OldTimer1960

I am with you, with the exception that I think a trade back into round 1 will cost too much. I would not be interested in trading this year's 2nd and next year's 2nd (for example) to back into round one to take any of these QBs. If they feel that they absolutely *have* to grab one of these guys, I'd sit tight in round 2 and take whoever is left of Nassib, Manuel and Tyler Wilson.

I miss Buchbaum's work also. I loved his guide - he worked hard analyzing on his own, but better, he was really connected to people in the league.

Get a GOOD QB (a young QB is not sufficient, IMHO). If there are no GOOD QBs available, suck it up and find good players at other positions and try again next year.

I like what I have read about Geno Smith, but I think that you can't "mature" into a leader. His personality is not bad, but it doesn't seem like he is a dominant, attention commanding, leader. Look at many of the great QBs: Kelly, Marino, Brady, Elway, Manning, Brees, etc - these guys had BIG personalities. They had command, people followed them. I don't know if Geno Smith has that.

If you mean "big splash" as in: "we took an iffy QB prospect over great talent at other positions, just to say we have one", then yes.

Cousins WAS available into, what, the 4th round? I think that if the Bills had wanted him, they'd have drafted him. Be careful with declaring him to be great based on 1 start where the opposition had no scouting on him in the NFL. Yes, he played well for one game. I remember when Dennis Shaw was rookie of the year for the Bills at QB. He was never heard from again.

Oh stop, please. The message was "We recognize that we have been terrible for a long time. We want to become contenders and will take steps that we deem prudent to do so."

The "Honey Badger" has been booted out of LSU's program even though he played at a high level for the school. I think that we better ponder just how big of a dope he had to be to accomplish that feat. Further, he is very undersized for the NFL. He is likely, at best, a nickel corner who lacks the size to play bigger receivers. He was listed at 5'9" 175lbs by LSU's program. That is likely generous - and that is Roscoe Parrish size. That doesn't mean that he isn't a great athlete, but can you see him trying to cover any of the 6'+ 210+ WRs in the NFL? Now, I'll admit that I'd be intrigued with taking him in the 3rd or 4th with the sole purpose of covering Wes Welker.

The average length of career is far less than 8 -10 years, so not a big surprise that there aren't many players drafted 8 years ago that are still with the team that picked them. Only a few truly excellent and durable players last that long. That does not mean that teams shouldn't bother to evaluate players or that they don't know what they are doing. The draft is essentially a hiring exercise and I would wager that the hiring success rate is as high or higher than most businesses manage.

Fair point and I agree that I don't know, either. However, I don't remember Reid getting such great production out of lower drafted QBs. I remember him drafting Donovan McNabb high in round 1 and winning with him for a long time. He also won a lot with Brett Favre (admittedly acquired via trade - but still great). After McNabb, there was a brief Kevin Kolb sighting (not lighting up the track) and then former 1st round pick Michael Vick took over. He did coax a good season out of Jeff Garcia one year after McNabb was injured. Reid really didn't have a ton of success in Philly after McNabb left (hence, he is now in KC).

I respectfully disagree with your point- or at least question how you came to know that "it's obvious that Reid wants to win now and not wait on a rookie QB". How do you know that is the case? How do you know that he didn't look at the draft class and determine that (he doesn't think) that there are any future good starting QBs in there? In fairness, I don't know that your guess isn't right and mine wrong. I also don't understand why you would say that "With the pieces they (Chiefs) have, it makes sense (to try to win now and take a lesser established vet over a supposedly higher potential rookie). The Bills are in a different place." If you accept that the Fitzpatrick was no better or worse than Cassel, then on balance the Bills were a better team than KC last year (based on W-L record). How would you conclude that KC is ready to win now with a veteran QB that is likely above average, but not great? Why would you think that Andy Reid in his first year with KC - a team with the worst record in the league - wouldn't have the same luxury of "waiting on a rookie QB" that Doug Marrone will be afforded? I'd argue that Reid's track record would give him even more slack to live with growing pains from a young QB than the unproven Marrone.

Yes, his stats were good in the Big East, but stats can be deceiving: Geno Smith: 4200yds, 72% completions, 42 TDs, 6 INTs Colt McCoy 2008: 3900 yds, 77% completions, 34 TDs, 8 INTs Tim Tebow career: 66% completions, 88 TDs, 16 INTs I am not saying that Geno Smith will be good or bad, only that stats can lie. I'll also say that Andy Reid clearly liked Alex Smith better than Geno Smith.

If QB guru Andy Reid thinks that he was better of trading a high 2nd round pick plus a pick next year for Alex Smith, I think that says a LOT about how little he thinks of all the QBs in this draft. With the 1st overall pick he could have had his choice of all of them. If he wanted to wait until the 2nd, I think he would have still had 1st shot in round 2. More evidence that the Bills should stay away from any of these guys in round 1 & 2.

I haven't read about Bray's off-field issues (if any) nor his alleged bad "intangibles". However, if he had two likely very early draft picks playing WR for him in Cordarrelle Patterson and Justin Hunter and still had a bad won-loss record (5-7), how is he a good prospect?

Sounds like Alex Van Pelt and Ryan Fitzpatrick and....

I also agree. He seems to have spectacular hands. Can he get open at the NFL level is the question.

Love the idea. I remember a bunch of folks (or a few multi-posting folks) banging the drum for Dan Leferve (sp) a few years ago. I'll get started, I was all against drafting Cam Newton. I guess I was wrong...

You can tell all that from an interview with the media? I am not trashing EJ Manuel or any of the other QBs, it is just that I don't know how you can tell anything about any of these player's leadership skills from those media interviews. At best, in my opinion, you can tell whether a guy is reasonably well-spoken and how comfortable they might be in the spotlight.

I do concede that every player has certain strengths and weaknesses. Brady, Manning, Brees, etc wouldn't be as effective if their game plans revolved around the QB running (or being a running threat). None of the 3 that I listed have the very strongest arms in the league either, so I think if you have them throwing bombs all day that would not be playing to their strengths. However, they have enough arm strength to say that they aren't just good "short" passers. These guys are also forceful leaders who are very smart and get their teams into the right plays to take advantage of a defense's weaknesses. If the point of this thread is that there are "perfect" QBs who would be great running any type of offense, then I disagree to an extent. However, there are definitely guys who have more strengths than other guys. I think it is more accurate to say a "system" QB is more a "limited" QB. Guys like Chad Pennington were "system" QBs in my opinion. Pennington lacked arm strength, especially after multiple shoulder injuries. He was able to succeed to a certain degree by running an offense that didn't rely heavily on deep and intermediate passes.

That is a good point, but Brady is consistently better than Cassel was in his one year starting in NE. Check out Brady's Passer Rating from 2007-2012: 07: 117 08: INJ 09: 96 (coming off major knee injury) 10: 111 11: 106 12: 99 Cassel's one year starting in NE he had a passer rating of 89.4. Pretty good, but not at Brady's level. Further, Cassel did put in one very good year in KC with a passer rating of 93. I know that passer rating is not a be-all in terms of how a QB has performed, but it is a pretty good indicator. I think that Brady would not be as effective in certain systems, however the same can be said for almost every player. You are correct that a team's offense has to play to the strengths of their QB (and OL, and WRs and RBs etc), but I don't think there is much argument that Brady is an outstanding QB - much better than Matt Cassel.

I think that it is more Brady makes the system successful than the system makes Brady successful. I don't like Brady, but I respect that he might be the best QB ever.

Again, just because they did not tender him, it does not necessarily mean that they won't try to sign him. He is coming off a season in which he didn't play at all. I don't think any team is going to break the bank for him.

No thanks, I'd pass on both, too. Of the two, I'd look at McCoy as a nice backup.

Tendering a player guarantees him a certain salary. Nelson is coming off a year in which he played 0 plays. This does not necessarily mean that they won't try to re-sign Nelson. It may only mean that they think they can sign him for less than the tender would cost them.