think, Levi Wallace keeps starting - he does his job every play. He may not be physically able to make every play we'd like, but he always executes his assignment. Lewis doesn't, and on McDermott's teams, failure to execute is fatal. And that's why Hamlin stands out as a keeper. It's so interesting that he was taken so late in the draft, and his college coach said he's the guy from Pitt most likely to have along career in the NFL. The guy just seems to execute. Fromm. I agree with you. I've always thought Fromm has a good chance of being a solid journeyman backup. He doesn't have the arm to be an NFL starter, but he's disciplined. It's easy to see him, in a year or two, being a better version of Barkley. He really seems to get it; if he had to play, he's not going to make stupid mistakes (at least until the fourth quarter in a tight game, when he knows he has to make something happen). I don't know if he makes it to the PS - I assume he does; all I know is that he isn't the train wreck that some people seem to think he is. Dawkins just isn't a truly dominant left tackle, so while he's trying to get back to full speed, he's going to have those moments. I know it's heresy in some corners around here, but I think there's a good chance that Spencer Brown is the starting left tackle in a season or two. He has some raw talent that Dawkins doesn't. Finally, the elephant in the room that you didn't talk about: DE. Beane said during the broadcast that they've had calls about trade possibilities at the DE position. You can't ever be sure about Beane, but it sounded like he was going to be considering possible deals today and tomorrow. So, I don't recall seeing Addison on the field. Was he sitting because his spot is secure, or because they didn't want to get hurt and spoil a trade? Hughes played. Was he on the field to show him off as possible trade bait, or to tune up for the opener? Who knows; maybe neither. Basham showed up a few times, and the broadcasters mentioned that he looked better in week 2 and throughout practice leading up to week 3. They talked about Bam Johnson like he's making it, and the coaches comments about him suggested that Johnson was making it. Where was Obada yesterday? I have no idea where they're going at DE, but something's got to give. Finally, Ferguson most definitely is not an afterthought. 100% execution is his specialty; anything less than that could lose a game. We saw it yesterday, in a meaningless game that was completely in hand. So, his status is certainly a concern. If Epenesa has to spend next week at practice hanging out with Haack and Bass, so be it. He's not getting to anyplace near where Ferguson is in that job, but he can't be rolling balls back to the holder.

Players at some positions don't make impact plays. Like your 1-tech tackle. There was time when the middle linebacker was expected to make impact plays, but the days of Sam Huff, Ray Nietschke, Harry Jacobs, etc. are gone. Since Lawrence Taylor, the impact players increasingly have been on the edge. When your job is to drop into coverage on the snap, which is what Edmunds' job is, he's not going to be an impact player in the sense that you mean. McDermott doesn't ask Edmunds to do what Keuchly did. And he didn't ask Keuchly to do what Edmunds does.

The never ending Edmunds debate. I'm convinced that most people misunderstand Edmunds role in the defense. I'm not certain, but I'm pretty sure. I said something like this in the thread about today's game: I think if you the Bills would talk to you frankly about Edmunds, they'd tell you that outside the red zone, his focus is primarily to defend space laterally and behind him. Only when the opponent is inside the 10 is Edmunds' role primarily to defend in front of him. That's not at all how most of us, including me, understand the role of the middle linebacker, but that's what I think his role is. Given his size, speed, and quickness, he's good in the role he's asked to play. It's obvious to me that McDermott thinks winning in the NFL is all about passing and stopping the pass. Edmunds is an excellent player in a defense designed to stop the pass. He doesn't need to defend a lot of passes, or intercept a lot of passes. He needs to cover a lot of territory and discourage teams from throwing in that area of the field. He does that. Some people will say, "What about Kelce and the Chiefs?" The Chiefs ran plays designed to option off what Edmunds did. They outplanned the Bills, but the Bills will have an answer for that scheme.

Me too. I've never understood what palms quarters is, other than some kind of four-deep zone system. Since the Bills like playing, they don't blitz much, and that's why getting better pass rush out of the dline is so critical. And to RunJosh, yes, it does mean the Bills will have some uncomfortably close games. I mentioned Super Bowl XXV. Belichick figured out how to slow down the K-gun, and Parcells put together a ball possession offense. In a game like that the number of possessions you get goes down, and that makes the game closer. It also was Dick Jauron's philosophy in Buffalo. Play bend-don't-break defense to force the opponent to eat a lot of clock. It was a way to keep the score low, which was important because the Bills weren't going to score enough to win shootouts. If the score is low, it's possible to steal wins at the end of the game. I think playing bend-don't-break when you have an explosive offense just offers the opponent an opportunity to stay in the game. A team like Tennessee looks at the Bills and says, "great, keep bending. We'll go on 8-minute drives and score on every one. Then all we have do is stop your passing attack on a few possessions, and we win." Bills-Ravens was that kind of game. If Taron doesn't take it to the house, Bills likely were in trouble.

I agree with this. It goes along with what others said earlier about this being a bend-don't break defense. I think Edmunds' job, his assignment on most plays, is not a traditional middle line backer assignment. He's more like an extra safety playing in the box. His job is to occupy space in the defensive backfield (and catch the balls that hit him in the chest), and not get beat on runs. So, for example, tackles for loss is not an important statistic for this McDermott middle linebacker. Outside the red zone, Edmunds' responsibilities are primarily lateral and behind him. It's only inside the Bills' 10-yard line that his responsibilities are primarily in front of him.

Fair enough, but the way conversations advance is by one person saying something, someone responding to clarify, limit, or argue with the first, etc. You'll notice that someone responded to my post that you quoted by saying that there've been no reports out of camp that suggest that Sanders has looked slow. If no one responds to statements like "he's getting old and lost a step," when the only basis for the statement is that maybe this is the year that Sanders has gotten slower, then people may start accepting that as true. Shady supposedly lost a step two or three seasons before he actually did. For the past eight years, Brady's next season was going to be the season he'd lost it. Larry Fitzgerald was done five years ago. Players don't begin to lose it until they actually do begin to lose it. People are free to be of the opinion that Sanders has lost a step, but the fact that he didn't go deep in one half of one preseason game isn't evidence.

LOL

Looked plenty quick today. I think Beane and the pro scouts know more about what players have left in the tank than you and I. Beane wasn't interested in signing a possession receiver.

I doubt it. I think they took what they were given, and they wanted to get some completions on film. Sanders has made a career going deeper than we saw today, and the Bills didn't get him to back up Beasley. Sanders is a better version of John Brown; we'll see it at the appropriate time.

About the D - I mentioned a couple of weeks ago that I think McDermott is 100% into stopping the pass. He challenges his players to stop the run as well as they can. I think we'll see it all season long. As for bend don't break, far be it from me to criticize McDermott, but I think you pair a high-powered offense with a high-risk, high-reward defense. The theory is that your priority is to get the ball back to the offense. The one thing that can hurt the Bills is to limit their offensive possessions. Ask the Giants in Super Bowl XXV. So I don't like bend don't break when the Bills have Josh Allen. Give Josh as many possessions as you can, by getting quick stops and takeaways, even if it means giving up an occasional quick score.

Man, that sucks for players on the roster bubble. Better light it up in practice this week. Or are final cuts on Monday? Tuesday. The NFL should allow those two teams to go full contact in practice on Monday.

Saints Cards are now a 1 pm game, too.

I agree. McDermott has been clear in the past that one part of being prepared is practicing the pregame and start of game routine. The only way to practice it is in a preseason game, and that's what they're doing. Having said that I suspect that Alan has or will have instructions not to run the ball and not to scramble unnecessarily. The point isn't so much about making plays as it is about staying out of Harm's Way.

I think the NFLPA has a lot of provisions in the agreement about who decides player health issues. Airlines don't

I haven't thought about thos enough, and I tend to agree it would be a bad decision, but I'm not so sure. Part of running a successful team os getting rid of players who, though good, aren't in your long term future. Not you key guys, but others. Beasley isnt in the long term future. If the Bill's lost him, they could put Sanders in the slot and go with Davis. Then, as I said, they could keep Stevenson, who more likely is part of the future. Would they sandeep? No. But we are at the point where we're going to see good players leave. Personally, I think Beas starts against Pittsburgh.