Rochesterfan

I think they have found that Ike is much better on the left side. I think the coaching staff wanted Mongo and Dawkins on the Left as they have the most power. I think the big problem is that forced them to put Winters in on the right side as Ike does not seem to be a right side player. I think the Bills coaches realized that Winters was the weak link as he gets pushed back into Josh’s lap. Therefore they put Ike in and shifted Mongo over - not as strong rushing, but the best pass pro line they have.

It could be tough, but Daboll has a bit of a temper and it will be interesting to see him as a HC and letting someone else call plays. I am not sure Daboll and Trevor Lawerence are a great match, but he can help him grow if Lawerence would allow it.

The snap counts came out - Mongo started on the Right and Ike started on the Left as he played every snap. Winters only came in for the Mongo injury for limited plays and then Mongo came back. Winters did not start or get in without injury.

I agree that it is naive to think he won’t leave, but what is nice is that he has options. He loves the city and he and Josh are great together. I think that he can be a bit more picky and make sure he gets the right situation. That may mean taking and internal Bills GM candidate to work with. When Mike Pettine left to take over the Browns - he would of been better off sticking around another year and finding a better situation. That move set him back as a HC candidate years and has not gotten a real sniff since.

So last year just the Bills - won 2 games Miami and Dallas (both handily) and in neither game did we throw for 300 yards and the opponent threw for well over 300 yards even approaching 400. Did we not get the win? Did Miami or Dallas get some hidden unlocked victory point for throwing for 300 yards? I do not get your point or your obsession with that value - it is just a number - it does not mean the coaching is holding teams back by not getting there - it does not show the coaching is aggressive if you get there. It just shows nothing. Matt Stafford and Matt Ryan are the kings of meaningless 300 yard games and they show exactly why is is a stupid stat. In any case - I will reiterate- as the talent got better the offense got better, the completion percentage went up, more drives were extended, that allows more plays and more completions and most importantly more scores. As the talent increased on offense - it allows the coaching staff to look at advanced metrics and decide - I can go for 4th down here because the talent on my offense is better. It allows all sorts of different and expanded choices that the team could not make and hope to succeed early on. This coaching staff understood what they had and what they lacked. They put everything and more on Josh’s plate early. At few points did they harness him and try to limit his throws, but they tried to teach him Hero ball was not the only way. They did not hold him back - they expanded his horizons and pushed him to get better and better and also to understand that others are there to help. Was it perfect - Heck No! It was a solid plan though and it got us here as talent and experience expanded.

It is never important - it is a useless stat. Teams win all the time with under 300 yard passing and teams lose with over 300 yards - the percentage is right around 50% - meaning it is useless. Yes the offense was poorly ranked and that has been addressed - the Bills were a defense oriented team and lacked talent on Offense. The coaching did not hold them back - the lack of talent held them back. The difference was things like completion percentage - the Bills could not keep drives going because of the lack of receiver talent. First downs lead to more drives and more plays and therefore more throws. The argument that the offense was held back by coaching is just wrong - it was lack of talent and lack of experience.

There it is - Ike played every offensive snap - He and Mongo started and Winters was on the bench. The ESPN graphic with starters was not actually reflected by who the Bills played.

Because you are consistently wrong and show it with your big argument continuing to be about useless 300 yard games. I am skeptical of your football knowledge, but oh well.

LOL - would of looked like Beasley and Mongo - putting him to sleep. Totally agree - I did not mind the few mistakes. Not a bad crew - although I think Griese adds very little - I really like Riddick and Levy.

Gilliam is a special teams players and they prioritize some special teams players at times. It is not Gilliam over Kroft - it was Smith over Kroft for the running game. Gilliam is in the starting line up regardless of Kroft/Knox. I think you will see more Kroft/Knox with Smith on the bench as we continue to adjust depending on the defense they are playing.

Nope - ESPN had him listed as a starter, but right from play two- it was Ike on the Left and Mongo on the right. I actually noticed it because in the huddle I saw Mongo next to Williams and at the same time ESPN was running the starters along the bottom and it said Winters. My wife and I then went back and sure enough Ike and Mongo were playing. Winters came in for Mongo - got blown up and as soon as Mongo could get back in Winters returned to the bench.

@GunnerBill - I love this thread and I think it totally shows the evolution of this coaching staff. I think McD recognizes that Mongo is by far their best run blocker and Dawkins is right there with him. I think they toyed with/tried the Dawkins, Ford, Mongo (center) grouping thinking that would be the best rushing/power trio. Injuries kept that from working - so I think they wanted to try the Dawkins/Mongo group and got some nice push, but as Ike seems to be a more dominant left side player that left Winters to play right guard (which caused pass pro issues). The Bills then again recognized the issue and went with Dawkins/Ike and Mongo/Williams and they got some push, but much better pass protection. I think going forward that will be the plan if they can stay healthy and Ike has done a great job getting better week after week. The o-line is not going to find a way to get exceptional push with the current grouping, but as they have become a predominantly passing attack - I think they can make it work and still get enough push to keep teams honest.

And has been repeatedly stated - 300 yards is a stupid, meaningless, and trivial number just pulled out of nowhere because it is round. The Bills have continued to evolve and as they increased the WR talent and as Josh has gotten experience- the passing yards have come. This year with the trust of the offense - McDermont has been one of the more aggressive coaches in terms of 4th downs and kicks - why? Because he knows what they can do.

And as is typical - you would be wrong. It was not Daboll holding him back as has been pointed out to you several times. The Bills were aggressive, but lacked playmakers (as Beane stated in the off-season). The Bills never babied or even slimmed down the playbook - Daboll talked several times about that. The Bills/Daboll’s philosophy was we are going to attack and get Josh as much experience as possible and then use that as teaching moments. Sort of a tough love approach. They were so aggressive even last year that repeatedly true fans talked about why isn’t Daboll running more - you are getting 5 YPC from Singletary and he is only getting 10 runs a game - run him more - pull some passes away from Josh. They recognized that the more they threw - the more he was exposed to and the more he learned. What held Josh back in 2018 was the WR group - it was terrible and they made no plays for him - he was also so raw as to be scary. 2019 - the WRs improved (although Beane stated after last season they needed more) and the passing improved and Josh started to learn, but still had way to much he did not recognize. 2020 is a true WR group that makes plays for him (both routine and special), but the biggest difference is everything he has seen because of how aggressive Daboll was in his first 2 years. Josh is at the point he is at because Daboll did not hold him back in his first 2 years - he trusted him to make some plays and learn from mistakes (and some of those mistakes were costly). Daboll deserves a ton of credit for what he did in 2018 and 2019 to get Josh to this point today.

It could be lost faith, but he was also Banged around earlier in the game and hurt his lower leg/knee. Until I hear (or see who dresses next week) - I will assume that McD limited him, but not that he is in the “doghouse”. He is young and like when Singletary fumbled last year - you need to let him work through it. That was also a bad exchange - so it is not like the ball got ripped out - it was totally a lack of focus on Moss’s part.

He might be, but most likely if he is on the Bills - he is not the “safety valve” that he is for Alex Smith. Alex Smith is a short zone, west coast QB that uses RBs and TEs a lot. He did it in San Fran and KC before coming to Washington. Josh Allen is not that style of QB - he is slowly learning to use TEs and RBs, but he has been a pro style - WR driven QB. I honestly believe if Thomas is on this team - he is easily beat out by both Knox and Kroft (both of whom give you more upside) and Lee Smith is still their blocking back. His numbers in Washington not with standing - he would not be that player here. I do think Dabol would utilize his QB skills in his trick play catalog, but as a TE - Thomas is better suited in the role he is in now and will put up more numbers because of who he has at QB than if he was in Buffalo. Just my opinion, but I am happy for him and do not miss him or think what if - he is a former Bill for a reason.

Saw the stat at the end of the game - With his 33rd TD - Beasley has the most receiving TDs for a player 5’8 or shorter now NFL history. Amazing.

Not that I saw. Ike and Mongo started at guards - Winters was in after Mongo got dinged. When Mongo was ready - Winters returned to the bench. I think it also speaks to everyone that says McD plays favorites or won’t bench guys - He has repeatedly played with the o and d line to try and find combos that work. He is a learning coach and has gotten better game over game and year over year.

Just such a huge difference over 2 years ago and even last year - the way these WRs go up and make catches, toe drag swag plays, just all around. 2 years ago the narrative was Josh was inaccurate, but his WRs did him no favors. Passes were dropped and contested throws went incomplete. Last year you saw improvements with Beasley and Smoke, but the #2 outside receiver, TE, and RBs just couldn’t make plays. What a difference a year makes, the WRs all make plays, the TEs and RBs are making screens and swing passes a routine thing. Guys are just ballin and with Josh understanding more what is coming - what a combination.

Not really - Saw the stat earlier: Josh is the only QB this year with a >80 QBR against both the zone and man coverage. The dude has been picking everything apart. He is especially good against the zone when he is taking the easy throws.

I don’t think so. He was on the ESPN starter list, but I saw Mongo next to Williams in the huddle - my wife and I rewound and it was Ike and Mongo from play 1 - I believe - if not it was within the first 3 plays.

Been doing that a lot this season. Sort of breaks the ultra conservative mold some posters have labeled McD with. He is a darn fine coach and learning and adjusting each week - great job!

Ike started the game at LG with Mongo on the right. Winters came in for a few plays when Mongo was out, but they went right back to the starters with Winters on the Bench.

So does that mean the Hopkins play was not a Hail Mary as he was alone? One WR and one CB (it just happened that because it was the last play and the Bills played coverage - 2 safeties converged also). The Difference between the Hopkins play and the Raiders play was the defense. The Bills played coverage - so there were 3 guys deep forming the scrum. The Jets blitzed leaving the DB one on one. Would the Raider play have been a Hail Mary if there had been 2 additional deep safeties that converged on the catch?

Except that is exactly what a Hail Mary is - the difference was typically teams have 8 guys back there so everything becomes a scrum. In this case the prayer was answered because for the first time a DC sent 8 guys blitzing - so instead of a scrum of guys - it was no different than a pass in the first half. A Hail Mary would almost always look like that sans the extra DBs clogging the area.