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Of course no fan is going to effect what the team does. What a ridiculous thing to say. You're welcome to log off and never post again if you think you're so righteous that you get to dictate what can and can't be discussed. And I'm sorry that you don't know what" essentially" means. They're mathematically alive to start December again. If it makes you feel better the annual Brandon thread can resume in a week.

Fun thread. Offense: L. McCoy Defense: J. Hughes Honorable mentions: M. Gillislee, K. Williams, R. Woods, A. Williams

I would agree with you, if you just accept it as a regular old loss...but it's not. We essentially eliminated ourselves from the playoffs. We did it in classic fashion, blowing a lead and looking like a pee wee football team going away. It's now 17 years and counting. This is exactly the right time to sit back and go, "who is responsible for this mess again?".

This is a pretty level headed evaluation. My only issue is that now we are three years (counting the Orton season) with no playoffs that could have been used to start and develop EJ. When we inevitably ditch Tyrod (could be this offseason, could be 2019), we will at best be no better than we would have been sticking with our guy. Now we are nowhere, again. I see Taylor's ceiling as being reached in his first start with us. He doesn't play with the attitude of someone that's learning and improving. Hopefully Jones (I'm really not holding out much hope here) or a draft pick step in and play with this team like Big Ben's rookie year...ultra conservative BUT with the ability to grow into the position and take chances as they develop the pre-snap skills to really read NFL defenses.

I think he's here to stay as well. It seems pretty obvious that executives of his ilk dig their talons in to stick around. Promoting him to President of Sabres + Amerks pretty much solidifies that he's not going anywhere. I don't think it's a useless discussion though. Russ is the smoking gun, tower 7, and area 51. He's our moon landing.

As much as I would have rallied around this in the past, what's done is done. They hedged their bets on Taylor. It's time to move on. EJ may have had more upside, but it would never come to be with this organization. I'm not even sure at this point what would happen if we had drafted Carr. Would we suddenly have this great emerging star or would he turn out more like his brother?

That depends. Is hiring the head coach a football decision?

The offense fell apart yesterday? Nope, didn't notice it... ...are you serious? Edit: not to be too harsh, but dude this is being discussed in like ten threads right now.

You're the only one bringing up EJ, dude. Time to move on...

I'd rather have Kyle Williams because he is not 48 years old.

Like QB. If you simply swapped Taylor and Carr, but kept the teams otherwise constant, can you imagine us crumbling late in the game like that?

He's definitely responsible for the hiring of Doug Marrone, and not letting Rex Ryan leave the building. I suspect he's made more ridiculous decisions, but those are the only ones I know he was directly reaponsible for. As a "collaborator" and a guy Whaley, Nix, etc. have had to run everything by, he has a terrible track record. I continue to pine for Russ Brandon's removal, but I no longer point to things other than what he's directly admitted to. I feel like it keeps the weirdos that for some reason support him at bay.

I hated Jauron's style more than any in the post-Levy era, but I'll say this... he never once coached with half the talent we have on this team.

Fair point. It will be a lot pressure for the next guy. Tough shoes to fill. 31 other teams have a chance to be the worst as well. Just hope our guy is ready for the challenge and prepared to give up on 2-3 routes per passing down.

Not even close. You're focusing on all the wrong things and making it personal. Taylor hit his ceiling the first week he played for us. He has no chance of improving. This is it, it's all he's got. No one ripping on tyrod is delusional enough to pretend he's not an impressive athlete. He is definitely elusive. Once in a very long while he will pick up a tough first down with his feet. Most of the time (especially in the fourth quarter when you NEED to throw) he's nearly useless at QB. He'll be 28 next year and I have no reason to assume he'll suddenly learn how to lead a receiver. Great athlete, below average QB.

What? We lead the NFL in rushing. Our QB averages the most time to throw in the league.

"You know, I finally figured it out! You sound just like Donald Trump" Character assassination is so easy, and yet it's your go-to. Every time.

As funny as this is, I will say that the WR complaint is one that was brought up several times before the season began. It seemed thin in the offseason, in training camp, at the start of the season and especially when everyone decided to go get injured. I relented a bit when he brought in Hunter, though I still think the Harvin move (while not really being a risk) wasn't necessarily a step forward (see: migraines). Can you predict these injuries? No, of course not. Can you be more prepared for Watkins and Goodwin to miss significant time? Absolutely. It doesn't mean you have to wheel and deal, it just means maybe pick up an Anquain Bolden to get a stable veteran presence at the position. I certainly would have preferred that to the Reggie Bush pick up.

Seriously? You literally did the same thing, not even two years ago.

^^^Ah yes, the elusive phantom pressure that we're all making up and isn't happening at all. q1 7:04 - COVERAGE SACK: I would consider that play to be a perfect example of, had he stayed in the pocket, he would have been fine. After looking at the play where you determined no one was open, you should rephrase that to, no one was "wide open". It's the NFL, receivers in one-on-one coverage with no safety help are not blanketed if you lead them correctly.

No crap. My point was that no one is arguing Tyrod isn't a dynamic running QB that plays it safe. Of course he is. He is, if nothing else, an electric player that doesn't take chances. Your stat did a good job of indicating that. I didn't say you fudged the numbers at all, I'm just suggesting that they don't tell the whole story, the story of Taylor as a passing QB.

2015 Passing Touchdowns list (Top 20...err 21): 1 Tom Brady*.............36 2 Eli Manning*...........35 3 Blake Bortles..........35 4 Carson Palmer*......35 5 Cam Newton*+.......35 6 Russell Wilson*.......34 7 Drew Brees............32 8 Matthew Stafford....32 9 Derek Carr*............32 10 Aaron Rodgers*...31 11 Ryan Fitzpatrick...31 12 Philip Rivers.........29 13 Kirk Cousins.........29 14 Andy Dalton.........25 15 Ryan Tannehill.....24 16 Jameis Winston*..22 17 Matt Ryan............21 18 Jay Cutler.............21 19 Ben Roethlisberger* 21 20 Alex Smith...........20 21 Tyrod Taylor*.......20 You included a ratio, and added rushing touchdowns to make Taylor's numbers appear elite. The problem is that on a purely passing scale, he's simply put, below average. You need to score to win, and as cute as efficient ratios might be, it's the reason we only scored 7 points and lost to the Ravens in Week 1.

I would expect several CB picks. Mills is the weak link, for sure. What's wrong with Cyrus?

So, you didn't answer my question and instead went off about fantasy football and stats? I'll again ask... How good do you think Tyrod Taylor is, compared to the rest of the starting QB's in the league?