Red Squirrel

My first reaction when I saw the replay was that he might possibly have had no idea what he was doing; he absolutely got crushed on that catch. I have no idea how he held onto it. Seeing it again, I kinda think he knew what he was doing.

ASU coach Todd Graham was Clay's coach at Tulsa and also has spoken highly of him. I can't remember the specific things he said, but it was more or less holding Clay up as an example for what he wanted from his TEs. Rose mentioned in this interview using Clay out of the backfield, and I did notice in his college stats that Tulsa handed the ball off to him a lot.

I thought he got a lot of grief for NOT wearing a headset?

You seem to have nailed this one. I got out my trusty copy of Sal Maiorana's "Relentless", which has recaps of every game though 1994. In the writeup for that game: Giants linebacker Lawrence Taylor: "During the game, he (Bills tackle Rick Schulte) would hold me, throw me down and when I would try to get up, he'd knock me down again. He got on my nerves and I came up swinging and I started to concentrate on him. It was frustrating, especially when you don't see any flags, but you should expect that in a game like this." I remember the Giants being especially poorly prepared for that strike. One of their other strike games, they got stomped by the 49ers. Late in the game, Bill Walsh started running the option and Parcells was seen on the other sideline pointing at Walsh and laughing his butt off. They also had a scab WR make a play that was later voted the best catch ever on Monday Night Football; the guy (Lewis Bennett) had just a handful of catches during the strike, and wound up in prison for murdering his wife.

IIRC, Bruce used sleep apnea as a defense in a DUI case. He fell asleep in his car...while it was running...at an intersection. And I believe his defense was successful.

Okay, first off, I made a mistake and I'll own up to it. I have a tendency to get long-winded and I sliced a longer comment into something that clearly came across a little harsh. One of the reasons why I shortened it was because I have commented here several times on ASU players. I felt like I repeated myself about 8 times on Vontaze Burfict, and was approaching the same number with Osweiler. One of the prices we pay for having a vibrant discussion with what seems like millions of participants is that each and every one of us skips 90% of the comments here. Discussions are absolutely teeming with redundancy. Almost every single time I click on a topic intending to type a response, someone has beaten me to the exact same idea. As a result, I have been a member for two and a half years and have well less than 200 comments. In the spirit of being polite, I'll copy and paste my comment about Osweiler from January 8th: "...physically, the only knock I'd put on him is he could release the ball a little higher, which doesn't mean much at his height. But I have seen him throw a few passes with contrails coming out of them. And his mobility is more than good enough for the NFL. The issue is how fast he can adapt. In one of our old threads about Fitz's viability, San Jose Fan reminded me of the concept of "ceiling". Brock has a high one, and if it is true that he is looking at rounds 3 to 5, he is worth the Bills taking a chance on. Seen a lot of both him and Foles, and while I concede that Foles might be better equipped to step in and not make a fool of himself in his first year, Osweiler probably will be better 3 years down the road." To follow up on that: first, we all now know that without doing a darn thing, he has shot up almost everyone's draft board...this happened even before the all-star games. Why this happens with any player might be a worthwhile discussion, but not here and now. But it did, so to update what I said, YES YES YES I'd pick him in rounds 3 to 5. I do like him. I am absolutely dead set against taking a QB (other than Luck or RG3) earlier than the 3rd round, so today I cannot imagine Brock Osweiler as a Bill. Now here's my problem: I could have easily ignored fair criticism about Osweiler. But what you wrote was not fair and doesn't bear any resemblance to what I have seen with my own two eyes...nor to what ANY EXPERTS are saying. Osweiler has an odd throwing motion. It is not a slow throwing motion. In my opinion, a coach who messes with it is a fool. He also has PLUS arm strength. If there were a chance of the two of us crossing paths, I'd make a friendly wager with you that when Brock goes to the combine, he will be evaluated as having a STRONGER throwing arm than all the brand-name QBs...Luck, Griffin (who I think the world of, and promoted on this board well over a year before most of you even heard of him), Foles, Tannehill, Weeden. All the names. There may be some QB out there with a bazooka who is hiding under a rock, but out of all the guys we get to see on the tube, he will be at the top in strength. I'd absolutely bet on it. I also will tell you right now his arm is CONSIDERABLY better than Barkley's. Jones, I'd have to see more of. Some here think he is a dump-off specialist. Doesn't mean he has a weak arm. I'd go look at clips if he were coming out, but since he isn't... Now that's me being polite. Both of us made further comments in that old Osweiler thread...I'll leave it to the oldtimers to decide whether it was even worth it for you to start another one...you made one that again claimed there is something wrong with the kid's arm, and also took a shot at Gailey. My 2nd comment, which similar to yesterday's was abrupt and not overly polite, was a reply to something we see here constantly: the guy who says "pick your QB NOWNOWNOW" or it's variation, "don't pass up a franchise QB". You referred to my comment as gutless, but I think these are the most gutless, silly, nonsensical comments we see. Don't name the guy you want. Ignore that the two best will clearly be gone by the time our slot comes up. Ignore the history of failure from reaching for a QB (Losman, anybody?). And most importantly, ignoring that the Bills defense for the last several years could be used as an effective substitute for ipecac. So to wrap it up, I'd just say that I am a little bit sorry if I offended you with my prior comment. Just a tiny, wee little bit. That's all.

As someone who has seen almost every snap this kid has taken, I can say you don't have the slightest idea what you are talking about.

See, the problem I have with comments like this is you expertly cover your behind. You give us the emphatic "GET A QUARTERBACK", but you didn't name the one you want and you prefaced it by saying "if you are sold on a guy". You talk about being bold, but you aren't. Put your butt on the line and TELL US THE NAME of the franchise QB WHO WILL BE AVAILABLE with the 10th pick. I've seen this game being played here for YEARS. (For the record, I've been around...off and on, sometimes just monitoring...since about 1999, not just since July 2009.)

I agree with both of you; physically, the only knock I'd put on him is he could release the ball a little higher, which doesn't mean much at his height. But I have seen him throw a few passes with contrails coming out of them. And his mobility is more than good enough for the NFL. The issue is how fast he can adapt. In one of our old threads about Fitz's viability, San Jose Fan reminded me of the concept of "ceiling". Brock has a high one, and if it is true that he is looking at rounds 3 to 5, he is worth the Bills taking a chance on. Seen a lot of both him and Foles, and while I concede that Foles might be better equipped to step in and not make a fool of himself in his first year, Osweiler probably will be better 3 years down the road.

I'm an ASU fan who watches as many of their games as I can on TV or web streams, and I was MASSIVELY disappointed with Burfict. He definitely looked slower to me this year, and his attitude is not good. Constantly getting personal fouls. The past two years they were almost all for continuing to push and shove after the whistle. This year, he added b!tching at the refs to his repertoire. I suggested in an earlier thread about Burfict that maybe he belongs at DE; I think his mentality and skill set are better suited to just turning him loose on QBs. Coverage doesn't look like it will ever be a strong point so if he stays at MLB, he might be just a 1st and 2nd down guy. No earthly way I'd consider him with the 10th pick...and without knowing what free agency will bring, I absolutely want that pick to go for defense. We can find better than this guy.

I don't particularly love what Stevie did; if it were me, I'd spike the ball and move on. BUT...I reached a point years ago where I am more tired of people complaining about this stuff. By rule, it may have deserved a penalty. The rule should be changed. It was a completely harmless act. There should be three considerations when making an excessive celebration call: 1st, does it delay the game. 2nd, was it done to deliberately provoke a reaction from the other team. And 3rd, was it profane. As far as I am concerned, everything else is fair game. I am not entirely convinced he was benched, either. He has been banged up the whole year, and it is possible that the coaches planned to give him the rest of the day off once he broke 1,000 yards. I certainly wouldn't assume he was being punished just because Randy Cross says so.

You're getting one side of the story here. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if they asked for the million for just one game, at Nebraska, with no return match. Probably didn't expect anything like that for a home-and-home. The article implies otherwise, but falls far short of coming straight out and saying it. It looked an awful lot like what well-crafted Nebraska propaganda might look like. I'm an ASU fan; I went there in the mid '90s and once saw ASU beat the living daylights out of Boise State. BSU was one of those road-kill schools back then. 5 years later, they turned it around to such an extent that ASU poached their coach (deja vu all over again). That coach, Dirk Koetter, lasted six years in Tempe; he gave a neat little exit interview where he said that from the outside, ASU looked a whole lot more appealing than it was in reality. I wonder if he played that old joke on Dennis Erickson by leaving three envelopes in his desk. About tonight's game: I commented the other day about how negatively I have come to feel about Burfict, and this game certainly backed that up. Moore looked like a 3rd or 4th rounder to me; he makes great decisions, but the arm isn't what NFL scouts want from a high draft pick. Gerell Robinson looked like someone the Bills could use, but I have heard that he doesn't have great stop-watch speed. So that would be a later pick. The BSU RB looked good, but that isn't a position of need for the Bills. The only ASU defender I like is the LB Colin Parker, and he seems like he's a tweener, like Bryan Scott. I'd have more interest in the BSU defensive coaching staff than any of their individual players. ASU's season has been practically a clone of the Bills'. They both got off to great starts and beat a big rival (NE and USC) for the first time in about a decade. They both last won a game the same weekend. They both have been incomprehensibly bad on defense. ASU had a game up in Pullman that if you didn't know better you'd have thought they only had 8 men on the field. The next day, the Bills defense looked just as feckless against the Cowboys. It hasn't been a good two months for me. Also a Mets fan. yay.

I'm an ASU fan; I have seen at least 80% of their games since Burfict has been there. I wouldn't touch him with a 100 foot pole. He has the emotional maturity of a 3 year old. He is a penalty magnet. He also was almost invisible this entire season, a MAJOR regression from the previous two years. Another commenter suggested he was injured; this is the first I've heard of it. If I were him, I'd stay in school. If I were his new coach, I'd move him to defensive end. Even when he was playing well, his coverage skills weren't special. I might very well have been the first person on this message board to bring up Robert Griffin III; I'd guess my first mention was 14 or 15 months ago. I have had a very high opinion of him for a LONG time. Wouldn't mind seeing him on the Bills. But I wouldn't use their first pick on him. This team has an atrocious defense. It is absolutely imperative that there is an upgrade in talent at DE and OLB. The only way I can see drafting Griffin (and ditching Fitz) would be if they filled those holes in free agency and then everything broke right for them on draft day: trade down for more picks while Griffin stays on the board long enough to be around whenever their spot comes up. As an ASU fan, I also keep an eye on the other Pac-12 teams. Barkley had a terrific year, but he just is not special talent-wise. I think he is going to drop in the rankings when they start measuring him and working him out. He doesn't look as big as he is listed. He has rather average arm strength, and isn't especially mobile. I wouldn't draft him in the 1st round, period. I'm not saying he'll be a crap pro; I just don't think he has special skills.

I think rather than shrinking stadium capacity, they ought to change the model for single game ticket sales. It could work somewhat like e-bay, where you could buy them outright for the listed price with a deadline to do so; let's say for argument's sake the deadline is three weeks before the game. At that point, it becomes like an e-bay auction, which would end, let's say, 6 days before the game. Then, the process could start again, with another cutoff on the thursday before the game. They could reserve their right to the blackout, but it would be changed so that it would be based on if they can recoup through the auctions 90% of the listed value of the tickets that remained on that starting date of three weeks before the game. The good thing about this plan would be more full stadiums; the teams might like it because of the possibility that high demand might drive prices above the figure printed on them. I am sure if anything like this happened, they'd figure out a way to make more money with handling charges and probably a nominal fee for entering the auction. Er, being that this is the NFL, nominal might have been the wrong word to use. But I think the point is the same.

I can't say for certain; I tend to watch very casually when it isn't the Bills. My recollection is that he made plays on the outside, but I don't know that that's where he lined up. I do know he was an outside guy at ASU; he reminded me a lot of Moulds. They often would just heave it in his direction and hope he made a play, and often he did. I would expect that he will be chasing kick returners more than anything else; I don't think I am going too far on a limb here, but I'd bet on mostly 3-wide sets with Johnson, Nelson, and Roosevelt plus Chandler at TE. These are the guys who earned it. Everyone else is depth.

I am an Arizona State guy, and am pretty familiar with Hagan. He spent the last couple years with the Giants (my TV market) and filled in quite well when they had a bunch of injuries. He also did a solid job on special teams. I was going to come on here and advocate signing him and dumping Ruvell Martin after the Raiders released Hagan. Now that the injuries have hit, they need both. The Raiders apparently dumped him because Hue Jackson never wanted him but Crazy Dead Al forced Hagan on him. Not the way to make a team. Going back further, Derek was a stud at ASU. He piled up huge numbers and looked like a surefire 1st rounder...then, he went to the Senior Bowl and dropped everything thrown to him. I was stunned at the time; he always had good hands with ASU. He is big, he fights for the ball, and he runs well after the catch. Miami still liked him enough to use a 2nd on him, but he continued to have too many drops there and they dumped him. Like I said, he did pretty well with the Giants. I was surprised they didn't re-sign him after losing Steve Smith. I like the guy, but don't expect much unless there are even more injuries. I'd guess he will prevent us from ever seeing Martin on offense, but he'll still be behind Roosevelt and Aiken.

You'll get no argument from me on this. Doesn't mean being slow won't hurt his draft position, though. A little research leads me to believe that 5 flat won't hurt Foles specifically; he is a big, thick dude. Above 5.2 and it might become an issue. Above 5.0 for a small-to-normal sized guy like Barkley...that's a whole 'nother story. And more food for thought: many of these guys are going to shrink. The big guys like Foles, Tannehill, and Luck have no reason to lie about how tall they are. Griffin, Barkley, and Keenum...we'll see.

I agree with your assessments of Tannehill and Griffin; I like them both. I also was iffy on Newton, and I still view him a bit cautiously...his team stinks, and some of his stats are meaningless because of this. Plus, he still is scarily self absorbed. BUT...you really overplay the bits about the conferences and schedules. The SEC has 4 or 5 big swinging Jaurons . Not all of them are great every year. And the rest of the conference is ordinary. And since it's split in two, most of the time a school winds up with only one or two heavy hitters on their slate. Many SEC schools compensate for their perceived high level of competition by under-scheduling their non-conference games; it is VERY common in that conference to see a school with all-home/all-tomato-can non-conference games. So even in the toughest conference, the schedules aren't all that tough. It was not long ago...might have been Stevie's junior or senior year...that Kentucky won 7 games and went to a bowl game without beating a single decent team. I think the quality of the SEC is above the others, just because of the sheer number of 800-lb gorillas you are dealing with. But it still isn't that much better than the others. There is pretty much no difference between the Pac and Big 12s. Even though there are more ranked teams in the Big 12, the non-conference garbage games are still carrying too much weight. And even if one conference is better, it really doesn't prove much for an individual player. It could just as well be pointed out that one QB might have better offensive teammates. People should take schedules into consideration down the road. For now, I just watch the guys and judge how they deal with the moment. I like Foles; he's very poised, and he's in a rough spot right now with that team. But the 4th might be high for any team to take him...especially the Bills. Chan likes mobility, and I will be surprised if Foles breaks 5 seconds in the 40 at the combine.

I want to thank you for finding this and posting it here. RIP, Kent.

I like both of the QBs from that game today a LOT; can't see either of them as Bills, though. I think both of them will be long gone by the 32nd pick . In all seriousness, I could see both of them going very high next year. I'd value them WAY above Barkley; they have stronger arms and can run circles around him. I could see Jerry Jones over-drafting one of them to replace the bumbling Romo. He ain't gonna get a shot at Luck, and Romo is in need of a change of scenery. I just turned on Luck's game on VS; our old friend Glenn Parker is announcing the game. And another team is wearing embarrassingly bad uniforms...Washington St is all gray; they look like they've been rolling around in ashes.

No, it was definitely Marv.

I was trying to remember the circumstances of Bell's departure and kept making a connection to the strike; I retrieved my copy of "Relentless" and discovered there really wasn't one. Bell had been injured before the strike. The team stayed mostly unified; Riddick, Seals, McKeller, and a couple nobodies crossed the line, but the rest of the team stuck together. Early on, Smerlas, Joe Devlin, Bell, and others tried to intimidate the scabs at a hotel the team put them up in. Devlin had a big dog with him, and Bell pointed to a replacement player and said, "Sic 'em". The hotel kicked them out. Shortly after the strike, Bell said he was ready to play. They told him to stay home. The big trade happened a couple days after that. Bell had two excellent years with the Rams...both over a thousand yards, and 33 TDs combined. For some reason he went to the Raiders the following year, didn't accomplish anything, and that was that. On results, Bell ranks WAY down on the list of best Bills RBs; he had the talent to rank much higher. I think he was one of those superficial nitwits who wanted to play under the bright lights, and turned off his teammates. If he had been patient, he could have had Thurman's career.

The only thing that's missing is a mullet.

I used to have that same tie...but I never, ever, EVER would have owned a pair of those Zubaz pants.

I'm inclined to agree with most of your post, but would add that dumping Smith was a little more complicated than just chalking it up to performance. My recollection...anyone who remembers better is welcome to correct me...is that Smith regularly showed up to training camp out of shape. I think that regime got frustrated with him, and also thought he didn't contribute in the passing game. I can remember charting plays for a preseason game in that era...I did this on a hunch...and the results showed that they had about a 50/50 mix of pass/run when Jonathon Linton was in the game. But when Antowain Smith was on the field, they ran something like 13 out of 15 plays. I thought Wade and crew got fed up with him and set him up to fail. Ironically, he and Flutie were unleashed the last game of the year and both had their best game as Bills in their last one.