P51

Yes, maybe further, maybe not. Microfracture surgery is no joke, and many never come back from it, especially in the NBA for what its worth from what I remember. Torn Meniscus aside, this is a bigger deal IMO than many on this board are taking it, micro fracture surgery is a short term option, long term prognosis is usually not good if my memory serves me. Da'Quan Bowers fell like a rock in his draft partially over similar concerns with microfracture surgery, Clowney has not fully come back from it and may never, Terrell Davis could not, Bruce Smith did. They say the success rate is 75-80% but that means they played again, not necessarily at 100%, and not for a long time, the surgery itself usually results in shorter careers if they return at all. Its a surgery that does not actually fix the problem in a way that returns the knee to its pre-injury state. This is a concerning paragraph from 1 article (http://www.drdavidgeier.com/jadeveon-clowney-microfracture-surgery/) I found on it with a quick search, that echo's thoughts I have heard/read from doctors before: For small cartilage defects, microfracture is thought to have reasonable short-term success. Dr. Richard Steadman, who pioneered the surgery, found that 76% of the NFL players in whom he performed microfracture returned to play the following season. The long-term results after microfracture surgery are more concerning. A study of 24 NBA players who underwent the procedure showed that only 58.3% returned to play for more than one season after the surgery. Performance suffered greatly after players returned, with average points, rebounds, assists and minutes played dropping after microfracture. And one third of the players never returned play at all. For what its worth...

I have them taking Joseph in the 1st myself and looking back at his tape, my thought was that minus the injury he would be a top 20 lock. If the medical is good, he's a 1st rounder all day in this draft. The talking heads are starting to realize this and putting him in their mocks too, which leads me to believe his medicals are checking out. Aside from his talent, A. Williams is a neck injury/injury away from calling it a career IMO as well, and Graham is nearing the end, Joseph is an upgrade, and I'd prefer him in the 2nd, but I doubt he makes to the 2nd round. Id love to see him and his talent in Buffalo, he is a wealthy mans Earl Thomas, not a poor mans. I agree with every word you wrote, obviously you have read my posts and others here as well, LOL! I like Kuafasi in the 3rd round myself, w/out knowing who was still available in your mock, the 2nd round for reasons you state is possible. Again, I agree with your analysis and like his fit, especially being able to stand up and rush, providing versatility for a DE/OLB role in Rex's D. He is a good fit. I could see Jones in the 3rd, that is where his value is because of his punt returning ability, which I would add to your analysis, would love to see him in the 4th which is where I see his nickel CB (I agree he could come in and contribute in the field and boundary CB) value at, but I doubt he makes it there given his game breaking punt return ability. Preskott I am not as high on, he has progressed, but I have not put enough time on him to say much else. My gut doesnt like him in the NFL, but that means nothing. I like the the Henry pick and agree on all points. Lawler, Lewis and Goodson are all nice 3rd day adds. Overall, I thought it was a good mock!! Nice fits, analysis and most of all it made sense IMO. Good to see another poster putting in the time, being rational and posting on the board, welcome!!

That makes sense, I'd agree that's not him. If Detroit moves on from him, I'd love to see him resurrected in Buffalo...

I can see why, and from this article alone he has won me over. I agree on all fronts about his depth, it's refreshing.

Thanks for posting this Bloke! Reinforces my thoughts on Joseph (as discussed previously)and I thought Quinn was spot on in his analysis. I have never seen that sight or read Quinn before, I'll add it to my favorites. All about the rehab for Joseph.

I had a top 20 grade on him if my memory serves me, I am still catching flack for that. He may have been my biggest prospect crush in 2014, versatile, instinctive, very good movement skills in all directions and seemed like a pure football player, I did think he was a 34 guy and not a 43 I believe. I thought he should have come out in 2013, and have no clue what is going on with him in Detroit aside from a bad scheme fit.

The issue most have with Ragland is his coverage skills. Is he a physical presence I between the tackles? No doubt, can he rush the passer? Yes he can. The reason the articles don't mention coverage skills is its highly questionable as a skill set of his and limits his worth. Personally, if he fell into the second round a la Landon Collins last year I wouldn't mind so much making a move up to get him as IMO that is his value in the NFL today, early 2nd/late 1st depending on the team. Aside from playing different positions Collins and Raglands skill sets are relatively speaking the same. His movement skills forward are much better than backwards.

It has to be, if the knee is good, he's too good to fall far, durability is a concern, I wouldn't play him in the box much, but IMO he can play either safety spot and cover, 1st round all day if the knee checks out.

JMO: Watched some more of Joseph today, my notes read like Earl Thomas and I don't say this lightly as I had Earl Thomas as a top 10 guy early in the fall the year he was drafted, Joseph is more more physical in nature and is good in coverage and Thomas has better CoD skills, fluidity and over all discipline, really good in coverage. Aside from that their physical comp is nearly identical. Obviously we have no combine numbers to compare, but the tape I watched IMO showed more than enough speed, range, instincts and athleticism to compare him to Thomas and I think he'd be a great fit in a similar role for Buffalo. Graham is slowing down, A. Williams is a neck injury away from calling it a career and Joseph can play either S spot. If the medical is good, he's a 1st round player IMO with great leadership qualities. I think he's in play at 19 myself, he's better than Randall, Dix, Ward and Pryor, Vaccaro and Reid from the last 3 drafts. He's a wealthy mans Earl Thomas... With a knee issue. I would be thrilled if we landed him in the 2nd but he gone before that pick is made with any decent medical.

+1, I'm with you on the potential superstar over a potential starter/potential back up line of thinking. Always depends on who else is available, but I would have a hard time passing on Smith in the third unless the docs say no Bueno.

19: R1P19 S KARL JOSEPH WEST VIRGINIA Surprise pick, Joseph would form a formidable duo with A. Williams and might be the best S on the field day 1. 49: R2P18 DT VERNON BUTLER LOUISIANA TECH His ability to play multiple spots on the dline and ability make him the pick in this scenario. 80: R3P17 QB CARDALE JONES OHIO STATE He was the top QB available, fits the scheme and has the ability worth developing. 117: R4P19 CB CYRUS JONES ALABAMA Instantly the #1 punt returner, good depth at CB and solid 4th round value. 139: R4P41 DT D.J. READER CLEMSON Nose tackle of the future. 156: R5P17 WR KOLBY LISTENBEE TCU A vertical route nightmare paired with Watkins on passing downs w/Woods shifting inside. 192: R6P17 OLB ERIC STRIKER OKLAHOMA DPR, who can bend the edge opposite Hughes on passing downs. Wins with speed, balance and low center of gravity. 218: R6P43 ILB ELANDON ROBERTS HOUSTON Under appreciated in the draft media, not on this board, likely is gone, but wasnt in this mock, Boom. My favorite draft so far, no oline but back up QB and WR addressed and the D is restocked w/good fits and versatility.

I hope that he is taken with the 80th pick myself, if the Doc thinks he'll be good to go in 2017.

Nailed it. Flexability and versatility is what this move is all about, the counter to what Mario was not willing to do or accept. Its not an uncommon move, nor is its converse. Not an easy one, but it can work out. I did not see Wynn's fit as a DE in Rex's D, this move is more like rounding a square peg's edges to make it fit in a round hole, until a round peg can be found IMO. One of things that Seattle likes to do is this type of move, I had not thought they would move Frank, but it makes sense that they are doing it, they seem to be pro active like this as an organization, which helps lead to their success, even doing so in converting DT's to offensive lineman. IMO its good business if done correctly and the player has the ability, but requires patience usually.

That he certainly is not. UDFA with developmental potential for sure IMO. As for Seattle trading down: Seattle trading down = New England trading down Nothing to see here folks, move on...

Nailed it.

Im for drafting Ragland, just not in the 1st round, especially at 19, this comp is just more reason for me.

Personally I dont see the value for the Bills positionally, if they were to look for a high pointer in the first round IMO Josh Doctson would be better, more explosive leaper, 9 inches better in the vertical jump. I think there are too many defensive players in this draft to not go D in the 1st for Buffalo this year myself.

Id be shocked if he is drafted, signed as a UDFA would be pretty surprising as well.

This fits the mold of what Rex has done in the past, moving Coples and Pace from DE to OLB. Suggs made the transition as well if my memory serves me. If Wynn can cut the weight and add some agility and speed, could be an effective depth player with some existing pass rush ability, a solid 3rd down rotational rusher in the scheme Rex wants to run, in addition to being able to set the edge and contribute in run support rotationally as well. Keeps doors open draft wise as well.

True and he's absolutely right. His mother might be a social media thorn, but IMO he is going to be a stud, and Buffalo will be fortunate if he is on the board at 19. #LeePlease...

Ill take your word on the Bama coverages, sounds right from my thoughts during the game. I hadnt noticed that aspect of Greens awareness (blindside block), but that fits my concern for his feel for the game, as does the Howard TD in the 3rd Q if he was the deep safety (Single High or C2/3, IDK what he was), rule #1 of safety play as taught to me in college: deeper than the deepest, its really simple (You the safety have to be deeper than the deepest receiver.) in any zone coverage as a FS. Again an awareness issue. As for Kearse, I couldnt agree more. He looks like a monster physically, but other than that, I just dont get it. He looks like Chancellor, but that is where the comparisons end, he certainly does not play like Cam did at Tech. "Just a Guy." true...

Maybe in the 3rd-4th round for Buffalo IMO as a developmental FS/Cover S. He has the physical tools and certainly is a Height/Weight/Speed guy who would probably go in the 1st if Al Davis was still alive and drafting for the Raiders. His open field tackling is almost as bad and DeAndre Houston-Carson (who I love as a coverage S/CB as well), his natural feel for the game and natural reaction time are lacking, he IMO is also maddeningly inconsistent from game to game. He'll probably go in the 2nd round, but wont contribute much his first year or two IMO, which is why I wouldnt touch him until the 3rd at the earliest. OJ Howard tore someone apart in that game, I have not rewatched it, but I remember asking my buddy during the game: "Where the safeties?" I remember thinking and still do, that I could not believe Kearse is draftable. He seems so indifferent and his CoD skills are less than impressive, he is physically imposing but more inconsistent than Green and terrible in coverage, add that to him appearing indifferent on the field, some real tackling issues of his own, and my belief he has no intrinsic fire in him and IMO he's a UDFA/7th round developmental/practice squad guy at best. Thurmanator said it right IMO, his injury was a non contact, but durability coupled with playing style is a real concern. Love his play though, 1st round field talent.

I think Wentz has the higher upside overall, but Goff is more pro ready with the speed of his reads and quicker decision making initially.

Interesting, I have a similar trade in the mock I am working on now. Here is what I had, in comparison I think the Rams over paid but moving from 15 to 1 is a big jump, so I get it. I had them moving up for Wentz with the Eagles moving up to 6 for Goff after the Cowboys took Elliot at 4, Browns take Jack, Chargers take Tunsil, Jags take Ramsey, 49ers trade 7 to NOLA who takes Bosa. *Trade* Tennessee trades the 1st pick to Los Angeles for picks #15, #43, #45, #110 in the 2016 draft and the Rams 1st round pick in the 2017 draft. TVC = #1 - 3000 pts, #15,43,45,110 – 2044 pts + 2017 1st Round; +/- 1000 pts (16th pick) = +/-3044 pts. 1 – L.A. Rams (via. Tennessee) – Carson Wentz (QB – N. Dakota St.) The Rams pay the price to get their franchise QB, and Wentz has all of the tools. Jerry Rice came from a small school and is the WR GOAT, I don’t think Wentz will be a QB GOAT, but he has the tools to be an excellent NFL QB, big arm, accurate in the pocket and on the run, can make pre and post snap reads, calls at the line, intangibles and he’s very athletic. Does he need some work? Yes, they all do and Wentz locks onto receivers as much as anyone, but has shown the ability to do more. The future is now for the Rams. Grade: Top 10 If I were the Rams GM, I would do what they did, I like the move on behalf of both teams.

#19 and # 49 this year and next years #1. #5 = 1700 pts #19 = 875 and #49 = 410; Total 1285 415 point difference, which is the value of actual mid 2nd round pick, but future draft trades almost always involve a +1 round value. The 2017 draft 2nd round value is really a 1st round commodity in a 2016 trade. Given the history of NFL draft trades, IMO this (2016; 19 + 49 overall + 2017 1st = 2016 #5) would be the trade.