Logic

Yeah. Also like…if they could give us a gimme game for the “last one ever at Highmark”, that would be great. Wanna go out on a winning note!

Indeed he was. Good prior to his time with the Bills, good after his time with the Bills. Mysteriously unable to get on the field during his time in Buffalo. Weird. Maybe he insulted McDermott's camo hat or something.

MVS was a weird case, but Poona Ford was even weirder. Dude was GOOD good last year for the Rams and parlayed it into a fairly lucrative 3 year deal. And it wasn't like the Bills were just overflowing with DT talent when Ford was unable to even get on the field here.

The other thing with Ogunjobi is that they signed him before they drafted Sanders and Walker. Sometimes the results of a draft can change your thinking on roster spots at a given position.

It's definitely an interesting question. My eyes are on an AJ Epenesa trade and/or a DaQuan Jones cut. They simply don't have room on the roster for everyone. And even IF they find a way to play the first six games with those guys, they'll need to make room once Ogunjobi and Hoecht return.

But to be fair, in the VERY NEXT GAME the Chiefs played, the Eagles were up 24-0 at the half and 34-6 at the end of the third quarter, largely because their defense was so exquisite. So while I get what you're saying about the way that Bills-Chiefs games have played out in the past, is it not reasonable to aim to have them play out differently in the future, namely by attempting to improve our defense to the degree that it doesn't always have to be a shootout with them? If no one had ever held the Chiefs down and bludgeoned them to death, then that would be one thing. But we saw both the Bucs and Eagles, on stages even bigger than conference championship games, shut down the Chiefs offense and not have to win with last minute offensive heroics. In both cases, effective defensive play was the primary culprit. Now maybe it's not a personnel issue. Maybe we simply don't have the defensive coaches to be able to accomplish what I describe above, and if that's the case, it's a whole different discussion. But seeing that teams that have beaten the Chiefs on big stages have largely done so with heroic defensive efforts, is it not reasonable to attempt to make wholesale improvements to our defense? Mind you, I want (and have wanted) a viable receiver added for a couple seasons now. But I would be remiss not to observe that just because PAST Bills-Chiefs games have been shootouts doesn't mean that we have to resign ourselves to the certainty that they always will be.

It feels like everybody's a little right and a little wrong. Beane DOES deserve come criticism for undervaluing the wide receiver position and for the fallout that has come from that. On the other hand, Beane's Bills have won five divisions in a row, consistently have a top five offense, and are coming off a season in which the Bills were 2nd in the league in PPG and their QB won an MVP award. It is almost certainly the DEFENSE which has been more to blame for the Bills' mounting playoff failures than the offense, and even those have arguably been more the fault of the coaching staff than the personnel. One can begin to understand the GM's frustration, then. Furthermore, the media, at times, still behaves the way they did during the drought. That is, Beane does not seem to have earned much benefit of the doubt. And to some extent, I get it! He has yet to bring a Super Bowl trip or a Lombardi to Buffalo, and until he does so, there will be questions and doubts -- especially considering the specific ways in which the Bills have been bounced from the playoffs every year. So all in all, some of the WR discussion IS warranted, and today's actions by Brandon Beane likely represented the culmination of his mounting frustrations, and the WGR guys were just in the wrong place at the wrong time. I bet that if you asked Beane and he was being honest, he'd tell you he wishes he had that interview back. That he could take a few deep breaths and have a do-over. Nothing is black and white in this world, and this situation is no different. There are layers. There is nuance. Unfortunately, we don't live in a world where sports media or the average fan are prepared to discuss and analyze layers and nuance in a reasoned and meaningful way.

To echo what others have said: I don't think you can do what Deone Walker did as a 19 year old in the SEC without having some serious talent. At the same time, all of the concerns that accompany a man of his size, as well as his 2024 falloff (injury related or not) are valid considerations. Put the two together -- his potential game-wrecking talent and the concerns on his tape and with his health/size/stature -- and you have exactly what the Bills got: a 4th round dart throw. In my opinion, the risk-reward with Walker is worthwhile. If he hits, you have exactly what his new GM described: a 1st round caliber player and a steal and a guy who can impact games in a big way. If he flops, the cost was a 4th round pick. The potential negative impact of a 4th round pick busting is not, in my opinion, severe enough to warrant not taking the risk on a guy like Walker. We all agree that the Bills need more difference makers and less "just okay to good" players around Josh Allen. Consider Deone Walker a definite swing of the bat with intent to hit a home run.

I'm surprised. They're going to need more bodies for camp alone, I would think. Or did they only go to camp with 5 RBs last year, too?

Agreed. WGR hosts spend hours and hours and hours on-air questioning the GM's moves, sometimes downright insulting his roster management....and then act completely flabbergasted and deeply insulted when they get the slightest amount of pushback? I think they're just not at all used to actually being challenged on air. They normally have the power over anyone that calls in, because they can (and do) just hang up on callers and then badmouth them and their talking points. Can't exactly do that with the GM of an NFL team. Whether I agree with Beane or not (and I mostly do), I think is response was funny and reasonable, and I think their defensiveness and snippiness after the call ("we're not here to be belittled") is petty and typical.

My main takeaway from Elijah Moore being the post-draft vet WR they bring in for a visit is: Either Amari Cooper really is cooked, or he's asking for too much money. It seemed like he was a good locker room fit here, had moments where he was productive in big moments, and typically Beane wouldn't like the idea of having spent a 3rd round pick for only a partial season of work. You'd think if they still felt Cooper had anything in the tank and/or if his asking price was reasonable, they'd bring him back. The fact that they're not doing so speaks volumes. As for Elijah Moore: Sure. Fine. Okay. Piling up replacement level journeymen WRs to put around Shakir and Coleman kinda seems to be their modus operandi these days. I'm sure he'll make a play or two some weeks and completely disappear other weeks, like any other guy in that group. It is what it is.

I've been one of the loudest "we need more WRs" voices the past couple seasons, but I respected Beane's demeanor and insistence here. It was certainly not his typical disposition on display. I think the WR questions in the post-draft presser kinda caught him off guard, and then he happened to tune into the WGR show today right at the point where they were harping on the WR thing, and he just said "enough is enough". I bet if you gave him 10 minutes to take a deep breath and think about it before he want on air, he would've handled it a little bit differently. But...these guys are human, and I don't blame him for speaking the way he did. It also wasn't as severe as people are saying. Mostly I think people are just over-reacting to him using the word "bitching". I can't argue much with what Beane said specifically: He can understand why people asked the WR question BEFORE last season, but after scoring more points than any other team in the NFL last season, the fan angst about WRs seems a bit misplaced. I also thought Beane's recent statement that it wasn't the offense letting them down in the playoffs, it was the defense (well, he didn't say the latter part, but it was implied) was on point. I want another WR, too, but the fan angst about WRs HAS gotten out of hand in my opinion. You can tell the hosts were caught off guard and were not expecting any pushback. The way they went to commercial after the segment: "We're not playing fantasy football, and we're not here to be belittled, either". Yikes.

In terms of who was actually on the board at WR when we made picks: I liked Jaylin Noel (though his skillset may have been a little redundant with Shakir as our locked in slot WR) in round 3. I liked Jalen Royals in round 4, and he could've been had without even needing trade up like they did for Deone Walker. With small trade-ups (the likes of which they deemed worth executing for the DTs), they also could've been in position for Dont'e Thornton or Kyle Williams. Alas, I'm not suggesting any of these guys would be THE difference or would be WR1s or anything like that. All of them would've simply added nice tools to the toolkit.

Fair. Guys like Troy Franklin, Jordan Whittington, and Devaughn Vele at least showed flashes of being legitimate contributors in year two and beyond, though. And of course the overall hit rate of late round receivers is generally quite low, but there are guys like Stefon Diggs, Antonio Brown, Puka Nacua who were drafted in later rounds. There doesn't appear to be one of THOSE types from the 2024 draft, but on the other hand, you never even get a CRACK at it unless you take a swing. I think I just wanted to see them take some more swings.

In fairness, DL was universally lauded as the strength of this draft class, whereas it was not a particularly strong or deep WR class. Now if you want to talk about LAST year's draft class, where WR was SUPER deep and the Bills didn't take advantage on day two or three, I'd be more than happy to. I'm still angry about it.

As for all the receiver talk: I just got done watching Beane's post draft presser. He is ADAMANT that they went "Best player available" until the last couple rounds. He said he would not have been able to sit and tell the press prior to the draft that they wouldn't be taking a receiver before the 7th round. He said they had receivers on the board they liked, but every time their pick came up, they had a player (or players) ranked higher at other positions, and they went with their highest ranked players. Now obviously GMs say a lot of things, and a certain amount of it is "coach speak". But watching Brandon's presser and doing my best body language detective work, he seems to be telling the truth. If you believe Brandon Beane, then I'm left with this sentiment: Just about everyone and their brother has said this offseason that drafting BPA is the way you build a good roster, and drafting for need is how you miss out on good players. I feel like everyone espouses this opinion UNTIL the GM doesn't draft a player at a position they're keen on, then all of a sudden it goes out the window. What I see a lot of people vouching for, essentially, is eschewing BPA and ignoring player value and taking a receiver simply because we "need" one. Now of course everyone's rankings and preferences differ, and maybe some of you had receivers ranked higher than some of the players the Bills took. But if you believe what Beane is saying, he did not ignore value just to take a receiver if he had a player ranked higher elsewhere, and he stuck to the board and took BPA, which is what everyone repeatedly begs him to do all offseason. If you want to argue with the way Beane and his staff value (or don't value) certain positions, what they prioritize positionally, etc, etc, then I won't fault you. But drafting a receiver just to draft a receiver is exactly what we all ask Beane NOT to do.

ok fine, how about this: they were second in the league in points per game.

We could all go 'round and 'round in circles about football philosophy, offense vs defense, etc, for hours, but sometimes it feels simple: Our offense last year scored the 18th most points in NFL history. Our defense last year was 29th in the NFL in EPA. We were the only team all year to give up 30 points to the Chiefs, and the Eagles showed the world in the very next game how very defendable they were. I wanted a WR too, and I hope the offense evolves this year. But it's hard to look at the above numbers and facts and conclude that anything other than heavy defensive investment was the most direct and logical way to attack the offseason.

I voted A-. Reasons I liked it: they attacked their biggest needs (DL and CB) logically, repeatedly, and with various skillsets and body types. They drafted mostly premium athletes with impressive RAS. They spent their first four picks on guys that posted excellent production in the SEC. They leaned into the strength of this draft class (DL). They moved up twice for guys they really liked instead of sitting around and risking losing out on them. Things I didn't like, which took it from an A to an A- for me: Regardless of correctly prioritizing the defense, I would've liked to see a receiver taken early. Day three Bills picks always feel weird to me, probably because they're taken primarily for their special teams contributions. The late round developmental offensive tackle tendency is funny, but these guys too often never see the field for the Bills.

I respectfully disagree. For his size, he is absolutely an unusually athletic man. So much so that they sometimes lined him up outside the tackle's shoulder and used him as an end and sometimes dropped him into coverage (!). Also, his first love is basketball and he still plays it to this day to keep his conditioning up. Athletic dude.

I totally agree with that statement. After this heavy an investment in the defense, if the Bills go into the playoffs and give up 30 to the Chiefs again, you have to start asking serious questions about Sean McDermott. You cannot continue to invest these types of resources into the defense and have it completely lay an egg in the playoffs. Full agreement with you on this.

Just thought I'd give a quick rundown of the Bills' draft class as I see it, with a few non-Bills draft thoughts as well. If this should be merged elsewhere, please do so. My favorite non-Bills draft class: Cleveland Browns - They got immediate help to their defense (blue chipper Mason Graham and LB Carson Schwesinger), offense (Quinshon Judkins, Dylan Sampson, Harold Fanin Jr), and most importantly, they attacked the QB position in an intelligent way, taking Dillion Gabriel and Shadeur Sanders in the middle rounds AND collecting a 2026 1st round pick that should help them climb the board if they like a QB prospect next year. Very savvy draft for a team not exactly known for them. My least favorite non-Bills draft class: Minnesota Vikings - Sure they didn't have many picks to work with, but they didn't exactly do anything to try to fix that by trading back to gain picks. They took an offensive lineman in the first round despite spending big money there in free agency and...proceeded to do not much else of note. Time will tell, of course, but when I look over the names, I see what feels like a wasted draft class. On to the Bills... Ask yourself a few simple questions, Bills fans: which side of the ball has been keeping Josh Allen and the Bills from reaching the Super Bowl once the playoffs hit, the offense or the defense? Which side of the ball performed more poorly in the AFC Championship game this year for the Bills? How did the Bills defense perform on third downs throughout 2024 and again in the AFCCG? If you answered those questions the way I think you did, then this draft class should make a ton of sense to you. The Bills attacked their consensus biggest defensive roster holes with multiple players with varying skillsets. In the case of the first four picks, all of them are premium athletes with impressive RAS. All of them had great production in the SEC. That, to me, was the first major through line of this draft: Productive college players in big time conferences who are also premium athletes. The other major through line of this draft was a common Brandon Beane principle once again being on display: drafting high ceiling, extremely physically gifted players and entrusting his coaching staff to maximize their talents. Max Hairston has unreal speed and athleticism which, combined with his eyes and instincts and aggressiveness, give him a sky-high ceiling and a playmaking potential we haven't seen in a Bills corner in years. Tre White should be the perfect mentor for him. TJ Sanders and Deone Walker are both excellent athletes and havoc-creating interior pass-rushers who, with refinement and NFL strength and conditioning programs, have the chance to be steals at their respective draft positions. Landon Jackson has a rare build and wingspan and was highly productive at Arkansas. He has the potential to be an edge-setting early down rotational lineman and, with added refinement and technique, to develop into much more than that. Beyond that, they took a smart and technical outside corner and what looks to be a positionally versatile slot corner/safety/special teams demon. On offense, they only take a blocking specialist TE3 (think Lee Smith but with a degree from Yale), a developmental o-lineman (they sure love doing this in late rounds) and a developmental outside receiver. I certainly hoped they'd take a wide receiver sooner and/or add a pass catching, kick returning running back type. But hey, when you score the 18th most points in a season in league history and then give up 30 points to a mediocre Chiefs offense in the AFCCG, you can hardly blame the GM for aggressively attacking the defense rather than the offense. All in all, the Bills sent a strong message with their free agent additions and with this draft class: Our defensive line wasn't good enough, our cornerback group wasn't good enough, our DEFENSE wasn't good enough. They did not sit on their hands. They very purposefully threw multiple resources at multiple players who all possess different skillsets on the line and in the secondary. The first result is that they now have quite an array of weaponry on the defensive lines. The mix and match combinations with guys like Groot, Bosa, Jackson, Oliver, Sanders, Walker, and eventually Hoecht and Ogunjobi are frightening. They leaned into the strength of this class and put heavy effort into remaking this line. The second result of this is that they suddenly have a very deep cornerback room. So deep, in fact, that a guy like Dane Jackson or Jamarcus Ingram may find himself on the outside looking in. Turning your two biggest defensive need areas -- DL and CB -- into deep pools of strength and versatility in one offseason? An impressive feat. Add in the litany of re-signing the Bills completed this offseason (keeping their young, homegrown core in tact for years to come), the internal improvement expected of guys like Kincaid and Coleman and Carter and Bishop, and you have a potentially improved Bills squad who once again looks ready to try to reach their first Super Bowl in 32 years. Not a bad few months of work, Mr Beane. On to camps.

Will Johnson Nic Scourton Tyliek Williams Walter Nolen Trey Amos Were all either a round higher or lower on our hero Joe Marino’s big board than where they wound up being drafted by NFL teams. No one is infallible. Rankings differ.

Not sure if positivity is still allowed in this thread, but here’s a glowing scouting report.