OldTimer1960

So, to be clear, which of the 6 or 7 certain all-star NFL QBs should the Bills take in this year's draft? Of course, if there are that many certain future Pro-Bowl QBs, I agree with the idea of "let's just draft one of 'em".

Agreed, but it doesn't look like any of the QBs in this draft are the long-term answer either.

I agree. I think the Bills have a very good level of DL talent and in the secondary (assuming they can keep Jairus Byrd). They need LB help and coaching help. They underachieved very considerably last year. I do think that the vanilla scheme that was run hurt them badly. As Pettine said, you have to disguise what you are doing. Offenses do it all the time, why wouldn't a defense do it? Most of the good defenses do a good job of confusing the offense.

You may be right to say that there will be good starting QBs to come out of the draft, but it might really be as bad a year as the "experts" feel. 2-3 good starting QBs coming out in a single draft is really a very good year. There are plenty of years where no good starting QBs emerge from an entire draft. For instance, look at the 8 year period from 1990-1997. Here are the starting QBs that came out in those 8 years: Excellent Starters: Brett Favre Drew Bledsoe Steve McNair Mark Brunell OK Starters: Neil O'Donnell Trent Dilfer Gus Frerotte Kerry Collins Jake Plummer In that same 8 years, here are all the QBs drafted in rounds 1 and 2: Rnd 1 Jim Druckenmiller Steve McNair Kerry Collins Heath Shuler Trent Dilfer Drew Bledsoe Rick Mirer David Klingler Tommy Maddox Dan McGuire Todd Marinovich Jeff George Andre Ware Rnd 2 Jake Plummer Tony Banks Todd Collins Kordell Stewart Matt Blundin Tony Sacca Brett Favre Browning Nagle So, only 4 very good starting QBs came out of 8 consecutive drafts. 5 more "OK" guys whom might compare reasonably with Alex Smith also came out during that time - but those guys fall into the "they're OK, but their team was always looking to replace them category". Beyond those, there were a host of guys taken in the first 2 rounds that didn't pan out at all. They were drafted high because teams desperately needed QBs. In 1999, the following QBs were taken in the first round: Tim Couch, Donovan McNabb, Akili Smith, Daunte Culpepper and Cade McNown. Shaun King was the only 2nd rounder. 1 of those 6 turned out to be pretty good. There are dry-spells and there are drafts where multiple good QBs come out. I think that you have to trust your evaluation of the players coming out and balance that with taking a "shot" on a QB reasonably often. Here is a link to NFL.com where there is a list of QBs drafted by year and round. I think looking at it, most will conclude that there are very few good starting NFL QBs in most drafts and it is very difficult to find them. http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft?type=position

I am not saying that they shouldn't draft a QB, just that they need someone (besides that rookie) to start this year and perhaps longer. From everything that I have seen and read, there are no really good "rookie gunslingers" coming out in this draft. It happens - some years there are no good NFL QB prospects in the draft. What we've seen recently with strong QB drafts is the exception rather than the rule.

The problem, at least as I see it, is that there are only very shaky QBs in this draft with each being a long-shot to develop into a good starting QB. I'd rather have Alex Smith for a few years, take a flyer on a rookie to see if we get lucky and (assuming we don't) then go all-in next year to get a better rookie prospect. Alex Smith isn't Tom Brady, but he could be a winner with a great D and running game - exactly what the Bills are trying to build (and they have a lot of the parts).

Thank you! I don't know why this is such a big topic for some people. Look at offenses in the league. In the same game they often play 2 rbs, 1 rb, 2 TEs, 0 TEs, 2 WRs, 3 WRs and sometimes 4 WRs. They also have the QB under C and in the shotgun, sometimes they even run a wild-cat with 0 QBs. If an offense can play that many different sets in the same game, why is it so hard to believe that a defense can play multiple sets in a game?

OK, sorry if I missed an inside joke. I still have the same view, even if it doesn't necessarily apply to this specific case.

I agree completely. First, all of these guys are professional athletes who spend far more time working on their craft than many here realize. Just for that they deserve some respect. Add in that Kyle Williams is one of the best players on the Bills and does it with tremendous work-ethic and attitude and this disrespect is just awful. I know that it is easy to be emboldened by the anonymity of a message board. I also know that many of the sports "journalists" who we follow (especially locally) are particularly snotty, flippant and disrespectful. However, I'd hope that we can raise the level of civility a bit here. It is certainly fair game to be critical and state opinions - after all that is part of what a message board is about, but try to do so respectfully.

Definitely in hind-sight it would have been better to take Russell Wilson instead of TJ Graham, however the book isn't written on either. Wilson has been great this year, but you never know if defenses will devise a way to neutralize him by keeping him in the pocket and letting his height work against him. Graham had a disappointing year, but he does have some physical talent. Anyway, I get your point and I don't disagree strongly. Once past the 2nd round, the "opportunity cost" of taking a flyer isn't that high so fire away.

I respectfully disagree with the options listed besides Alex Smith. Clausen was given his shot and the Panthers thought so little of him that they drafted Cam Newton after one year with Clausen. Colt McCoy appears to be another Fitz - smart, try-hard guy who doesn't have the physical talent to be a good starter. While Kellen Moore looked OK in the pre-season and was great in college, he is a very long-shot to be even a decent starting QB. I'll admit that Moore seems to have a special ability to time passes, but his arm is so weak and his body so frail (for the NFL that is) that defenses would quickly catch on to him if he played more than a little bit. These are just my opinions...

You assume that there is no opportunity cost (ie what else you could have had using the pick otherwise) when you take shots at QB prospects. I think that there still needs to be judgement applied when considering QB prospects. A bunch of flawed QB prospects isn't any better than what the Bills currently have and there are still plenty of other holes to fill on this team (WR, TE, LB, CB, RT...)

C'mon man, how much time did you really spend reading my 2 or 3 3 sentences? Did you REALLY need to make your smart-ass comment? Didn't that also waste people's precious time, as you suggest? I'm thinking that you like to see your snarky comments as you sit in your parent's basement... i don't really want to have a running argument with you. I try to add thoughtful comments to this message board. I don't have time to read every post, so I beg everyone's pardon if someone else has the same opinion. Lighten up Francis.

If GR has to hang their hat on Schoop, then I pity them. He is an arrogant as*. His "I am smarter than all NFL coaches nonsense with never punting on 4th down is a joke. He is annoying on every level as a self-appointed know-it-all. If his comedy schtick was any good at all, he MIGHT be amusing...

Oh, forgive me for not having read every single post in the thread. I hope that you won't ban me from the board. There are some people here that need to work on being a lot less snotty. Nobody thinks these smart-ass comments are funny.

One guy that I'd like to see back from Gailey's staff is Joe D'Allisandris (sp?). I thought that he did a very good job with the OL, especially considering how many injuries they dealt with.

I concur. The gamble that the Bills took on (I have already forgotten his name) the DL/OL that was over 400 lbs from the lowest level of competition looked like a better bet at the time. The guy was a real athlete for someone his size and had at least shown that he would try to get in shape. He didn't work out. The Burfict story is not that uncommon, other than it did seem to workout this time (that IS uncommon).

Not sure I understand your post. Are you saying: 1. Tim Graham actually knows who the best coaches in the NFL are and that it is THAT black and white? 2. It was NOT Andy Reid's fault that he moved his OL coach to DC and that the Defense then struggled? 3. Lovie Smith was not culpable for the Bears' offensive short-comings? 4. Supposedly great coaches Mike Tomlin and Rex Ryan didn't get their teams to the playoffs this year? C'mon, I'd take Chan over Rex. Which QB do you think had better talent: Sanchez or Fitz? I'd say Sanchez, but he regressed significantly under Ryan. Tomlin (like most coaches) couldn't get his beat-up Steelers team to the playoffs after they lost several defensive players and QB Ben Roethlisberger... My point isn't to deride your opinion, only to say that "coaching evaluation" is a lot less black and white than many here want to believe. You can put a great CEO in charge of a company that makes poor quality products (or products that nobody wants) and they will fail or it will take a long time to turn that around. The Bills have dug a deep hole to climb out of, but I firmly believe that there is MUCH more talent on the roster now than there was 3 years ago. I think a good, innovated defensive coaching staff could turn the Bills into a top 15 defense in one offseason without any big additions. A little better LB group and the improvement could be more. On "O", I think the BIG challenge is to find a good QB - not as simple as MANY want to believe. BTW, Bill Bellichick's record was under .500 as a HC before NE hired him.

OMG, man! You are holding the Bills responsible because: 1. their rookie CB had ups and downs (Gilmore)? Look around and tell me how many rookies DON'T struggle sometimes. 2. Their 3rd round pick from 3 years ago is "only" a good kick blocker and good/not great run defender who has a knack for knocking down passes. 3. Marcel Dareus' play "dropped off" (in your opinion) after his brother died and Kyle WIlliams played hurt next to him much of the year. 4. Torrell Troup hurt his back. How was the staff to know that might happen? 5. Bradham only started for 4-5 games? How many 3rd rounders this year started more? 6. Your going to hang the team for 4th, 5th 6th and 7th rounders not starting/panning out? Look around at the rest of the league and tell me what the success rate with those rounds is (not high at all). It isn't enough to just cherry pick a small hand full of low-round picks that have succeeded. That is definitely not the norm. The money picks are rounds 1 and 2 and some of the Bills' street free agent pickups (Urbick, Pears, Kyle Moore...) are positives. I'll give you that Aaron Williams doesn't look like he is going to pan out (#2 pick in 2011), but show me a team that hits all of their top 2 picks.

ing experience, including the past four as the Broncos offensive coordinator. Last season, his reputation around the NFL soared as a result of his handling of the transition from Kyle Orton to Tim Tebow. He completely overhauled his scheme in the middle of the season to accommodate Tebow's specific skill set. The Broncos finished the season with the NFL's No. 1 rushing attack. This season, he has smoothly transitioned his offense to suit Peyton Manning. They are currently ranked fourth in passing. Those rankings highlight McCoy's flexibility and willingness to adapt his scheme to his personnel. If the man can win a division title, and win a playoff game against the Steelers with Tim Tebow at QB.... Or was it the combination of McCoy as OC, John Fox as HC with Jack Del Rio as DC? Still, Tim Tebow? http://www.nfl.com/n...oach-candidates from another thread... http://profootballta...e-a-head-coach/ Or maybe it was the extremely good defense that Denver had/has that allowed them to win with Tebow? I think Pittsburgh might've scored enough to beat Denver if the Broncos' D wasn't outstanding... IMHO, the next head coach must possess the following characteristics: 1. He must be a good leader. Not necessarily "fiery" or "demonstrative", but the players must know who is in charge and want to follow him. 2. He must be able to identify and bring in a top-quality assistant coaching staff. IMHO, Gailey's inability to bring in a quality DC doomed him. I admit that I thought that Dave Wannestadt would succeed, but I believe that the league's offenses have passed his vanilla schemes by. It is very hard for me to believe that a team with Mario Williams, Marcel Dareus, Kyle Williams, an improving Alex Carrington and others could be as bad on D as the 2012 Bills were...

I think the two most important qualities the new coach has to have are: 1. leadership - it needs to be clear that he is in charge and that he can command the respect of his players. 2. Can attract a quality assistant coaching staff - This is part ability to identify good coaches and part having the right connections to get those coaches.

The Browns were 5-11 in his last season in Cleveland (after that 3-1 start) and his overall record in Cleveland was 36-44 (.450 winning percentage). The point wasn't so much that Bellichick was a bad coach in Cleveland, but rather that a great coach could have a losing record in a previous stint and do (much) better in a different situation.

It seems that many here will be unhappy with whomever the Bills hire unless it is Bill Parcells, Jon Gruden, Don Shula or Vince Lombardi (yes, I know he is dead). Look at the teams that have been good over the past few years and where their coaches came from: 1. New England - Bellicheck bombed in Cleveland and NOBODY here would have been worried when the Pats hired him. He might be the best coach in the league, but maybe it is mostly Tom Brady???? 2. Baltimore - John Harbaugh was not a "big name" hire, but he has kept them competitive. Harbaugh was a ST coach for 9 years, then was a DB coach for one year before the Ravens hired him. 3. Pittsburgh - They missed the playoffs this year and might be aging, but they have been good for a long time. Mike Tomlin was an aggressive assistant, not a huge name Jimmy Johnson type. Tomlin was DB coach in Tampa where they had a good defense, then was DC in Minnesota when they led the league in D against the run, but were last against the pass. He was a young "hot-name". 4. Houston - Gary Kubiak - former backup QB and OC under Shanahan. Has done a pretty good job, but was in a bit of trouble until Wade Philips turned his defense into a monster. May be in trouble again if Houston's fade continues. 5. Indy - Didn't matter who was the coach when Peyton Manning was there. Bruce Arians is a hot name now, but I'd be leery of him - did he just get lucky that Andrew Luck played very well and the team was ultra-motivated to do well for Chuck Pagano? 6. Giants - Tom Coughlin - boring and old, but has done a great job keeping the Giants competitive for years. I think he came from Boston College which was no college football power. 7. Philly - Andy Reid - Eagles were always challengers until the last 2 years. I think he is a good coach, but there are questions about his player evaluation skills. 8. Green Bay - Long-time assistant who spent time "developing" immortals like Rich Gannon, Elvis Grbac, Steve Bono and Aaron Brooks. The year before GB hired him, he was SF's OC and they finished last in the NFL in points scored and yards gained. He is doing a great job in GB, though - is it mostly his QB? 9. SF - Jim Harbaugh - he was a hot name after doing well at Univ SD and Stanford. I've probably missed one or two good teams, but the point is that a lot of these guys were not considered "great hires"/"saviors" when they were hired. Their backgrounds are varied. As the Bills go into their coaching search, keep the different backgrounds here in mind and try to maintain an open mind.

Thank you for a little ray of positiveness in this otherwise overwhelmingly negative thread. I believe that many on here will think whomever they hire will be "bottom of the barrel" unless it is Don Shula, Bill Parcells or Jon Gurden.

Oh no, they aren't interviewing Vince Lombardi!!!!